Canada SPY 7 vs RMAs for the CSC River Class Destroyer

DAVEBLOGGINS

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Canadian Surface Combatant (CSC)

SPY-7 vs RMAs for the CSC River Class Destroyer:

On the topic of the number of RMA in the different SPY-7 radar variants ...
I note a user by the name "Milspec_1967" wrote in a German language forum (German language reference
: https://forum-sicherheitspolitik.org/showthread.php?tid=5492&pid=242434#pid242434 ) : "SPY-7(V)1 that will go on Canada's CSC River Class Destroyers uses 9 RMA's and SPY-7(V)2 that will go on Spain's F110 Class uses 12 RMA's." (Google translation)

That was partly corrected by user by the handle "Ottone" ( German language reference:
https://forum-sicherheitspolitik.org/showthread.php?tid=5492&pid=242472#pid242472 ) who stated: "Not correct: SPY-7(V) 3 comes on the Canadian River class and is the smallest variant, while SPY-7(V)1 was ordered by Japan and represents the largest maritime configuration." (Google translation)

I have no idea as to where user "Milspec_1967" obtained his numbers of RMAs from. Given the names of the variant SPY-7 (v)1 was inaccurate in Milspec_1967's initial post (where (V3) that was added later noted as a correction by user Ottone), I don't know whether to believe such. Further, no references were provided at all!! So, I would take all of this, with a strong "grain of salt" with regard to RMA numbers for each SPY 7 variant (Japanese Mogami Class, Spanish F-110 Class & the CSC River Class Destroyers).

DID CANADA CHOOSE THE WRONG AESA RADAR?
On another note: on the website "Quora" (see below), it has been reported (with very little substantiation, I might add) that the Raytheon SPY 6 (V1) AESA radar was far and away a superior radar vs Lockheed Martin's (LMs) SPY 7 (V1). This seems to be two rival companies trying to upstage each other to obtain a contract for the German 127 Frigates AESA radar to be built. Did Canada buy the wrong radar? If indeed the SPY 7 (V3) first three (Batch I) CSC River Class Destroyers will have 9 RMAs, (Batch II) CSC River Class Destroyers may have more (at least as many as the Japanese SPY 7 (V 1). I still believe the RCN got a much better deal with the LM SPY 7 (V3/V1) vs the Raytheon SPY 6 (V 1).


https://musingsonnavalmatters.quora.com/https-www-quora-com-AN-SPY-6-VS-AN-SPY-7-Which-radar-is-better-and-why-did-the-US-Navy-choose-AN-SPY-6-answer-JS-Squid#:~:text=%C2%B7%20Jan%2030-,AN%2FSPY%2D6%20VS%20AN%2FSPY%2D7%20Which,)%2C%20competing%20companies%20at%20that
 
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oldcpu

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... partly corrected by user by the handle "Ottone" ( German language reference: https://forum-sicherheitspolitik.org/showthread.php?tid=5492&pid=242472#pid242472 ) who stated: "Not correct: SPY-7(V) 3 comes on the Canadian River class and is the smallest variant, while SPY-7(V)1 was ordered by Japan and represents the largest maritime configuration." (Google translation)

.... I would take all of this, with a strong "grain of salt" with regard to RMA numbers for each SPY 7 variant (Japanese Mogami Class, Spanish F-110 Class & the CSC River Class Destroyers).

In a December 2023 article, Naval News purportedly reported that Japan’s ASEV would likely use a rotating SPY-7 configuration rather than fixed-face arrays. I have not seen that article, and I suspect that is speculation at this stage (still ??? ) .

I note it purportedly states the ASEV and not the Japanese Mogami Class. Rather Mogami class are anticipated to have a different air search radar (possibly the OPY-2 AESA radar - according to a wiki article - although I wonder if that wiki article is also inaccurate and the Mogami class air-search a different radar entirely).

There is some confusion there - I for one don't know which is accurate.

Further, I was also told that Janes Defence has covered Japan’s ASEV program extensively, where purportedly it noted that the SPY-7(V)1 for Japan could be adapted for rotational operation. I have not seen the article myself.

Following on that, I read that Defense News & Janes (2023–2024) purportedly reports that Canada’s SPY-7(V)3 is a four-face system, distinct from the three-face (V)2 used by the U.S. Navy. I have not seen this article myself. So if accurate I then speculate that Canada's River Class SPY-7(V)3 may have four fixed faces with 9 x RMA each (total ~36 RMA). Obviously - speculation by me.

There is also speculation that Spain's F-110 SPY-7(V)2 has 3 fixed faces, which if accurate could mean 12 x RMA each, possibly totaling ~36 RMA.

In the case of Japan's ASEV, if rotating, that could mean that even less a number are needed for Japan's ASEV. Obviously - speculation. But it brings into question the earlier assertions that I read (and I copied) that the SPY-7(V)1 ordered by Japan will represents the largest maritime configuration. Perhaps it won't be.

This will be interesting to watch as more information is forthcoming.

It is difficult to be accurate on this subject, when relying on different internet sources.
 
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DAVEBLOGGINS

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In a December 2023 article, Naval News purportedly reported that Japan’s ASEV would likely use a rotating SPY-7 configuration rather than fixed-face arrays. I have not seen that article, and I suspect that is speculation at this stage (still ??? ) .

I note it purportedly states the ASEV and not the Japanese Mogami Class. Rather Mogami class are anticipated to have a different air search radar (possibly the OPY-2 AESA radar - according to a wiki article - although I wonder if that wiki article is also inaccurate and the Mogami class air-search a different radar entirely).

There is some confusion there - I for one don't know which is accurate.

Further, I was also told that Janes Defence has covered Japan’s ASEV program extensively, where purportedly it noted that the SPY-7(V)1 for Japan could be adapted for rotational operation. I have not seen the article myself.

Following on that, I read that Defense News & Janes (2023–2024) purportedly reports that Canada’s SPY-7(V)3 is a four-face system, distinct from the three-face (V)2 used by the U.S. Navy. I have not seen this article myself. So if accurate I then speculate that Canada's River Class SPY-7(V)3 may have four fixed faces with 9 x RMA each (total ~36 RMA). Obviously - speculation by me.

There is also speculation that Spain's F-110 SPY-7(V)2 has 3 fixed faces, which if accurate could mean 12 x RMA each, possibly totaling ~36 RMA.

In the case of Japan's ASEV, if rotating, that could mean that even less a number are needed for Japan's ASEV. Obviously - speculation. But it brings into question the earlier assertions that I read (and I copied) that the SPY-7(V)1 ordered by Japan will represents the largest maritime configuration. Perhaps it won't be.

This will be interesting to watch as more information is forthcoming.

It is difficult to be accurate on this subject, when relying on different internet sources.
Hello 'oldcpu'. This is the first time I have heard that LM is developing a SPY 7 rotating SPY 7 configuration rather than fixed phased arrays. Everything I have read on the Lockheed Martin SPY 7 (V1, V2, & V3) from the beginning only mentions the fixed phased array systems. I would therefore take the Naval News article from 2023 with a strong grain of "rumour only". Cheers!
 

oldcpu

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Not specific to RMA, but I note:


This is just one of a few news sources which are noting the AN/TPY-6 radar, deployed in Guam, is very close to being the same as the AN/SPY-7 radar for Japan, Canada and Spain.

Further I note a Lockheed marketing link,

Where Lockheed Martin, in that marketing link note:

Our TPY-6 radar is built on the same cutting-edge radar technology as SPY-7. It uses the common Subarray Suite (SAS) radar building blocks as LRDR and all of our SPY-7 programs. Formally named the “AN/TPY-6” - where the “T” denotes the “Transportable” nature of the system according to the US DoD nomenclature (The “S” in SPY-7 is for “Water” or “Sea-based.”) With its 24/7 multi-mission capability, TPY-6 will revolutionize the defense landscape in Guam.

Lockheed Martin go on to note:

Lockheed Martin supported the Missile Defense Agency in conducting a Live Fire Test event in December 2025 where TPY-6 integrated with Aegis, and successfully engaged a Mid-Range Ballistic Missile target using a SM-3 Block IIA interceptor.

EDIT: I note an USNI article (dated 10-may-2025) stated Guam will have a version of AN/TPY-6 four-sided phased array radar. I did not see any references to how many RMA in each face.
 
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DAVEBLOGGINS

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Not specific to RMA, but I note:


This is just one of a few news sources which are noting the AN/TPY-6 radar, deployed in Guam, is very close to being the same as the AN/SPY-7 radar for Japan, Canada and Spain.

Further I note a Lockheed marketing link,

Where Lockheed Martin, in that marketing link note:



Lockheed Martin go on to note:



EDIT: I note an USNI article (dated 10-may-2025) stated Guam will have a version of AN/TPY-6 four-sided phased array radar. I did not see any references to how many RMA in each face.
Hello "oldcpu". Yes indeed the Lockheed Martin/MDA Long Range Discrimination Radar (LRDR) is based in the LM SPY 7 Radar Technology and is a massive undertaking by both LM/MDA & US. Although they do not say how many MRAs are in each 4-sided Phased Array Assembly blocks, each block is 60 feet by 60 feet so I would think at least a few hundred RMAs minimum each, as can be seen by the pictures of the ones in Alaska & Guam (Just a "few" more than either the SPY 7 (V1, V2 V3) ships or even the new SPY 6 (V1) on the Arleigh Burke Block III ships. There is a picture of part of the inside of an assembly array. These Ground Based LRDR Radars (GBRs) are strictly for BMD to protect the US and part of DTs "Golden Dome" project which Canada is "considering" joining. The IDIOT in the WH has said recently that Canada's costs would be somewhere around $61 Billion US (over $84 Billion CDN) but would cost us nothing as the 51st state (take that with a grain of salt)!! This system has already been successfully tested between Guam & Alaska and the technology has been proven by both LM/MDA. There are also videos on line of the process from initial launch to missile destruction. "If" Canada were to join the Golden Dome program, I suspect the River Class Destroyers (RCDs) would also have this BMD capability. These Arrays would most likely have some powerful cooling generation to keep the system going.
 

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oldcpu

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I attempted to learn more about the AN/SPY-7 and its modules, and have not been very successful thus far, as the unclassified sources (and I looked at more than a few) tend to contradict each other in terms of dimensions and weight (and to a lessor extent functionality). One area where I did find concurrence is Raytheon's AN/SPY-6's building block modules are typically referred to as RMAs (Radar Module Assembly's) while Lockheed Martin's AN/SPY-7's conceptually similar modules are typically referred to as "SAS" ( Subarray Suite ). However when it comes to dimensions, weight, and functionality, I was surprised at the divergence of unclassified source assessments. This has me questioning the accuracy of the current unclassified estimates of the 'RMA' in both the planned Canadian and Spanish warships (given "RMA" is not a Lockheed Martin terminology).
 
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oldcpu

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https://news.yahoo.co.jp/expert/articles/81e965776959d5312208e6b7f8edc824b94ac25e ... this is a link to a Japanese language yahoo article on the AN/SPY-7 japan is procuring, and after conducting a Google translation, it is one of the articles that have lead me to question ( by deduction and extrapolation) the previous information (that I helped dig up) on the AN/SPY-7 implementation on the River Class destroyer.
 

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