TR Anka-III ¦ KizilElma | UAV/UCAV Programs

Test7

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Big Boy Optics, anyone able to ID it ?
View attachment 53263

it looks like an Mx -25 variant with an extra sensor integrated..


also, these guys are from mr. Haluk's office

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Radonsider

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By the way, was the TB3 given to Baykar through a tender? Because Tusaş has more advanced technology and know-how. It is also a state organization, a significant part of the money remains in the state.
i think TB-3 project was started by Baykar itself, as a "what could we do?"
 

Radonsider

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We should keep in mind that sadly these projects are not because of state or government, but companies and their leading team.


it is sad to see that most of aviation projects are not state funded
 

Yasar

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By the way, was the TB3 given to Baykar through a tender? Because Tusaş has more advanced technology and know-how. It is also a state organization, a significant part of the money remains in the state.
If our state or private defence companies were to wait for tenders before they started research and development of new platforms, we wouldn’t be able to get anywhere.
All companies need to know how to take initiative and develop platforms like these.
Hurjet was the same. All produced with Tusas‘s own finances. Now they have a definite order of 4 planes.
No one asked Baykar to produce the Kizilelma. They knew they had to produce it to keep their edge in the marketplace.
Tusas doesn’t have a small enough UCAV like TB2 that has proven itself, upon which a version of a more advanced UCAV with a possibility of naval use can be developed. Neither Anka nor Aksungur can be suitable for the end use Baykar is contemplating for TB3.
 

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Aksugur was not a tender project to either, or Anka 3.
Is it the same thing? We're not talking about classic drones. If such a need arose after the F35, or an idea emerged, all the companies involved in this business and the SSB would sit down and talk. In Mius, it is called TCG Anadolu, there is a lack of planning and a fait accompli. Classic Turkish business...
 

Baryshx

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If our state or private defence companies were to wait for tenders before they started research and development of new platforms, we wouldn’t be able to get anywhere.
All companies need to know how to take initiative and develop platforms like these.
Hurjet was the same. All produced with Tusas‘s own finances. Now they have a definite order of 4 planes.
No one asked Baykar to produce the Kizilelma. They knew they had to produce it to keep their edge in the marketplace.
Tusas doesn’t have a small enough UCAV like TB2 that has proven itself, upon which a version of a more advanced UCAV with a possibility of naval use can be developed. Neither Anka nor Aksungur can be suitable for the end use Baykar is contemplating for TB3.
Why doesn't Tusaş make an drones like the tb2, because there is no need, it already exists. It can even be done for competition, but it is a matter of budget, needs and priorities. But the TCG Anadolu and the ship-launched iha project is a new project in the world, so I said that the parties should sit down and draw a plan and a framework.
 
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Hasanrize

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We should keep in mind that sadly these projects are not because of state or government, but companies and their leading team.


it is sad to see that most of aviation projects are not state funded
It is good in the sense that those engineers can try to do their best instead of dealing with unrealistic and generally purposeless requirements from the army. Another thing is armies tend to be conservative in many areas, and their leaders are often elderly (elderly mean even more stubborn) commanders. However, young engineers are often quite progressive (not in political means) minded people. We can even see the difference between Force-to-Force, where Ground Forces choose WW2-era tanks over modern ones just because they have heavy in their name, while Navy even considers unmanned submarines. There was a US general who fought against his Force to install drone weapons.

If not for Baykar, who would think of the Kızılelma Concept in the Turkish Army? Or, if not for TUSAŞ, who would think deep-strike stealth UAV concept? We can think of the same for TCG Anadolu; ultimately, it was the idea of some engineers in SSB to turn it into a drone carrier (although that invention came from desperation). If that left conservative ideas of some old general that might float around empty, waiting for the US to approve F-35Bs somewhere in the future.
 

Bogeyman 

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We should keep in mind that sadly these projects are not because of state or government, but companies and their leading team.


it is sad to see that most of aviation projects are not state funded
In fact, it is a very good thing for companies to initiate projects on their own initiative without the government's bid. Because when you sign a contract, TAF can get very involved in what you do and how you do it. While this is sometimes a good thing, no one wants to experience a Anka disaster again. The Anka project started in TAI at the beginning of 2005. And due to Hvkk's constantly putting forward different needs, it only came out of the hangar in 2010. And only in 2013 he was able to sign a serial production contract. After exactly 8 years from the beginning of the project, it was only able to enter the inventory.

On the other hand, the fact that companies are a little more independent from TAF in the projects they develop seems to have increased the pace of progress of the projects. We can now see the scale model of Anka-3 flying in 1.5 years.
 

MADDOG

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In fact, it is a very good thing for companies to initiate projects on their own initiative without the government's bid. Because when you sign a contract, TAF can get very involved in what you do and how you do it. While this is sometimes a good thing, no one wants to experience a Anka disaster again. The Anka project started in TAI at the beginning of 2005. And due to Hvkk's constantly putting forward different needs, it only came out of the hangar in 2010. And only in 2013 he was able to sign a serial production contract. After exactly 8 years from the beginning of the project, it was only able to enter the inventory.

On the other hand, the fact that companies are a little more independent from TAF in the projects they develop seems to have increased the pace of progress of the projects. We can now see the scale model of Anka-3 flying in 1.5 years.
Hürkuş is another example of this.
 

boredaf

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If such a need arose after the F35, or an idea emerged, all the companies involved in this business and the SSB would sit down and talk.
I have no idea what you're trying to say here.

There was a need as we are about to get a ship capable of launching aircraft but no aircraft to launch from it and an idea emerged in the form of taking one of the most successful UAV's in the world, TB-2, and creating a new version that can be used from TCG Anadolu with heavier payload.

What you suggested in your posts would lead to something getting designed from scratch and would take way too long at the end.
 

what

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We should keep in mind that sadly these projects are not because of state or government, but companies and their leading team.


it is sad to see that most of aviation projects are not state funded

I think it's good. They are investing and creating products, without being dependent on government orders or subsidies.
Its the ultimate goal, after all, they should be self-sufficient without subsidies from the government for decades.

If they deem the market (Turkey and export) good, they will develop the product and take the risk.
 

Kedikesenfare

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Hürkuş is another example of this.
Over the last 3 years, I've witnessed many people from very different parts of the political spectrum criticizing the military for its way of handling and communicating it needs with the industry. Both private and state companies are put in difficult positions due to this unpredictable behavior.

We always debate over changes in the industry and governmental procurement agencies to become more efficient and cost-effective.

I think it's high time that we talk about the shortcomings of some military organizations, too, which play a crucial role without turning this into a battleground for competing ideologies.

I'm saying this from a very nonpolitical rather pragmatic point of view because the industry urgently needs the input of the military. It's extremely valuable and they have to work together. There's a natural link between the two sides.

However, I feel like TSK needs to work on its feedback skills and longterm visions. They cause unnecessary and expensive delays. It can't be that you change important requirements literally mid-air setting back the process for years.

The more professional our military becomes the more professional our industry is going to be. As civilians, we can influence und support the military institutions to create a spillover effect which will benefit the entire nation.

We need to do this without politics, in a calm and rational manner.
 

Tonyukuk

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Over the last 3 years, I've witnessed many people from very different parts of the political spectrum criticizing the military for its way of handling and communicating it needs with the industry. Both private and state companies are put in difficult positions due to this unpredictable behavior.

We always debate over changes in the industry and governmental procurement agencies to become more efficient and cost-effective.

I think it's high time that we talk about the shortcomings of some military organizations, too, which play a crucial role without turning this into a battleground for competing ideologies.

I'm saying this from a very nonpolitical rather pragmatic point of view because the industry urgently needs the input of the military. It's extremely valuable and they have to work together. There's a natural link between the two sides.

However, I feel like TSK needs to work on its feedback skills and longterm visions. They cause unnecessary and expensive delays. It can't be that you change important requirements literally mid-air setting back the process for years.

The more professional our military becomes the more professional our industry is going to be. As civilians, we can influence und support the military institutions to create a spillover effect which will benefit the entire nation.

We need to do this without politics, in a calm and rational manner.
The current political climate also impacts this. Not only the political divisions, but also the fact that the military has been somewhat cut off from having influence of their own. Military staff are refraining from being proactive in many ways including giving feedback to the defence industry because they know that it can land them in trouble. Surprisingly there is still a lot of distrust between the military and the government. For instance, the military was not allowed to help residents effected by the forest fires last year. Also Erdoğan hasn't attended a military parade in around 7 years, nor allowed them to parade with combat vehicles.

Back to the topic, I think we will see Anka 3 very soon.
 
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