Korea Foreign Defence Cooperation

[Test7]

On Tuesday, South Korean defense contractor Hanwha has announced that it signed a major agreement with the U.S. military on collaborative research and development of key defense items and technologies.

According to a company news release, the Cooperative Research and Development Agreement (CRADA) was signed by the US Army Combat Capabilities Development Command Armaments Center (DEVCOM AC) and Hanwha’s two defense business affiliates _ Hanwha Corporation and Hanwha Defense.

The CRADA is a cooperative mechanism that enables a US Government activity to work with academia, industry, and other non-government entities on research and development. Hanwha is the first Korean company to enter into this type of agreement with the US Army.


“This is a historic and exciting opportunity,” said Retired US Army Lieutenant General Bernard Champoux, head of Hanwha’s US defense operations. Champoux had served as commander of the 8th US Army. “It not only acknowledges the quality of the Republic of Korea’s growing defense sector, but also further strengthens the bilateral US-ROK relationship and the Alliance.”

The agreement came as a result of the visit by a senior delegation from DEVCOM AC to South Korea in November 2019 for discussions with Hanwha. Both parties shared their interest in jointly developing capabilities for the US and other international military markets, with potential commercial spin-off applications.

Under the agreement framework, Hanwha and DEVCOM AC will conduct research and development of defense equipment and technologies through exchange of resources, technical expertise and intellectual properties. The outcomes of their joint projects will serve to greatly assist both countries’ needs for next-generation weapon and ammunition solutions.

Delegates from DEVCOM AC pose with officials of Hanwha Corporation while visiting Hanwha’s facility in Yeosu in November 2019.


For Hanwha, this agreement is yet another step in demonstrating its commitment to US defense stakeholders and the US economy by facilitating transfer of technologies that can be incorporated into the American industrial base.

The CRADA comes on the heels of Hanwha’s recent success in Australia’s high-profile army modernization programs, including LAND 400 and LAND 8116, for which Hanwha Defense-built Redback Next-Generation Infantry Fighting Vehicle and K9 Huntsman Self-Propelled Howitzer have been either shortlisted or nominated as preferred systems.

Hanwha Corporation has its foundation in the development and production of energetics with 68 years of accumulated expertise. The company is recognized for its modernized production of explosives propellants, and advanced precision guided munitions for the Republic of Korea and numerous allied nations.

U.S. military signs joint defense research pact with Hanwha

On Tuesday, South Korean defense contractor Hanwha has announced that it signed a major agreement with the U.S. military on collaborative research and development of key defense items and technologies. According to a company news release, the Cooperative Research and Development Agreement...

defence-blog.com

 

[TR_123456]

SEOUL, Sept. 22 (Yonhap) -- The top military officers of South Korea and Estonia held talks in Seoul on Thursday to discuss bilateral defense cooperation and regional security, Seoul's Joint Chiefs of Staff (JCS) said.

JCS Chairman Gen. Kim Seung-kyum met with Estonian Defense Forces Commander Lt. Gen. Martin Herem as the latter came here to attend DX Korea 2022, the ongoing defense exhibition that kicked off at the KINTEX exhibition center in Goyang, northwest of Seoul, on Wednesday.

Kim pointed out that unity among nations is "more important than ever before" given the "complicated" security landscape in the world. Herem called for continued bilateral cooperation.

Kim also asked for Estonia's continued support for Seoul's efforts to achieve denuclearization and lasting peace on the Korean Peninsula, according to JCS.

JCS Chairman Gen. Kim Seung-kyum (L) and Estonian Defense Forces Commander Lt. Gen. Martin Herem pose for a photo as they meet for talks in Seoul on Sept. 22, 2022, in this photo released by Kim's office. (PHOTO NOT FOR SALE) (Yonhap)

S. Korean, Estonian military chiefs hold talks on defense cooperation | Yonhap News Agency

SEOUL, Sept. 22 (Yonhap) -- The top military officers of South Korea and Estonia held talk...

en.yna.co.kr

 

[Windchime]

This thread is strictly for news and discussion regarding general export and foreign cooperation that cannot be posted in individual weapons systems threads. About the export of weapons themselves, please refer to their respective threads.

 

[Nilgiri]

We will also build on the Army’s modernisation programme – at pace. Specifically on artillery, I am accelerating our Mobile Fires Programme. So instead of delivering in the 2030s it will do this earlier this decade. I have also directed that, subject to commercial negotiation, an interim artillery capability is to be delivered.

UK defence contact of mine was telling me earlier that this will likely be addressed by UK by purchasing K9 from Korean stocks.

Stay tuned and I guess lets see.

 

[Chocopie]

K9 Team Thunder UK are lobbying hard, but there‘re many options for UK MoD.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1615352011867971584

UK could go for German RCH-155 (wheeled Boxer with 155 mm gun), Swedish Archer (owned by British BAE Systems) or French Caesar (albeit highly unlikely hahaha) as well.

 

[Nilgiri]

K9 Team Thunder UK are lobbying hard, but there‘re many options for UK MoD.

View attachment 52952

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1615352011867971584

UK could go for German RCH-155 (wheeled Boxer with 155 mm gun), Swedish Archer (owned by British BAE Systems) or French Caesar (albeit highly unlikely hahaha) as well.

Yes, but his reasoning is the wording used by UK Def Min lately regarding "interim" artillery capability need ....and the expedience regarding that now exacerbated by AS90 being sent to Ukraine.

i.e K9 is pretty much only one with available stocks at short notice implied by UK Def Min.

If that is what is acquired at short notice, the full capability production will most definitely be K9A2 at that point going forward.

 

[Chocopie]

Makes sense. Fast availability of similarly tracked PzH 2000 is questionable.

Would be lovely if „interim“ turns to „long-term“ once they get the taste of Korean K9

 

[MaciekRS]

There was some deal signed today regarding K2/K9 cooperation but they didnt say what exactly that deal was about.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1628783252952473613

 

[Chocopie]

There was some deal signed today regarding K2/K9 cooperation but they didnt say what exactly that deal was about.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1628783252952473613

Nothing spectacular according to this article:

During Lee’s visit, Hanwha Aerospace announced it had signed a contract with Polish defense company WB Group to equip Hanwha’s Chunmoo multiple rocket launch system (MLRS) with WB’s Polish command and control systems to meet Polish operational requirements.

A deal for Topaz integration of K239. Maybe for K2/K9 too, not mentioned in Link.

Defense chief Lee focuses on arms talks in Poland

Defense Minister Lee Jong-sup visited a Polish defense company in Warsaw on Wednesday, the first day of his three-day trip highlighting deepening defense ties between Korea and Poland, Korean defense officials said.

koreajoongangdaily.joins.com

 

[MaciekRS]

I dont think so, deal with WB was day or two earlier.

 

[MaciekRS]

Looks like another batch of K9, K2 and Chunmoo is really close to being signed.
Birds are singing about 149 K9PL to be delivered - 2026
K2 should also be not basic Korean K2 (from stock ) but this time K2 PL

End its official

Poland acquires more S. Korean howitzers

Poland plans to acquire six K9 self-propelled howitzers in 2025 and an additional 146 K9PL versions in 2026–2027.

tvpworld.com

"Under the agreement with Hanwha Defense, Poland will acquire another 6 self-propelled K9 howitzers in 2025 and 146 self-propelled howitzers of the K9PL version in 2026–2027, the agency said.
The contract also includes a training and logistics package and the delivery of a significant stock of 155mm ammunition, numbering tens of thousands of rounds, the agency said.

Poland will also receive technical documentation on the guns. In addition, maintenance, renovation, and modernization works will be set up, and selected howitzer parts will be produced by the Polish defense industry."

 

[Chocopie]

Looks like another batch of K9, K2 and Chunmoo is really close to being signed.
Birds are singing about 149 K9PL to be delivered - 2026
K2 should also be not basic Korean K2 (from stock ) but this time K2 PL

End its official

Poland acquires more S. Korean howitzers

Poland plans to acquire six K9 self-propelled howitzers in 2025 and an additional 146 K9PL versions in 2026–2027.

tvpworld.com

"Under the agreement with Hanwha Defense, Poland will acquire another 6 self-propelled K9 howitzers in 2025 and 146 self-propelled howitzers of the K9PL version in 2026–2027, the agency said.
The contract also includes a training and logistics package and the delivery of a significant stock of 155mm ammunition, numbering tens of thousands of rounds, the agency said.

Poland will also receive technical documentation on the guns. In addition, maintenance, renovation, and modernization works will be set up, and selected howitzer parts will be produced by the Polish defense industry."

The Polish defence community doesn't seem very happy about that deal. They would prefer producing more homegrown Krabs.

With the new center-left Polish government coming in, they'll cancel the domestic production and big orders for hundreds of K9PL and K2PL. Hanwha and Hyundai Rotem would have to shelf their expansion plans in Poland as a staging hub for the European market. The Germans will regain their dominant position with several new deals for Leo 2, RCH-155, Boxer AFV, Lynx IFV etc.

 

[MaciekRS]

Not really.
Yes, new government is coming but they already said that energy and military programs will continue. (I know that could change but for NOW they are rather supporting military deals)
And of course def community is not happy with K9, Krabs are better BUT
a) Our Krab production is too limited and they are going to Ukraine right now
b) those 300-400 K9 will be much quicker
There are talks abour ANOTHER 160 K9 deal

Germans and Leos are out.
K2 deal we'll see maybe even this week. We want to PRODUCE it at least in some way. If we couldnt produce and fully service those tanks then other option is Abrams. They are better then K2 and US is ready for full service center IF we buy at least 500 of them.

TIME is most important for us thats why Germans are out. New equipment should be ready in units by 2028.

 

[Chocopie]

Meant Germany regaining it’s dominant position in armored vehicle market throughout Europe.

Poland won‘t buy any German armor in the foreseeable future - that‘s for sure

 

[Chocopie]

Bro take it easy , there is no need for big brain to understand that USA want u to develop 5 gen and can give u the tech even free since u are allies agaist china , same with Taiwan . And both of US and S korea have big 00000 problems with each other the complete opposite with Turkiye which US support terrorists ypg to create terror country and devide Turkish land and even desteoyed our economy from closse 1 trillion in 2013 even now after 11 years we reach again 1.15 trillion .
Even President Trump itself said he wipl destroy our economy just because we catch a spy prist working with pkk.
- ( The remaining 20% was provided by domestic and foreign companies.[13]: 18  Korean Aerospace Industries (KAI) won the production bid, and partnered with Lockheed Martin for technological support.
- (Lockheed Martin agreed to transfer two dozen F-35A technologies as part of a purchase deal to S.korea.
-While even we pay money for f35 US dont deliver them .

-(AESA radar was co-developed with Hanwha Systems under the leadership of the ADD.[68][69] Elta Systems helped to test the prototype hardware)

- Saab provided technical advice to LIG Nex1, which develops Multi Function Radar ]

-IRST is based on the processor unit (PU) designed by Hanwha Systems and a Leonardo sensor]

-US aerospace contractor Texstars was selected by KAI to develop canopy and windshield transparencies for KF-X.

+ 6 other major western companies contribute heavily to build kf 21 .
I love S korea , we dont have any problem but that is reality . And i hope u distance from USA even u dont have any geo-political fight will US better to be indepedent than ass licker of USA .

First, Wikipedia is an unreliable source not accepted by academia and filled with false/fake/unproofed claims because anybody from his basement cellar can edit articles with nonsense. As the quoted parts of foreign development "partners" and subcontractors is full of contradictions and half-true controversial assessments, funnily admitted by Wiki itself.

The bold statement that Korea has 0 problems with and gets every possible ToT from the US shows a profound lack of knowledge and ignorance regarding the complicated US-ROK relationship since 1945. South Korea is and has never been a pampered ally like Germany in Europe and Japan in East Asia. In reality the US never trusted South Korea, it was viewed as a poor, backward and unreliable anti-communist fortress ruled by military dictators: its main function for DC was to protect their main ally Japan from Maoist China, crazy North Korea and Soviet Russia. They never treated ROK as a somewhat "peer-country" like Germany or Japan. Defense ToT was only just enough to have an edge over DPRK military but not good enough to have an edge over Japan which Korea still sees as a main threat to Korean sovereignty like China. Even if the actual Yoon government is pro-US and pro-Japanese, this geopolitical threat assessment will not change Korean defense policy.

The US doesn' t want ROK to have independent capabilities to seriously counter North Korean and possible Japanese aggression or act independently with or against Beijing: this would mean losing control over their firm grip in East Asian and Western Pacific theatre which is essential to enforce US dominance in this most important strategic and economic region. Thinking, that ROK got free access to US military tech is just uninformed BS and belittling 60 years of sacrifices, blood, sweat and tears of Korean scientists, engineers, technicians and military to push our defense industry to the high level that is now in the global Top 10.

 

[Chocopie]

I think you misunderstand what i mean , S korea have 0 problems with Usa thats why can easy get tech and other weapons as it wants and habe big same opponent (China) This make them to raly on USA weapons easy and dont mind because they have 0 problems with each other , its like Azerbaijan with Turkiye or Pakistan. Its just Geo-politics . And i know even USA buy some systems from others ans nothing is 100% but the difference is for which u buy ? Usa from UK ? Same as Turkiye from Azerbaijan .
Thats the point .
KAAN must be indigenous at major systems thats why Turkiye will develop its engine , ejection seat and others while for S korea i dont think so because they dont have problem with USA like we do not because S korea is weak and cant develop its 5 gen . I said many times S korea is so advanced and have great airforce and navy with advanced submarines and destroyers that Turkiye dont have for now .

Most of South Korean strategic defense projects (from missiles to satellites) were actively undermined or indirectly hindered by US policy maneuvers throughout our industrial development. That's a well-known fact by Koreans in the defense industry. We had to rely on Russian and European ToT to break US barriers to obtain advanced weapons technology that our US "blood ally" refused to share.

A Korean reddit user (https://www.reddit.com/user/J_S_Han/) working in defense and with high level military family background summarized it perfectly a few years ago:

"Actually, most of Korea's strategic assets are either Russian or European in origin. Ballistic missile, cruise missile, radar, satellite, etc. Tanks & ships are domestically produced and are increasingly made with domestic equipment, and the air force is getting the KFX in an attempt to step AWAY from using American equipment in a procedural process.

And the funny thing is, most of the time, the USA was the one who REFUSED to sell equipment to South Korea for undisclosed reasons. Examples include refusing to sell the JASSM cruise missile, causing South Korea to turn to the German KEPD-350 Taurus. Then there's the refusal to sell RG-4 Global Hawks, but when Korea started shopping around Israel and started its long range recon drone program, the USA changed its mind. The K-1 tank itself was based on the M1 Abrams because the USA refused to sell even M60s to South Korea, only to realize that Germany was about to win licensed production for over 1,500 tanks in Korea based on the Leopard series. They quickly changed their mind and the USA offered designs for the M1 Abrams tank, but why refuse to sell M60 tanks to Korea when America already sold them to a dozen countries?

Korea's military history has actually mostly been about the USA refusing to sell equipment to Korea for "undisclosed reasons", which usually mean diplomatic/geopolitical considerations to avoid creating problems with nearby countries.

If America was really leading South Korea's militarization, we would see greater US involvement and integration. But instead, Korea is buying more and more strategic equipment from other foreign nations, while building upon its own domestic independent systems."


"The thing is, many liberals AND conservatives in Korea don't like the USA's inaction regarding China's acts of aggressions against South Korea: the USA failed to do anything when China unilaterally initated economic sanctions from THAAD deployment, and South Korea had no rights over the THAAD units in its land, not even for intel sharing cooperation. The USA prior to Biden has repeatedly refused to help South Korea's satellite, ballistic missile, cruise missile, and air defense development. Instead, the USA placed restrictions on them, which left many in the military & weapons development (ADD & DAPA) wondering whether America is serious about working with South Korea against China, or simply using it as a convenient meatshield/cannon fodder/forward operating base.

It looks unfair if the USA insists on holding back South Korea's strategic assets but wants Korea to openly side against China, especially when China is stockpiling missiles and satellites in its Northeast provinces right next door. It's like fighting with your hands tied behind your back against someone several weight classes above you."

Two of numerous US interventions in SK to stop us from retaliating against North Korea and Japanese provocations (albeit no interventions whatsoever when Korean dictators were massacring Korean civilian dissidents and democratic protestors throughout history, LOL):

1. DPRK Yeonpyeong artillery shelling, ROK F-15K were already in the air and on their way to bomb the shit out of NK artillery positions:
"U.S. defense secretary Robert Gates & Obama intervening to prevent South Korea from bombing North Korea after the Yeonpyeong shelling. After the U.S. intervention at the Yeonpyeong Island shelling of 2010, the military changed its guidelines to basically tell the local commanders to retaliate against military attacks as they see fit without waiting for central command, and gave them jurisdiction over tactical ballistic missiles (KTSSM) and cruise missiles (Haeryeong Tactical Ship-to-Ground missile).

2. Japanese coast guard ships trying to sail into Korean Dokdo territory:
"That aside, we do know that South Korea did send warships to Dokdo in 2006 to sink Japanese ships if they didn't back off from the area. The USA did genuinely believe South Korea was willing to go to war over Dokdo, as implied by the then-US ambassador to Japan Thomas Schieffer telling Japan to back down as Korea might "do something crazy".

You think Koreans are too dumb to know about military self-suffciency and independent defense industry? The future plans are set in place with critical, cold sober analysis about our capabilities and deficiencies as well to reach that goal.

 

[Fuzuli NL]

Most of South Korean strategic defense projects (from missiles to satellites) were actively undermined or indirectly hindered by US policy maneuvers throughout our industrial development. That's a well-known fact by Koreans in the defense industry. We had to rely on Russian and European ToT to break US barriers to obtain advanced weapons technology that our US "blood ally" refused to share.

A Korean reddit user (https://www.reddit.com/user/J_S_Han/) working in defense and with high level military family background summarized it perfectly a few years ago:

"Actually, most of Korea's strategic assets are either Russian or European in origin. Ballistic missile, cruise missile, radar, satellite, etc. Tanks & ships are domestically produced and are increasingly made with domestic equipment, and the air force is getting the KFX in an attempt to step AWAY from using American equipment in a procedural process.

And the funny thing is, most of the time, the USA was the one who REFUSED to sell equipment to South Korea for undisclosed reasons. Examples include refusing to sell the JASSM cruise missile, causing South Korea to turn to the German KEPD-350 Taurus. Then there's the refusal to sell RG-4 Global Hawks, but when Korea started shopping around Israel and started its long range recon drone program, the USA changed its mind. The K-1 tank itself was based on the M1 Abrams because the USA refused to sell even M60s to South Korea, only to realize that Germany was about to win licensed production for over 1,500 tanks in Korea based on the Leopard series. They quickly changed their mind and the USA offered designs for the M1 Abrams tank, but why refuse to sell M60 tanks to Korea when America already sold them to a dozen countries?

Korea's military history has actually mostly been about the USA refusing to sell equipment to Korea for "undisclosed reasons", which usually mean diplomatic/geopolitical considerations to avoid creating problems with nearby countries.

If America was really leading South Korea's militarization, we would see greater US involvement and integration. But instead, Korea is buying more and more strategic equipment from other foreign nations, while building upon its own domestic independent systems."


"The thing is, many liberals AND conservatives in Korea don't like the USA's inaction regarding China's acts of aggressions against South Korea: the USA failed to do anything when China unilaterally initated economic sanctions from THAAD deployment, and South Korea had no rights over the THAAD units in its land, not even for intel sharing cooperation. The USA prior to Biden has repeatedly refused to help South Korea's satellite, ballistic missile, cruise missile, and air defense development. Instead, the USA placed restrictions on them, which left many in the military & weapons development (ADD & DAPA) wondering whether America is serious about working with South Korea against China, or simply using it as a convenient meatshield/cannon fodder/forward operating base.

It looks unfair if the USA insists on holding back South Korea's strategic assets but wants Korea to openly side against China, especially when China is stockpiling missiles and satellites in its Northeast provinces right next door. It's like fighting with your hands tied behind your back against someone several weight classes above you."

Two of numerous US interventions in SK to stop us from retaliating against North Korea and Japanese provocations (albeit no interventions whatsoever when Korean dictators were massacring Korean civilian dissidents and democratic protestors throughout history, LOL):

1. DPRK Yeonpyeong artillery shelling, ROK F-15K were already in the air and on their way to bomb the shit out of NK artillery positions:
"U.S. defense secretary Robert Gates & Obama intervening to prevent South Korea from bombing North Korea after the Yeonpyeong shelling. After the U.S. intervention at the Yeonpyeong Island shelling of 2010, the military changed its guidelines to basically tell the local commanders to retaliate against military attacks as they see fit without waiting for central command, and gave them jurisdiction over tactical ballistic missiles (KTSSM) and cruise missiles (Haeryeong Tactical Ship-to-Ground missile).

2. Japanese warships trying to sail into Korean Dokdo territory:
"That aside, we do know that South Korea did send warships to Dokdo in 2006 to sink Japanese ships if they didn't back off from the area. The USA did genuinely believe South Korea was willing to go to war over Dokdo, as implied by the then-US ambassador to Japan Thomas Schieffer telling Japan to back down as Korea might "do something crazy".

You think Koreans are too dumb to know about military self-suffciency and independent defense industry? The future plans are set in place with critical, cold sober analysis about our capabilities and deficiencies as well to reach that goal.

The US can't wrap their heads around Korea being the world's most advanced country.
You don't need enemies when you have "allies" like that.

 

[TheInsider]

 

[Chocopie]

View attachment 66289

Pretty transparent in my opinion, they showed every company logo as subcontractor who delivered a nut and bolt or software program. 65% of KF-21 is locally produced right now and that ratio will climb further with every iteration up to domestic turbofan engines (F-414 class) til the mid 2030s.

 

[Rooxbar]

Just want to point something out; if South Korea outsources certain subsystems to the biggest defence industry firms in the world, it's clearly not because they wouldn't be able to develop and manufacture them, but because it makes much more business sense to use tried and true stuff, get them much faster and for probably cheaper than it would cost to develop them from scratch; so let's not kid ourselves on that front. They also have no worries about U.S. backstabbing them or anything as their main concern is against NK and then China, both U.S. adversaries, unlike our geopolitical situation.