Former Pakistan PM Imran Khan arrested.
Imran Khan arrest updates: Protests after ex-Pakistan PM held
Former prime minister arrested during a court appearance in the capital, Islamabad.
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+1 Absolutly agree with you.It comes at worst time possible for their grave economic condition, brought about by same establishment playing fiddle for musical chairs game while Rome burns.
But this has been process set in motion a long time, atrophying of a protected class in politics (thus they do all they can to protect their cushy existence, no matter the cost on the larger population).....when politics needs some measure of Augean stable cleanse from time to time. Basically lessons were not learned and egos have festered and grown to a very large degree.
I don't profess a deep knowledge of Pakistan or the subcontinent in general. But I believe one of the root causes of Pakistan's woes is the immense and, some would argue, irreconcilable ethnic differences. Turkish internationalists (green or red) always beat us nationalists over the head with "Turkey is a mosaic" BS, but look at that map. As far as being a mosaic goes, Pakistan is the real deal. Now, being an ethnically diverse nation does not mean civil strife %100 of the time. But when you account for overpopulation, poverty, bleak economic future, mismanagement, tribal structures, chaotic neigbours... It's not looking good I tell you. Pakistan desperately needs a unifying national identity, and those don't grow on trees. You need a strong and clever leader with a vision and means to achieve his goals.+1 Absolutly agree with you.
As such, Pakistan is a source of great trouble for both its friends and enemies.
For example, India will have to prepare for the worst, as it is unpredictable what Pakistan will do in this situation, and this is extremely costly.
Pakistan in this state is also a problem for Turkiye as it will direct India's anger (You Turks support these vagrants in all 4 seasons, says some Indians I know) to Turkiye.
If this blindness continues, the establishment of Pakistan, the Pakistani state will first collapse economically and then politically disintegrate.
I don't profess a deep knowledge of Pakistan or the subcontinent in general. But I believe one of the root causes of Pakistan's woes is the immense and, some would argue, irreconcilable ethnic differences. Turkish internationalists (green or red) always beat us nationalists over the head with "Turkey is a mosaic" BS, but look at that map. As far as being a mosaic goes, Pakistan is the real deal. Now, being an ethnically diverse nation does not mean civil strife %100 of the time. But when you account for overpopulation, poverty, bleak economic future, mismanagement, tribal structures, chaotic neigbours... It's not looking good I tell you. Pakistan desperately needs a unifying national identity, and those don't grow on trees. You need a strong and clever leader with a vision and means to achieve his goals.
That's why I thank the creator every day for Atatürk.
In Pakistan, military IS the cabal.Cabal is the root of all evil. Assassinating the heads would be best solution. But it's strange the military doesn't take action, unless they're just as infested with cabal.
For some reason I was under the impression that Imran Khan had been ages ago but then I haven't been keeping up with Pakistani politics.
In Pakistan, military IS the cabal.
And thats why i think that no matter who wins Turkey already lost.We are heading into an election and instead of thinking about the economy, the vision for the future. How the nation can be improved and elevated, everything turned into a hate filled sectarian battle.
99% of Pakistanis dont want secularism, they see it as westernising without understanding the concept, you can not impose a regime if this much of the population despises it.In this mess, it would be very good if Pakistan was led by a group that would destroy the political Islamists. If secularism, democracy and the rule of law prevailed in the country...
I think the same for Iran.
For the People, Despite the People99% of Pakistanis dont want secularism, they see it as westernising without understanding the concept, you can not impose a regime if this much of the population despises it.
The situation there and rest of the islamic world will stay despicable as long as illiteracy keeps ruling it.
99% of Pakistanis dont want secularism, they see it as westernising without understanding the concept, you can not impose a regime if this much of the population despises it.
The situation there and rest of the islamic world will stay despicable as long as illiteracy keeps ruling it.
I critisized the situation of Turkey differently just one post above, why dont you read that first before accusing me of looking down at others?Sorry, but this is an oversimplification.
(On a side note- just some opinions polls is usually not good enough to judge any socio-cultural environment due the simple fact that, human societies function in an incredibly complex manner)
In these disscusions it is important to know Pakistan's pre-1979 history, so a comprehensive understanding of the contemporary situation can be reached.
In my opinion, at that very time Pakistan made a decades-long colossal mistake that change its socio-cultual environment in way that it became almost unsalvageable.
When soviet invasion of Afghanistan began, with America's blessing and Saudi funding Pakistani state started using religious propaganda as war fighting strategy to encourage and mobilize illiterate and deeply conservative population into a holy war to assist anti-soviet resistance.
Many so called madrassas were founded with Saudi funding where poor children and youth were radicalized.
As a geopolitical and warfighting strategy it seemed successful at first, but by the end of the decade when war ended, this onimous program got too big and became a self-sustaining social phenomenon even if Pakistani state didn't want it be.
And after that, the civil war and establishment of taliban's 'Emirate' keep fueling this radicalizarion program in the region. ultimately it bit the hand that was feeding it.
9/11 happened and America's war on terror began.
The generation that grew up in the holy war's spirit against soviet invasion join the fight big bad America. And the War continued for next two more decades in Afghanistan and in Pakistan (CIA's drone program)
Another generation grew up in the spirit of holy war.
And more ironically and indeed fatally, Pakistani military stablishment kept the Taliban under its wing as a 'strategic depth' against India and a bargaining chip against USA.
Obviously this strategy later backfired on Pakistan and almost led to civil war.
Of course, there are also other contributing factors to current Social environment in Pakistan. The fact that it is a multi-ethnic country hence tribalism, high level of poverty and illiteracy, massive corruption thus failure of education system, etc.
However my point being, even with all those factors stated above, Pakistani society would've been still better off if this four decades of conflict hence systemic radicalization didn't occur.
Why does it feels like you are looking down on everybody else?
You know, it is not only Turkey that has been socially modernized among Muslim countries.
Apart from Turkey, there are other muslim countries that also has undergone more or less relatively succefull social modernization.
Even just in South East Asia when it comes to social development, BD, Indonesia and Malaysia is considerably different than Pakistan.
I urge you to be more precise in these matters.
Overgeneralisation is not a productive way to engage in sensitive topics.
In this mess, it would be very good if Pakistan was led by a group that would destroy the political Islamists. If secularism, democracy and the rule of law prevailed in the country...
I think the same for Iran.
Sorry, but this is an oversimplification.
(On a side note- just some opinions polls is usually not good enough to judge any socio-cultural environment due the simple fact that, human societies function in an incredibly complex manner)
In these disscusions it is important to know Pakistan's pre-1979 history, so a comprehensive understanding of the contemporary situation can be reached.
In my opinion, at that very time Pakistan made a decades-long colossal mistake that change its socio-cultual environment in way that it became almost unsalvageable.
When soviet invasion of Afghanistan began, with America's blessing and Saudi funding Pakistani state started using religious propaganda as war fighting strategy to encourage and mobilize illiterate and deeply conservative population into a holy war to assist anti-soviet resistance.
Many so called madrassas were founded with Saudi funding where poor children and youth were radicalized.
As a geopolitical and warfighting strategy it seemed successful at first, but by the end of the decade when war ended, this onimous program got too big and became a self-sustaining social phenomenon even if Pakistani state didn't want it be.
And after that, the civil war and establishment of taliban's 'Emirate' keep fueling this radicalizarion program in the region. ultimately it bit the hand that was feeding it.
9/11 happened and America's war on terror began.
The generation that grew up in the holy war's spirit against soviet invasion join the fight big bad America. And the War continued for next two more decades in Afghanistan and in Pakistan (CIA's drone program)
Another generation grew up in the spirit of holy war.
And more ironically and indeed fatally, Pakistani military stablishment kept the Taliban under its wing as a 'strategic depth' against India and a bargaining chip against USA.
Obviously this strategy later backfired on Pakistan and almost led to civil war.
Of course, there are also other contributing factors to current Social environment in Pakistan. The fact that it is a multi-ethnic country hence tribalism, high level of poverty and illiteracy, massive corruption thus failure of education system, etc.
However my point being, even with all those factors stated above, Pakistani society would've been still better off if this four decades of conflict hence systemic radicalization didn't occur.
Why does it feels like you are looking down on everybody else?
You know, it is not only Turkey that has been socially modernized among Muslim countries.
Apart from Turkey, there are other muslim countries that also has undergone more or less relatively succefull social modernization.
Even just in South East Asia when it comes to social development, BD, Indonesia and Malaysia is considerably different than Pakistan.
I urge you to be more precise in these matters.
Overgeneralisation is not a productive way to engage in sensitive topics.
People forget how complex South Asian politics is.
I think Jinnah's plan was to make a Muslim state some said a secular state.
Many said that Jinnah was undecided because he had to balance the two out but how will he bevauae he has to appease liberals, muslims, religious crowd and the secular crowd.
One wants a Muslim state the other wants a Secular state.
Israel is another similar story when Ben Gurion founded Israel the real question is will it be Jewish state or Secular State.
Fun fact people should realise the Ottoman millet system is still used in the Israeli Political System.