TR Naval Programs

[Anmdt]

Dont you think quad packed gokdogan would be better than single packed Hisar D?

Hisar-D will be quad-packed soon. Gokdogan has its own advantage in a unique application.

 

[babayetu]

Hisar-D will be quad-packed soon. Gokdogan has its own advantage in a unique application.

How can even they quadpack soon? I thought it would take at least 5+ years.
Quadpacking is not easy job afaik. British wasted billions$ and took so long time, a lot of other advanced countries could not even get close. Also isnt quadpacking g40 would be easier that is cold launched?
Another question, how much a quadpack missile package cost? i heard that it'll cost way much than 4x the missile cost.

 

[boredaf]

Gokdogan has its own advantage in a unique application.

Unique part in your clue is interesting. Unmanned surface and ground vehicles would be the safest best, I think. Maybe a RAM system with Gokdogan? But that wouldn't exactly be unique either. Can't wait to find out what it'll be.

 

[dBSPL]

If we‘re planning to evolve our operational capabilities into an open sea navy wrt Blue Homeland doctrine on top of homeland shore’s protection, then possessing such vessels should only come natural.
So, yeah let’s go for HMS Scott since it’s available

I am completely convinced on this issue, especially the program of Kozan Erkan and Arda Mevlütoğlu moderated by Kaner Kurt was a real eye-opener. And of course we have a treasure like Anmdt, in defensehub. I have put a lot of effort into developing a positive mindset about the rationale behind this news. I have scoured many English documents and mission archives on the ships that will be decommissioned by UK MoD. However, in the final analysis, even if they are auxiliary class ships, transferring resources to these ships, when the Turkish shipbuilding industry is a rising value in the world markets in the field of military platforms, will not only affect our resource efficiency, but will also cause irreparable damage to our international marketing activities. I am not directly involved in the shipbuilding industry, but I am very close to it and I have a lot of people from the industries from whom I can get ideas, and need to say that the future of the industry is very bright, so much so that the economic size of our country or an infrastructure that will positively differentiate it from other industries is being formed.

More and more Istif-class frigates, and an ever-expanding participation in military shipbuilding. That's all we should be advocating for.

 

[Anmdt]

Unique part in your clue is interesting. Unmanned surface and ground vehicles would be the safest best, I think. Maybe a RAM system with Gokdogan? But that wouldn't exactly be unique either. Can't wait to find out what it'll be.

I posted the news on Naval Programs and called it 'unique' thus it is not something that can be easily thought of.

How can even they quadpack soon? I thought it would take at least 5+ years.
Quadpacking is not easy job afaik. British wasted billions$ and took so long time, a lot of other advanced countries could not even get close. Also isnt quadpacking g40 would be easier that is cold launched?
Another question, how much a quadpack missile package cost? i heard that it'll cost way much than 4x the missile cost.

Quadpacking is sure hard and challenging as far as the development of VLS itself, however, it does not cost $1 Billion nor as much as the VLS. It brings more than what it costs at the end.

And yes, the quad-packed canister and related controllers costs more than 4 of the individual canisters, but this worths the trouble. One cell is installed with 4 missiles at once, and time is saved during replenishment at harbor and 4 missiles are connected through common interface.

G40, if developed, can be still used from MIDLAS or individual vertical launcher developed by Tubitak and this is not much of a concern.

 

[uçuyorum]

What I wonder is if G40 can be used with a much smaller launcher from smaller ships that lack vls or have very few of them and easier to place on the deck, like a RAM launcher but with significantly longer maximum range. I imagine it would then be very useful for a large number of ships.

 

[Heartbang]

I am completely convinced on this issue, especially the program of Kozan Erkan and Arda Mevlütoğlu moderated by Kaner Kurt was a real eye-opener. And of course we have a treasure like Anmdt, in defensehub. I have put a lot of effort into developing a positive mindset about the rationale behind this news. I have scoured many English documents and mission archives on the ships that will be decommissioned by UK MoD. However, in the final analysis, even if they are auxiliary class ships, transferring resources to these ships, when the Turkish shipbuilding industry is a rising value in the world markets in the field of military platforms, will not only affect our resource efficiency, but will also cause irreparable damage to our international marketing activities. I am not directly involved in the shipbuilding industry, but I am very close to it and I have a lot of people from the industries from whom I can get ideas, and need to say that the future of the industry is very bright, so much so that the economic size of our country or an infrastructure that will positively differentiate it from other industries is being formed.

More and more Istif-class frigates, and an ever-expanding participation in military shipbuilding. That's all we should be advocating for.

I say get the ships, and dismantle them ASAP. Reverse engineer everything that's worth something. They'll be worthy of their value then.

 

[babayetu]

I am completely convinced on this issue, especially the program of Kozan Erkan and Arda Mevlütoğlu moderated by Kaner Kurt was a real eye-opener. And of course we have a treasure like Anmdt, in defensehub. I have put a lot of effort into developing a positive mindset about the rationale behind this news. I have scoured many English documents and mission archives on the ships that will be decommissioned by UK MoD. However, in the final analysis, even if they are auxiliary class ships, transferring resources to these ships, when the Turkish shipbuilding industry is a rising value in the world markets in the field of military platforms, will not only affect our resource efficiency, but will also cause irreparable damage to our international marketing activities. I am not directly involved in the shipbuilding industry, but I am very close to it and I have a lot of people from the industries from whom I can get ideas, and need to say that the future of the industry is very bright, so much so that the economic size of our country or an infrastructure that will positively differentiate it from other industries is being formed.

More and more Istif-class frigates, and an ever-expanding participation in military shipbuilding. That's all we should be advocating for.

I agree. TCG Istanbul is almost ready, that shows we have almost every subsystem ready, midlas and hisar-rf is on the way. We are talking about paying 10b$+ deal for f-16s to US, we are talking about paying 10b$+ to UK for eurofighters but we don't have 5-6b$ for our shipbuilding industry and state firms like Aselsan so we discuss buying junk, truely a remarkable situation.

Order 6x Ada class (add 2x8vls like ukrainian one)
Order 6x more total 10 I- Class (accelerated redesign for 32vls for like 4 of them)
Quicken the ADKG process
Decommission 4xGabya and 4xYavuz and 5xburak

It would take 4-5 years for this process we got enough shipyard, we would get like 20 new hulls instead of 13 most problematic assets. We would get rather modern navy instead of a average 35 years old navy... I-class with 32 vls is enough to accompany TCG Anadolu for now send 3x with it if needed.

Whole 20 ships would take at most 6b$ literally 1.2b$ a year is not even much. It is not a huge burden and we could wait till 2030 for the tf-2000 with no problemo.

 

[dBSPL]

I agree. TCG Istanbul is almost ready, that shows we have almost every subsystem ready, midlas and hisar-rf is on the way. We are talking about paying 10b$+ deal for f-16s to US, we are talking about paying 10b$+ to UK for eurofighters but we don't have 5-6b$ for our shipbuilding industry and state firms like Aselsan so we discuss buying junk, truely a remarkable situation.

Order 6x Ada class (add 2x8vls like ukrainian one)
Order 6x more total 10 I- Class (accelerated redesign for 32vls for like 4 of them)
Quicken the ADKG process
Decommission 4xGabya and 4xYavuz and 5xburak

It would take 4-5 years for this process we got enough shipyard, we would get like 20 new hulls instead of 13 most problematic assets. We would get rather modern navy instead of a average 35 years old navy... I-class with 32 vls is enough to accompany TCG Anadolu for now send 3x with it if needed.

Whole 20 ships would take at most 6b$ literally 1.2b$ a year is not even much. It is not a huge burden and we could wait till 2030 for the tf-2000 with no problemo.

I don't know whether we will be able to transfer the resources to enable so much parallel production in a very short period of time, or more importantly, whether we will be able to involve so many private shipyards in the main combatant platform production processes at once. However, I generally agree with the logic you are defending. The Hisar class OPVs will already be subject to a much faster production process than frigates, because of both structurally and in terms of equiping, there is no problem there. However, just as you said, one of the decisions that can be taken immediately in the first stage may be to increase the total number of platforms in the serial production of the Istif class. In other words, the scope could not be limited to three ships in three years, but the option could be realized right now and the target could be to deliver six ships to the navy in, lets say, 5-6 years.

With this type program: three shipyards will be ready for the serial production of the TF-2000 destroyer, having completed the construction of six Istif class hulls, by 2028. Thus, by 2031/32, seven Istifs and four Tf-2000s could have been delivered to the navy, while the construction of the heavy frigate, rumored to be the TF-100, should have completed at the Pendik shipyard. In terms of main combatant platform production, bringing even three shipyards to the level of being able to built destroyers would be an extraordinary achievement on a world scale. The number of countries in the world that have three private shipyards with a similar capability is limited to three, maybe four. Perhaps there are not even that many countries in practice.

As for auxiliary and logistics class ships, patrol ships and missile boats, hydrography and mine warfare ships, the naval forces have many projects in hand, we know that there are many works in planning, but most of our modernization plans for these are constantly postponing, probably due to resource priotirizing issues. If the share of the naval forces in the budget to be increased, this is probably where we would see the real transformation. Therefore, we can reach a large number of private shipyards specialized enough to distribute our military shipbuilding industry to all classes and tonnages through these programs. edit: In fact, I remember that the naval forces had a planning in this regard. We have read or seen many times in Turkish forums in the 2010s with documents or insider information of some of our elders about how many private shipyards will be specialized in which class. But we have to come back to the one thing every time. Our naval forces are one of the most successful forces in the world in terms of strategy development, but unfortunately, our economy cannot support this staff intelligence enough.

 

[dBSPL]

Within the scope of the construction of Reis class submarines, the last delivery of the "Section50", which was produced at Gürdesan Gemi Makinaları Sanayii Ticaret AŞ in Yalova under the engineering and coordination of STM, was successfully realized. The level Gürdesan has reached in submarine construction is really proud. It is one of our companies whose name is not very popular in the media, but which enlightens our future, MAVİ VATAN.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1621808851963023361

 

[Yasar]

Although Reis Class AIP submarine project for 6 boats is at full steam, there is another game changer project that is being undertaken; the STM-500.
Currently it is being worked on and a more lifelike sample/prototype of it expected to be available to see not before long.
Turkey’s first totally indigenous submarine is going to put Turkey among the true submarine builder nations.

Milli mini denizaltı bu yıl görünür hale gelecek

Milli denizaltı STM500 bu yıl görünür hale gelecek. STM Savunma Teknolojileri Mühendislik ve Ticaret AŞ Genel Müdürü Özgür Güleryüz, milli denizaltı STM500’ün, kendisini en fazla heyecanlandıran STM projesi olduğunu söyledi. Dünyada kendi denizaltısını tasarlayıp üretebilen 5-6 ülke olduğuna...

m5dergi.com

This mini sub will be in all compartments as proficient as its older brother, the Reis Class. Apart from its size, range, depth-limit and the number of weapons it can carry, it will be just as deadly as any submarine we have. It will be a real game changer in the Aegean.
With a length of 42 metres and a complement of 18 crew it will have 4 torpedo tubes that can fire guided missiles like Atmaca. With a diving depth of 250 metres it will be ideal for the Sea-Of-Islands.

STM - Submarine STM 500

www.stm.com.tr

 

[Fuzuli NL]

Although Reis Class AIP submarine project for 6 boats is at full steam, there is another game changer project that is being undertaken; the STM-500.
Currently it is being worked on and a more lifelike sample/prototype of it expected to be available to see not before long.
Turkey’s first totally indigenous submarine is going to put Turkey among the true submarine builder nations.

Milli mini denizaltı bu yıl görünür hale gelecek

Milli denizaltı STM500 bu yıl görünür hale gelecek. STM Savunma Teknolojileri Mühendislik ve Ticaret AŞ Genel Müdürü Özgür Güleryüz, milli denizaltı STM500’ün, kendisini en fazla heyecanlandıran STM projesi olduğunu söyledi. Dünyada kendi denizaltısını tasarlayıp üretebilen 5-6 ülke olduğuna...

m5dergi.com

This mini sub will be in all compartments as proficient as its older brother, the Reis Class. Apart from its size, range, depth-limit and the number of weapons it can carry, it will be just as deadly as any submarine we have. It will be a real game changer in the Aegean.
With a length of 42 metres and a complement of 18 crew it will have 4 torpedo tubes that can fire guided missiles like Atmaca. With a diving depth of 250 metres it will be ideal for the Sea-Of-Islands.

STM - Submarine STM 500

www.stm.com.tr

View attachment 53657

It would be the TB-2 of the deep blue.

 

[boredaf]

Although Reis Class AIP submarine project for 6 boats is at full steam, there is another game changer project that is being undertaken; the STM-500.
Currently it is being worked on and a more lifelike sample/prototype of it expected to be available to see not before long.
Turkey’s first totally indigenous submarine is going to put Turkey among the true submarine builder nations.

Milli mini denizaltı bu yıl görünür hale gelecek

Milli denizaltı STM500 bu yıl görünür hale gelecek. STM Savunma Teknolojileri Mühendislik ve Ticaret AŞ Genel Müdürü Özgür Güleryüz, milli denizaltı STM500’ün, kendisini en fazla heyecanlandıran STM projesi olduğunu söyledi. Dünyada kendi denizaltısını tasarlayıp üretebilen 5-6 ülke olduğuna...

m5dergi.com

This mini sub will be in all compartments as proficient as its older brother, the Reis Class. Apart from its size, range, depth-limit and the number of weapons it can carry, it will be just as deadly as any submarine we have. It will be a real game changer in the Aegean.
With a length of 42 metres and a complement of 18 crew it will have 4 torpedo tubes that can fire guided missiles like Atmaca. With a diving depth of 250 metres it will be ideal for the Sea-Of-Islands.

STM - Submarine STM 500

www.stm.com.tr

View attachment 53657

This is one of the projects I really like, not only it should be a really good option for our navy, but also we should be able to find costumers for it ratjer easily.

 

[Can't think of a Name]

This is one of the projects I really like, not only should it be a really good option for our navy, but also we should be able to find customers for it rather easily.

The only county I can think of that may be interested in this is Indonesia.

 

[wolveray1]

Although Reis Class AIP submarine project for 6 boats is at full steam, there is another game changer project that is being undertaken; the STM-500.
Currently it is being worked on and a more lifelike sample/prototype of it expected to be available to see not before long.
Turkey’s first totally indigenous submarine is going to put Turkey among the true submarine builder nations.

Milli mini denizaltı bu yıl görünür hale gelecek

Milli denizaltı STM500 bu yıl görünür hale gelecek. STM Savunma Teknolojileri Mühendislik ve Ticaret AŞ Genel Müdürü Özgür Güleryüz, milli denizaltı STM500’ün, kendisini en fazla heyecanlandıran STM projesi olduğunu söyledi. Dünyada kendi denizaltısını tasarlayıp üretebilen 5-6 ülke olduğuna...

m5dergi.com

This mini sub will be in all compartments as proficient as its older brother, the Reis Class. Apart from its size, range, depth-limit and the number of weapons it can carry, it will be just as deadly as any submarine we have. It will be a real game changer in the Aegean.
With a length of 42 metres and a complement of 18 crew it will have 4 torpedo tubes that can fire guided missiles like Atmaca. With a diving depth of 250 metres it will be ideal for the Sea-Of-Islands.

STM - Submarine STM 500

www.stm.com.tr

View attachment 53657

So how much does stm-500 expected cost..

 

[wolveray1]

The only county I can think of that may be interested in this is Indonesia.

Even Malaysia too as long its cheap..lol

 

[boredaf]

The only county I can think of that may be interested in this is Indonesia.

I think it's going to depend on the price and cost of operating it. If it is a reasonable/economic option STM will be able to find costumers we might not expect right now.

 

[Anmdt]

The only county I can think of that may be interested in this is Indonesia.

Not really.

Although Reis Class AIP submarine project for 6 boats is at full steam, there is another game changer project that is being undertaken; the STM-500.
Currently it is being worked on and a more lifelike sample/prototype of it expected to be available to see not before long.
Turkey’s first totally indigenous submarine is going to put Turkey among the true submarine builder nations.

Milli mini denizaltı bu yıl görünür hale gelecek

Milli denizaltı STM500 bu yıl görünür hale gelecek. STM Savunma Teknolojileri Mühendislik ve Ticaret AŞ Genel Müdürü Özgür Güleryüz, milli denizaltı STM500’ün, kendisini en fazla heyecanlandıran STM projesi olduğunu söyledi. Dünyada kendi denizaltısını tasarlayıp üretebilen 5-6 ülke olduğuna...

m5dergi.com

This mini sub will be in all compartments as proficient as its older brother, the Reis Class. Apart from its size, range, depth-limit and the number of weapons it can carry, it will be just as deadly as any submarine we have. It will be a real game changer in the Aegean.
With a length of 42 metres and a complement of 18 crew it will have 4 torpedo tubes that can fire guided missiles like Atmaca. With a diving depth of 250 metres it will be ideal for the Sea-Of-Islands.

STM - Submarine STM 500

www.stm.com.tr

View attachment 53657

The people, again experts in twitter, who has no idea about the vision of Milden is calling this project more important than Milden.

Milden is TF2000, STM500 is TTAB.

Any subsystem giving a leap to Milden is also necessary for STM500 (while the major systems are not available due to the size). Thus, without one the latter also becomes invalid.

For example;
Milden uses national steel, national ring stiffners etc.
STM500 uses imported steel.

 

[Can't think of a Name]

Even Malaysia too as long its cheap..lol

Not sure about the price but it is reportedly cheap enough to get the Philippines' interest.

 

[Combat-Master]