TR Turkish History|Debate and Discussion

[Gary]

Oh yes one more thing....you can't really blame the Arabs for revolting, prior to the Tanzimat which resulted in many Ottoman officers sent to Europe to study, most common Muslims saw themselves as one (not one political entity of course, but one heart at the very least: the Ummah), when Tanzimat came, the students sent to Europe are naturally exposed to "cool ideas" coming from Europe as well...such as this new thing called nationalism which basically said that people living in land A is better than people living in land B. Yes nationalism is a European product.

That's when we see this nationalism not only spreading in Turkey, but in Arabia, Persia and eventually the whole majority Islamic world, so you can't really blame the Arabs for following this trends of " I want to identify with my land and my race" when in Turkey itself the idea of Nationalism and ethnic superiority above the others are gaining ground, notably with the CUP.

 

[Ryder]

Interesting how most of the ethnic groups in the Ottoman Empire rebelled at the end.

But we just love to single out the Arabs.

Sooner or later we were going to lose the Middle East anyway. It sucks how we lost all that oil and the holy cities also no Palestine vs Israel conflict.

Cant dwell upon the past forever.

 

[Marquis de Sade]

He didn't clipped is leaps and ruined our already ruined image plus economy with his islamist rheotorics, foreign policy isn't about religion our your own ideology.

Supporting hamas will bring nothing but play to our enemies hands, Whats happening in palestine is an arabic cause
It is none of our business

They even tried to shutdown celebration of 100th anniversary of our republic because of gaza.

Its not only a Arab cause, its a international cause hence why from Brazil to the Philippines everyone protests on the streets.

And its especially our cause because Palestine is our former colony, ruined by the UK.

Look how sensitive France or the Netherlands are when something happens in their former colonies.

 

[Maximilien Robespierre]

Its not only a Arab cause, its a international cause hence why from Brazil to the Philippines everyone protests on the streets.

And its especially our cause because Palestine is our former colony, ruined by the UK.

Look how sensitive France or the Netherlands are when something happens in their former colonies.

A former colony that betrayed and kicked us out with force We couldn't care less about them It is not our cause and will not be jerusalem is a diffrent matter but palestine yeah Its not our cause.

 

[Chakib.Y]

A former colony that betrayed and kicked us out with force We couldn't care less about them It is not our cause and will not be jerusalem is a diffrent matter but palestine yeah Its not our cause.

how many arabs remained loyal and fought and died for the ottoman empire before and during the rebellion ? this self victimizing reductive reasoning isn't really a position any person with a shroud of objectivity should adopt, let alone blaming the child for the crimes of the forefather (not even the father). if you don't want your country to support palestine fair enough your country your blood your rules, but if you're going to justify it better use a better argument.

 

[Maximilien Robespierre]

how many arabs remained loyal and fought and died for the ottoman empire before and during the rebellion ? this self victimizing reductive reasoning isn't really a position any person with a shroud of objectivity should adopt, let alone blaming the child for the crimes of the forefather (not even the father). if you don't want your country to support palestine fair enough your country your blood your rules, but if you're going to justify it better use a better argument.

PLO also helped pkk do you wanna hear any other excuses from me? A country who has betrayed and disemboweled our soldiers, later in century helped pkk I won't be supporting either side because both sides are acting worse than barbarians butchering eachother like animals.

In the Battle of Çanakkale, a large part of the 72nd and 77th regiments consisted of Syrian Arabs. Fahrettin Altay Pasha, in his book "10 Years of War and After", in which he describes his memories between 1912 and 1922, says that the soldiers of the 72nd and 77th regiments escaped from the regiment and smoked hookah in the tents where they hid:

“The sea in front of Arıburnu was covered with hundreds of ships. The gunshots continued uninterruptedly. The valley between us began to fill with wounded from the front. "In the tented camp of the 72nd Arab Regiment ahead of us, we saw that many Arab soldiers who had escaped from the regiment were hiding in tents and smoking hookah.
source: fahrettin altay, 10 years of war and its aftermath, insel publications, istanbul, 1970, p. 90
very loyal allies indeed don't try to bring out the loyal allies argument to me ever again

If off topic please move my comments to other threads.

 

[GoatsMilk]

A former colony that betrayed and kicked us out with force We couldn't care less about them It is not our cause and will not be jerusalem is a diffrent matter but palestine yeah Its not our cause.

The betrayal happened from both sides.

For one it was the Turks in the 13th century under Baybars who removed the crusaders from the region. It was the Ottomans who didnt allow the Jews to resettle in the lands of Palestine and our power kept those lands free, where the Muslim lived with honour and integrity. It wasn't until the fall of Turkish power that the whites returned and we all know the story since. The Arabs sided with the invading kaffir armies and attacked us from behind. In our darkest hour, the Muslims almost put the final nail in the coffin for the Turks. Thank Allah that people like Ataturk existed in those days.

The Jews betrayed the Turks when the international Zionist order threw their entire support behind the British empire so that they could get their isreal as seen with the Balfour declaration. The Jews in the 15th century had been yet again been chased out and had to flee it was the Ottomans who invited them into our lands.

As Turks what are we learning from this?

No other people sacrificed as much in the name of religion as the Turk. For a close to a thousand years the Turks were the primary power facing off against the Christian west. Do we see any gratitude for our colossal military history in the name of the religion? No, we don't. In fact we see most of the Muslim ummah siding with our enemies, always looking to undermine us and harm us.

 

[Marquis de Sade]

A former colony that betrayed and kicked us out with force We couldn't care less about them It is not our cause and will not be jerusalem is a diffrent matter but palestine yeah Its not our cause.

The Algerians kicked the French out, the Indonesians kicked the Dutch out, the Indians kicked the Brittish out, the Congolese kicked the Belgians out, the Bolivians kicked the Spanish out, the Brazilians kicked the Portugese out.

90% of former colonies betray and kick their landlords out of the country and declare their independancy - they are your colonial servants, not your loyal bannermen.

But almost every colonial power has a old-boys-network and deep-state-innercircle installed in their former colonies to keep their financial network and/or cultural influence intact, except our country.

We dont have a single word to say in our former colonies and let other states meddling in it. Only with militairy force we gained some foothold in the past years in West-Libya, North-Syria and North-Iraq at the costs of hundreds of martyrs.

 

[Maximilien Robespierre]

The Algerians kicked the French out, the Indonesians kicked the Dutch out, the Indians kicked the Brittish out, the Congolese kicked the Belgians out, the Bolivians kicked the Spanish out, the Brazilians kicked the Portugese out.

90% of former colonies betray and kick their landlords out of the country and declare their independancy - they are your colonial servants, not your loyal bannermen.

But almost every colonial power has a old-boys-network and deep-state-innercircle installed in their former colonies to keep their financial network and/our cultural influence intact, except our country.

We dont have a single word to say in our former colonies and let other states meddling in it. Only with militairy force we gained some foothold in the past years in West-Libya, North-Syria and North-Iraq at the costs of hundreds of martyrs.

BECAUSE OUR COLONIES HATED US lmao In africa they despise french but they don't say no to them.
THEY EVEN SPEAK THEIR LANGUAGE LETS LOOK AT OUR FORMER SO CALLED COLONIES DO THEY SPEAK TURKISH?
This is a disgrace to our soldiers who got dissemboweled because people like you support their murderers?

Im all for stealing their wealth for my countries own sake face facts! From the first they palestinians said they will accept rehabilitation from egypt and qatar they don't want you!

 

[Chakib.Y]

PLO also helped pkk do you wanna hear any other excuses from me? A country who has betrayed and disemboweled our soldiers, later in century helped pkk I won't be supporting either side because both sides are acting worse than barbarians butchering eachother like animals.

In the Battle of Çanakkale, a large part of the 72nd and 77th regiments consisted of Syrian Arabs. Fahrettin Altay Pasha, in his book "10 Years of War and After", in which he describes his memories between 1912 and 1922, says that the soldiers of the 72nd and 77th regiments escaped from the regiment and smoked hookah in the tents where they hid:

“The sea in front of Arıburnu was covered with hundreds of ships. The gunshots continued uninterruptedly. The valley between us began to fill with wounded from the front. "In the tented camp of the 72nd Arab Regiment ahead of us, we saw that many Arab soldiers who had escaped from the regiment were hiding in tents and smoking hookah.
source: fahrettin altay, 10 years of war and its aftermath, insel publications, istanbul, 1970, p. 90
very loyal allies indeed don't try to bring out the loyal allies argument to me ever again

If off topic please move my comments to other threads.

1-PLO alliance is problematic but the at the time turkish strong relations with the israelis at the time wasn't an issue ? you think the israelis were distributing flowers to palestinians ? sure two wrongs don't make right but if you don't feel a strong stench of hypocrisy and double standards better fix your nose.

2-taking the example of a single instance of history while ignoring the majority of it and the global statistic is a pretty juvenile manner of conducting critical historical analysis

Arab Officers in the Ottoman Army | International Encyclopedia of the First World War (WW1)

Perhaps 30 percent of the World War I Ottoman officer corps hailed from Arab regions. Such people had often been the recipients of fully subsidized, comprehensive state education. Ex-officers figured prominently in all states that emerged from the Ottoman defeat in 1918.

encyclopedia.1914-1918-online.net

you're telling me that the 3 millions conscripts (correction 30% approximately of the 3 millions) were all undisciplined and those that lost their lives fighting the ottoman empire, the officers who lost prestige and remained stateless due to their loyalty to the empire all worthless sacrifices because "muh chauvinism says i have to play victim to justify it" ? i felt second hand embarrassment reading your reply and arriving to this conclusion

 

[Maximilien Robespierre]

1-PLO alliance is problematic but the at the time turkish strong relations with the israelis at the time wasn't an issue ? you think the israelis were distributing flowers to palestinians ? sure two wrongs don't make right but if you don't feel a strong stench of hypocrisy and double standards better fix your nose.

2-taking the example of a single instance of history while ignoring the majority of it and the global statistic is a pretty juvenile manner of conducting critical historical analysis

Arab Officers in the Ottoman Army | International Encyclopedia of the First World War (WW1)

Perhaps 30 percent of the World War I Ottoman officer corps hailed from Arab regions. Such people had often been the recipients of fully subsidized, comprehensive state education. Ex-officers figured prominently in all states that emerged from the Ottoman defeat in 1918.

encyclopedia.1914-1918-online.net

you're telling me that the 3 millions conscripts were all undisciplined and those that lost their lives fighting the ottoman empire, the officers who lost prestige and remained stateless due to their loyalty to the empire all worthless sacrifices because "muh chauvinism says i have to play victim to justify it" ? i felt second hand embarrassment reading your reply and arriving to this conclusion

According to our officers yeah arab conscripts did not know how to fight.

TWO WRONGS YEAH ONE IS A COUNTRY OTHER IS A TERRORIST ORGANIZATION LITERALLY HIJACKED PLANES AND KILLED CIVILIANS NOW YOU ARE DEFENDING BOTH PKK AND PLO show us your hatred so the Turks in this forum can see the reality.

So we had good relations with israel that gives them right to train an organization that attacked and killed our soldiers?
Turkey is not a islamic republic your religious affairs does not concern us, you people trained pkk and sent them right onto us some people here might have mercy for palestine but I don't because I know what they are I know what they did you are coming here defending plo saying they had right to arm pkk because we were good with israel, We are not a islamic country thats why thank god for Ataturk that he didn't made this country into some islamic s-**** like afghanistan.
If you are gonna support plo and pkk I will support your enemies in sahara desert I wasn't gonna get angry but your rhetorics about PLO alliance because we were good with israel set me off as a son of TAF MARTYR I have no remorse for those who helped pkk.

Having good relations with a country is a reason for arabs to arm+train kurds against us WHAT A GOOD JOB YOU ARABS DONE WHAT GOOD JOB.
Don't cry to us when you lob missiles to israel they bomb you after that.

According to you I lost my father to pkk because we had good relations with israel.

 

[GoatsMilk]

According to our officers yeah arab conscripts did not know how to fight.
TWO WRONGS YEAH ONE IS A COUNTRY OTHER IS A TERRORIST ORGANIZATION LITERALLY HIJACKED PLANES AND KILLED CIVILIANS NOW YOU ARE DEFENDING BOTH PKK AND PLO show us your hatred so the Turks in this forum can see the reality.

So we had good relations with israel that gives em right to attack and kill our soldiers right?

Having good relations with a country is a reason for arabs to arm+train kurds against us WHAT A GOOD JOB YOU ARABS DONE WHAT GOOD JOB.
Don't cry to us when you lob missiles to israel they bomb you after that.

According to you I lost my father to pkk because we had good relations with israel.

arab hostility didnt end with the Ottoman betrayal, its continued until today. In a regional context when all the Arabs are against you and many of them were on the soviet unions side, the very definition of an evil empire, it didn't leave Turks with much choice.

Lets not forget that even in cyprus the syrian and egyption arabs were sending the christian greeks weapons to kill our oppressed people.

Even today we don't have much choice. The saudis and gulf states are all financing our enemies, the syrians are happy to be a shia iranian proxy, iraq behaves like an enemy, egypt has sis etc etc.

Anyway when are the arabs going to go fight this war? It seems like collectively they are all behaving exceptionally cowardly. I'm not saying this to insult or provoke im saying it because i see all the Islamists trying to pressure the Turks like this is our war, when those very same people never helped us in our troubles. Look at north syria, where are the arabs to help us? Nah they invited assad back into the arab league.

If were being rational and we put ideology aside, the right thing for Turkiye is either to be neutral or to side with Isreal. To help the Arabs and Iranian backed forces is to murder your own people.

As far as the Arab betrayal is concerned, when you meet arabs they all hate each other. They all point out how treachrous the other side is. But when it comes to the betrayal of the Ottomans they find ways to justify it.

Today even the jews can slap them all about with impunity. A people with no real history of statehood, nor military history known globally for always been chased out of town, has become their master.

 

[Maximilien Robespierre]

@Marquis de Sade @GoatsMilk We can exchange our ideas here freely about the Palestine-Turkey relations.

 

[Saithan]

https://x.com/danismentoglu/status/1728861434124108282?s=46&t=DEy7rapS0QQE2YE7LHul5g

Interesting books about Turkish tribe that has kurdified. Perhaps if anyone knows similar books we could link them here or even share them.

Reminds me of Ilyas salman who, thought he was kurd his whole life but discovered he was from a turkish tribe.

 

[Strong AI]

99 years ago today, our country's first domestic aircraft took to the skies.

K-VI

 

[Test7]

Tengri Biz Menen

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1762518462528688275