Live Conflict Ukraine-Russia War

Afif

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The M39A1 variant began production in 1997, which realistically means it's mid 90's technology. That's a 30 year old ballistic missile. By modern military standards that's technology that you could classify anywhere from "old' to "ancient".

Yeah, I guess B-2, F-22 are all super ancient technologies. Except there is no such official standard called 'modern military standard'. Because that's not how classification works.
 

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Indonesian minister of economy, Airlangga Hartato met with ex-President of Russia turns imperialists, Dmitri Medvedev to talk about enhanced economic cooperation.

Russia could be our future source of affordable grain and food security, especially after Russia successfully grab those huge Ukrainian farmland. Good move.


 

UkroTurk

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Russia accused of ‘deliberate’ starvation tactics in Mariupol in submission to ICC


Russia engaged in a “deliberate pattern” of starvation tactics during the 85-day siege of the Ukrainian city of Mariupol in early 2022, which amounted to a war crime, according to a fresh analysis submitted to the international criminal court.

 

Deliorman

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So just in the last week and today we have:

1. G7 countries agreeing to finance Ukraine with 50 billion dollars from Russia's own frozen assets...
2. Ukraine signing defense pacts with the US and Japan for 10 years with the Japanese agreeing to assist Ukraine with 4.5 billion dollars in this year alone. Peanuts for Japan, really...
3. Hungary agreeing not to stop NATO from supplying Ukraine with weaponry. Even Putin's biggest puppet Orban bowed down to Stoltenber.
4. Biden signing with Zelensky agreements for entire F-16 squadrons and Patriot Air Defense systems + weaponry and supplies for them.
5. Basically all NATO countries gave a greenlight to Ukraine to strike Ruzzia everywhere it wants to with the weapons they supply.

I am probably missing many other important news but considering that the supplies and the good weapons for Ukraine are just starting to fly in in bigger numbers it means that we are in for a lot of fun, boys. And we only talk about a bunch of scraps that are given to Ukraine- a very tiny percentage of everything NATO has at it's disposal, mostly Cold War era tech. With all of that NATO is managing to take the teeth of the Bear one by one, slowly and painfully... But yeah, Russians put their flag over the town public toilet in Vochansh, conquered a village with 20 houses and 5 barns in it and took 200 meters of fields near Chasiv Yar and for that they lost only like a thousand people today. Let's celebrate it- from Ingushetia to Indonesia, y'all. :D
 

Gary

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THAT public toilet in Vovchansk is so valuable... to Ukraine.

That they send green men fresh from being drafted by construction officer straight to their death.

I wonder if people actually think before they write 😞
 

Relic

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Yeah, I guess B-2, F-22 are all super ancient technologies. Except there is no such official standard called 'modern military standard'. Because that's not how classification works.
"Modern military standard" is evident to anyone looking to see it. M39 and M39A1 is being given to Ukraine in large quantities because it is obsolete in the eyes of the donating nation. USA 🇺🇸 is instead stockpiling the longer range, unitary warhead M57 variant of the ATACMS, which continued production until 2013. They also have the newer M57E1 variant, which is a highly upgraded M39, featuring almost entirely new components, introduced in 2017. They also now have the PrSM, which they first fielded in 2023 and is slated to replace ATACMS all together in American inventories.

The Americans are the country that builds the ATACMS. They determine which ones are obsolete, not me. They're sending their obsolete units and those on the verge of expiring to Ukraine. They'll send a small quantity of their more modern variants as well, but not until they've exhausted their ancient ones.
 

Relic

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Confirmed: The G7 leaders have formally agreed to a $50 Billion usd loan for Ukraine, that will be repaid using the profits / interest confiscated from Russians frozen assets in U.S, Canadian, British and European Banks. This is the major step in releasing the $50 Billion usd in funds to Ukraine later this year.

Note: Italian 🇮🇹 and French 🇫🇷 ministers both noted today that the $50 billion usd loan will be released to Ukraine before the end of 2024 calendar year. How significant is this development? In 2024 Ukraine has budgeted approximately $42 Billion usd towards its own defense spending. That means they'll essentially get enough funding to double their military spending heading into 2025. Expect to see A LOT of purchases of western Infantry Fighting Vehicles, Artillery, Drones, Artillery Shells, Missiles, Ammunition, etc. $50 Billion usd (all at once) is enough money to equip a moderate sized army, virtually from scratch.

 
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Relic

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Norway 🇳🇴 announced that they are in the process of sending 50,000 81mm and 120mm mortar shells to Ukraine, valued at $45 million usd.

 

Afif

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"Modern military standard" is evident to anyone looking to see it. M39 and M39A1 is being given to Ukraine in large quantities because it is obsolete in the eyes of the donating nation. USA 🇺🇸 is instead stockpiling the longer range, unitary warhead M57 variant of the ATACMS, which continued production until 2013. They also have the newer M57E1 variant, which is a highly upgraded M39, featuring almost entirely new components, introduced in 2017. They also now have the PrSM, which they first fielded in 2023 and is slated to replace ATACMS all together in American inventories.

The Americans are the country that builds the ATACMS. They determine which ones are obsolete, not me. They're sending their obsolete units and those on the verge of expiring to Ukraine. They'll send a small quantity of their more modern variants as well, but not until they've exhausted their ancient ones.

None of ATACMs in US inventory are obsolete. Each has been refurbished and upgraded at least once, some even twice to keep them in active service. US army has paid more a million or more for per missile upgrade. This has been explicitly stated by PrISM program officer.
 

Relic

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None of ATACMs in US inventory are obsolete. Each has been refurbished and upgraded at least once, some even twice to keep them in active service. US army has paid more a million or more for per missile upgrade. This has been explicitly stated by PrISM program officer.
The M39A1 are being withdrawn from service because they are to no longer be used by the U.S. Army. An unknown number were stripped down and completely rebuilt into M57E1 missiles, that will remain in U.S. inventories. The shorter ranged M39 and M39A1 variants are being fully removed from the inventory. Most of them were to be decommissioned. They're instead sending them to Ukraine to prey on Russian S-300 and S-400 systems. They're making way for new PrSMs and whatever M57E1 upgrades they might still have in the pipeline.

Just because the United States spends a lot of money on something, it doesn't mean that it remains useful to them forever. They're sending hundreds of M113s and Humvees to Ukraine for the same reason. Obsolete by American standards for modern combat and therefore, they can be disposed of and / or donated to somebody fighting a war against a foe that is using similarly outdated equipment (Russia in this case).
 
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Relic

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Canada 🇨🇦 announced another military aid package today, albeit, a fairly small one. It includes the following:

- 2000 CRV7 rocket motors
- 130,000 rounds of small arms ammo
- 29 Nanuk Remote Weapons Systems

Note: the 2000 CRV7 rocket motors is an initial tranche. Ottawa will send tens of thousands of CRV7 rockets (analogue of the Hydra 70) in various states of decommissioning, over the next year.

 

Afif

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The M39A1 are being withdrawn from service because they are to no longer be used by the U.S. Army. An unknown number were stripped down and completely rebuilt into M57E1 missiles, that will remain in U.S. inventories. The shorter ranged M39 and M39A1 variants are being fully removed from the inventory. Most of them were to be decommissioned. They're instead sending them to Ukraine to prey on Russian S-300 and S-400 systems. They're making way for new PrSMs and whatever M57E1 upgrades they might still have in the pipeline.

Just because the United States spends a lot of money on something, it doesn't mean that it remains useful to them forever. They're sending hundreds of M113s and Humvees to Ukraine for the same reason. Obsolete by American standards for modern combat and therefore, they can be disposed of and / or donated to somebody fighting a war against a foe that is using similarly outdated equipment (Russia in this case).

Now you are talking from yourself and passing it on Pentagon. It doesn't remain useful forever, but it definitely remain useful for several more years. None of the missile were to be scrapped anytime soon. Pentagon literally denied the allegation.

 

Relic

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I'll pull the exact quote out of the press conference you linked from Jan 4th, 2024.

"There -- there's a Newsweek story out there that says that there is ATACMS up for destruction, the expired ATACMS, U.S. ATACMS, that would be a significant expense to American taxpayers, according to one former advisor to Ukraine's commander. Is this true? Are there a bunch of ATACMS, expired ATACMS set to be destroyed? And if that is true, why would they not be going to Ukraine?"

"GEN. RYDER: Yeah, so I've seen those press reports. We looked into this and it is not true. Those reports are false."

Ryder, gave the least contextualized answer to the question possible, because USA 🇺🇸 was clearly in the process of setting up the transfer to Ukraine and didn't want to release any information to tip Russia off. Here is the reality. The Newsweek article that sites the Ukrainian source references the "significant expense to tax payers" which the reporter parrots. I never made that claim. Furthermore, the reporter asks if the missiles are going to be destroyed.

There is a difference between destroying the missiles and removing them from active Army inventories. For example, USA 🇺🇸 has more than 2500 Bradley IFVs in storage that it never intends to use again. They're in various states of disrepair ranging from those useful only for parts, to those that could be brought back to military service in a matter of weeks. Most of those stored Bradleys are considered obsolete, but that doesn't mean that they're useless, they simply fall below the standard of what is deemed acceptable to meet active inventory standard for the U.S. Army. The same is true of M39 ATACMS. M57E1 is their active inventory submunition variant of the ATACMS.

Ryder kept his answer as vague as possible, providing no context, due to the sensitivity around the topic.

Meanwhile, we know that Lockheed Martin delivered the first of USA's new PrSM's in late 2023, with additional batches to be delivered throughout 2024. It's painfully obvious that the reason USA changed its tune from "We don't have enough ATACMS to give" to them suddenly being supplied plentifully was for two reasons:

1. Per the CNN article linked below, the U.S. Army bolstered their order numbers of new M57 ATACMS when Lockheed Martin surged its production to 500 units per year, up from the 300'ish units per year the production line was running at. Maxing out production capability took time (more than a year) and, therefore, USA couldn't get replacement units. As soon as they became available in large quantities, their older missiles became obsolete for them and they were able to be decommissioned / placed in deep storage OR transferred to Ukraine. Ultimately, the M39 and M39A1s were transferred to Ukraine in an unknown quantity.

2. Lockheed Martin confirmed the delivery of the new PrSMs to U.S. Army inventory starting in December, 2023. Combined with the surge of M57 variant ATACMs fresh from the assembly line, this made the M39 and M39A1 variants even less relevant and an even more comfortable decision for the U.S. to transfer. The U.S. is maintaining a stockpile of M57E1 variant ATACMS that offer the submunition option, with completely upgraded components. That decision was made in 2017.

You can read whatever context you want into Ryder's vague quote, but I think that it's painfully obvious that the U.S. was simply waiting for the M57 assembly line to reach max production (an additional 200'ish units per year) and PrSM deliveries to begin (both of which happened in late 2023) to start delivering their obsolete M39 variant ATACMs to Ukraine.


 

Relic

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The Netherlands 🇳🇱 announced today that IFU funding is purchasing $375 million usd worth of 152mm artillery shells for Ukraine, from an undisclosed producer. Note, this is separate from the Czech 🇨🇿 led initiative to procure 800,000 122mm and 155mm artillery shells for Ukraine.

The IFU (International Fund For Ukraine) has received more than $1.3 Billion usd from 9 countries, including Britain 🇬🇧, The Netherlands 🇳🇱, Sweden 🇸🇪, Australia 🇦🇺, Denmark 🇩🇰, Iceland 🇮🇸, New Zealand 🇳🇿, Lithuania 🇱🇹, Norway 🇳🇴.

Depending on where these shells are being produced they are expected to cost between $2500-$4000 per shell, which means Ukraine will receive between 95,000-150,000 shells from this purchase. Ukraine uses at least 7 variants of towed and self-propelled 152mm howitzers.

 
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Iskander

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We'll see how S-500 does. S-400 in Crimea has struggled with Ukraine's ancient M39A1 variant of the ATACMS ballistic missile. We'll see if S-500 is as good as Russia says it is. Rarely is that ever the case when talking about Russian military equipment.
It is not clear why the Russians brought these “legendary” S500s to Crimea. What advantages does it have over the S300/400, besides range? Shoot down satellites? It looks like this is preparation for the arrival of the F16.
But they will be covered by the same “leaky” Pantsirs, Buks and Torahs. That is, the Ukrainians will destroy them in the same way.
It has long been clear that there are not enough of them. And now it looks like they have an air defense crisis.
Be that as it may, I think that this year the Russians, following the naval one, may lose air superiority. And this is fraught with the loss of him on earth.

Next year promises many “surprises” for Russia.
 
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Afif

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It is not clear why the Russians brought these “legendary” S500s to Crimea. What advantages does it have over the S300/400, besides range? Shoot down satellites? It looks like this is preparation for the arrival of the F16.
But they will be covered by the same “leaky” Pantsirs, Buks and Torahs. That is, the Ukrainians will destroy them in the same way.
It has long been clear that there are not enough of them. And now it looks like they have an air defense crisis.
Be that as it may, I think that this year the Russians, following the naval one, may lose air superiority. And this is fraught with the loss of him on earth.

S500 is primarily designed for ABM. Which S400 struggling to do against ATACMs.
 

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The official representative of the EU foreign policy service, Peter Stano, commenting on the issue of Turkey's membership in the European Union, said that “if Turkey joins the EU sanctions against Russia, it will change the game.”
And as evidence solely
Europe's honest intentions, he put on ...uniform
Turkish football team.

1718350394886.png

And we, of course, believed these hypocrites and tears of tenderness flowed from our eyes ;) :LOL:
 
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UkroTurk

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Putin said that he wanted to withdraw troops from two regions of Ukraine: the “mediator” knew about this



Putin made a statement regarding the conditions that he set for Ukraine at the beginning of the war

However, he set a condition for Kyiv, to which the Ukrainian authorities did not agree.

Russian dictator Vladimir Putin said that at the beginning of the war he was ready to withdraw troops from the Kherson and Zaporozhye regions if Russia received a land corridor to Crimea.
 

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Rare footage of an American-made Ukrainian FGM-148 Javelin ATGM strike, filmed from inside the Russian T-90M Proryv tank, has been published. The tankers had expended shells and were firing from a remote anti-aircraft gun. The crew of the tank spotted the launch of an FGM-148 Javelin missile from the house, a machine gun burst was directed at the launch site and the tank began to actively maneuver away from the missile. Despite the tank's maneuvers, due to the heated machine gun, the Javelin missile was able to aim at the tank and hit the turret. The new turret protection, which we showed earlier, withstood the blow and the tank crew was not injured. The crew put out the fire and took the tank out of the battle, returning to its unit.

 

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