TR Air-Force TF-X KAAN Fighter Jet

photon vish

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I can’t but most of the time the data we got were credible. Do you know exactly how the penetration works exactly in either of these bombs?
-> Penetration works with huge momentum and strong casing with dekayed fuse obv



Gpu 57 needs to drop with 12km high with 14 tonn weight so that it can pentrate 60m of earth(Use earth pull and weight to generate enough momentum


For turkish oentrator, it need to have supersonic speed with over 10× stronger casing to go 90m
 

alfonsvlora

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Still better than 14tonn gpu 57 is too much. I can expect it to be better than gbu 28(its 2.3 tonn), but better than gpi 57 is not possible

For it to have , u have to make extremely high streagth materials, atkeast 10x more powerful than used in gpu 57 with similar weight and then some sort of rocket propulsion to orovide enough momentum

-> Penetration works with huge momentum and strong casing with dekayed fuse obv

Gpu 57 needs to drop with 12km high with 14 tonn weight so that it can pentrate 60m of earth

For turkish oentrator, it need to have supersonic speed with 10× stronger casing to go 90m

Hey buddy, excuse me, but what are you talking about!
You're tearing yourself apart like a cat with its claws behind glass...!
Don't you have anything else to say, for example, about KAAN !?
In my opinion, @begturan has explained it very clearly, you're still going on...!
 

Yasar_TR

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So tell me how a 1 tonn penetrator can pentrate 30% more(90 meter) than 14 tonn american gpu 57(60 meter)

Isn't it unrealistic ??

And where did they shows that it went 90 meter ??

If a 1 tonn can go 90 meter with 200kg explosive then who need 14 tonn gbu 57 which can only go 60(although with over 2 tonn explosive) and requires 2 billion b2 stealth bomber to drop it
Bro, before you ask serious questions and expect to receive serious responses, you need to wind down the condescending nature of your posts of “you people” !

Most of the answers you seek are in the old posts in the related threads.

US‘s GBU57 is a 0.8m diameter 13.5ton bomb with an explosive content of 2400kg. It manages to hit the ground at a speed of ~ 1.15 to 1.45 Mach. It goes down by 60m through it’s kinetic energy and explodes to go down a further 18m of reinforced concrete before the secondary explosion.
Due to it’s larger cross section it’s drilling power is limited to above figures. It is a devastating bomb specially designed to bust deep bunkers.

Hayalet bomb of Turkiye has a 0.45m diameter and is around 970kg in weight with a 250kg of explosive content. When dropped from 40000ft it hits the ground at around 1.4 Mach. In the below test it was dropped from 30000ft, and penetrated 90m deep at an impact velocity of 1.2 Mach . It has a special hardened construction that behaves like a dart, and drills through earth by more than 90m. Then it explodes. It utilizes a specialized warhead design with a hardened steel casing for maximum penetration, often employing a 240ms time-delay fuse to detonate after passing through multiple layers of armour or concrete. It uses the deep penetration capability and the so called “ earthquake wave” effect when it explodes at such deep layers of earth to destroy bunkers. Due to its smaller silhouette it has a very high impact speed and deeper penetration power. It uses its kinetic energy more than the explosive penetration. During the ground tests it penetrated 7m C50 concrete reinforced with 25mm ribbed steel, and a further 5 m of standard concrete.

They do not act quite similarly in their operation. But are used for similar end use. Contrary to many TV channels that prey on national feelings about how great this bomb is, it is not the same as a GBU57. That is a different world altogether. But Hayalet serves a similar end use with cheaper and in a more versatile manner.


 
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Sanchez

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Apart from the engine are there any other ITAR controlled systems in the aircraft?
As far as we know, nope. I'm sure there are subcomponents of subsystems but none are for production aircraft. Turkey and SSB is under CAATSA sanctions by US for years and Kaan is an SSB project. Many components are outside our reach even if we wanted them. Even F110's supply is very hard to follow through.
 

Spitfire9

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As far as we know, nope. I'm sure there are subcomponents of subsystems but none are for production aircraft. Turkey and SSB is under CAATSA sanctions by US for years and Kaan is an SSB project. Many components are outside our reach even if we wanted them. Even F110's supply is very hard to follow through.
Are you saying that once the US engine is replaced with TF35000 the US cannot stop Turkiye making or exporting the aircraft?
 

NEKO

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Does martin baker ejection seat fall under ITAR control?

Its UK company, but who know.

Maybe US can block the sale/spare parts.
 

Ripley

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Are you saying that once the US engine is replaced with TF35000 the US cannot stop Turkiye making or exporting the aircraft?
Well pretty much yeah
Does martin baker ejection seat fall under ITAR control?

Its UK company, but who know.

Maybe US can block the sale/spare parts.
A domestic ejection seat was in the works. For the moment it’s MB. They even developed canopy coating domestically. They’re leaving nothing to chance.
 

Sanchez

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Are you saying that once the US engine is replaced with TF35000 the US cannot stop Turkiye making or exporting the aircraft?
Yes.
Does martin baker ejection seat fall under ITAR control?

Its UK company, but who know.

Maybe US can block the sale/spare parts.
M-B is a British company. Mk16 used on Rafale for example is built by a France based subsidiary and it is ITAR-Free like rest of Rafale. Depends on the variant. Kaan will use Mk18 and there are indeed plans to localize the seat in the future too.

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Saithan

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I would very much like to see further test flights of KAAN, more than anything I'd like to be shown the progress. Step by step. If we're making progress. Even if it means showing our hand. Proving the progress and being unstoppable would inevitable make our trust be stronger.
 

Huelague

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I can’t find the link where Hakan Celik and Temel Kotil talk to each other’s about production line and the increasing.
 

dBSPL

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Meaningless without engine production to match. 96 TF35000 per year is not trivial
The statements are sure to please every Turkish defense and aerospace enthusiast; however, producing 48 KAANs annually is a highly aggressive target requiring a significant increase in existing infrastructure.

While TEI competes with global giants in precision component production, producing 100-120 TF35000s annually is a completely different level. This scale necessitates the construction of numerous new robotic production lines and at least a dozen new Brems (test cells) in addition to existing facilities. TEI's establishment target of this serial production discipline and 'complete engine package' management through its TF6000 and TF10000 projects is critically important.

Looking at the world, Lockheed Martin produces 120-150 F-35s annually, their engine partner, P&W, delivers 150-200 F135 engines per year, and it took them over a decade to reach that level, and a massive global supply chain behind it. Dassault is struggling to increase Rafale production from 15 to 36 units per year. A single country producing 48 fifth-generation jets per year is a level of production that even the US and China may struggle to achieve today.

The supply of strategic materials (titanium, superalloys), the flawless continuity of thousands of subsystems, and the certification process for each engine will make this pace challenging. While TEI's parts manufacturing capabilities have this potential, it will need to increase its complete assembly and testing capacity by 3-4 times and establish a massive subcontractor ecosystem.

In this context, a partner like Spain can be critically important for achieving a goal of this scale.


**

Another question that comes to mind is how to manage the "Modular Production" and "Customer-Specific Configuration" strategies. Because the Kaan project offers potential buyers with an unorthodox market strategy both maximum ITAR-free and fifth-generation solutions, and also enables their participation in production. Certification will be in line with international aerospace quality standards; for example, subcontractors without ISO 9001 and AS/EN/JISQ 9100 qualifications will not be accepted, even if an offset is given to countries like Saudi Arabia in the future.

However, perhaps supply chain fragmentation will also occur. If a customer (e.g., Spain) does not want to source parts from a particular country (e.g., Pakistan) for political or technical reasons, the production line will need to be flexible to source these parts from TUSAŞ's main facilities or other approved subcontractors. This would necessitate TUSAŞ remaining the authority in the final assembly of all parts as the main integrator. Or, while some countries participate in the project's development phase with their engineering capabilities, discussions with countries like Spain will focus more on technology transfer and integration into the European aerospace ecosystem?

In short, Tusaş is ambitious not only because of the enormous supply ecosystem needs that its speculated production target of 32-48 units/year will create, but also because it aims to be a program that brings together different actors in an unprecedented way.
 
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Yasar_TR

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I would be fairly OK with 24 unit per year.
We know from past experience how many they can produce in reality. check out T-129 production speed. Anka-S production speed. Kotil, when asked would tel you 2 per month.

Let them aim for 4 per month. They may then manage 2 a month.
 
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