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TR Air-Force TF-X KAAN Fighter Jet

OPTIMUS

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And unfortunately, they approached the problem from the wrong angle rather than as it should be. Even foreign manufacturers applied for technical support, although they stated that solving the problem was not possible, yet TAI considers this a sort of secret embargo and is spending thousands of engineering hours and resources to solve this issue. And this is wrong.
 

OPTIMUS

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Even if one day TAI announces that these actuators are developed and produced locally, it won't fix this mistake. The mistake will still be there. Either they'll cut the parts that should be on the plane's horizontal stabilizers, or the plane will fly with a faulty design.
 

OPTIMUS

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What is your source?
The source is definitely not a TUSAS employee.

The source is a foreign company that TUSAS was thinking of assigning to produce these actuators. But the company reported to TUSAS that this is technically impossible. There are two other foreign companies applied as well. The report they sent to TUSAS is along the same lines.

I can take one more step regarding the source, but nothing more.
 

Samba

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The source is definitely not a TUSAS employee.

The source is a foreign company that TUSAS was thinking of assigning to produce these actuators. But the company reported to TUSAS that this is technically impossible. There are two other foreign companies applied as well. The report they sent to TUSAS is along the same lines.

I can take one more step regarding the source, but nothing more.
What was the case with P0?
What is fundamentally different than of F22, F35, J35, SU57 stabilizers? How come do they have solution?
 

uçuyorum

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The source is definitely not a TUSAS employee.

The source is a foreign company that TUSAS was thinking of assigning to produce these actuators. But the company reported to TUSAS that this is technically impossible. There are two other foreign companies applied as well. The report they sent to TUSAS is along the same lines.

I can take one more step regarding the source, but nothing more.
So you say shorten it? Or move the pivot point? Is it basically the thing is too long and a high power actuator will not fit the space available?
 

OPTIMUS

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In der gesamten Geschichte des modernen westlichen Flugzeugbaus gibt es zwei Flugzeuge mit übergroßen horizontalen Stabilisatoren. Beide sind im Wesentlichen Bomberflugzeuge. Einer ist die F-111 und der andere der Tornado. Sie sind also keine reinen Luftherrschaftsjäger wie der KAAN. Und leider hat der KAAN auch übergroße vertikale Stabilisatoren. So groß wie die der F-16 Wings.
Überdimensionierte horizontale Stabilisatoren führten sogar zur Aussetzung des Betriebs der F-111. Drei Verluste in Vietnam am 28. März 1968 (66–0022), 30. März 1968 (66–0017) und 22. April 1968 (22–0024), was bedeutete, dass die gesamte F-111-Flotte vier Jahre lang bis September 1972 am Boden bleiben musste. Das ist ein kurzer Hintergrund.

TUSAS hatte dieselben Probleme mit den horizontalen Stabilisatoren des KAAN. Westliche Ingenieure – und anschließend sowjetische/russische Ingenieure – lösten das Problem jedoch erfolgreich mit einem subtilen, aber notwendigen Schnitt im Horizontalstabilisator. Dies zeigt sich bei allen modernen Horizontalstabilisatoren, insbesondere ab der F-16 und späteren MiG- und Su-Serien.

TUSAS hat jedoch den falschen Weg gewählt – wie immer seit der ANKA – und fährt mit HÜRKUS und HÜRJET auf demselben Weg. alles, obwohl Änderungen an der Nasen- und Cockpitanordnung dieses Flugzeugs noch erforderlich sind. Dasselbe gilt für die horizontalen Stabilisatoren des HÜRJET.

Als Militärkäufer würde ich keinen HÜRKUS kaufen. Das Flugzeug wird derzeit durch politischen Einfluss und Verbindungen verkauft. Obwohl der HÜRKUS einen der besten westlichen Motoren besitzt, kommt er nicht annähernd an den SUPER TUCANO oder den T-6 TEXAN II heran. Das liegt ausschließlich am Flügeldesign. Die nach den Warnungen vorgenommenen Flügelmodifikationen sind sehr minimal und falsch (Winglets). Sie haben diesen falschen Ansatz sogar mehrfach geändert, doch am Ende blieben sie falsch. Daher ist der HÜRKUS nur von sehr begrenzter Eignung für leichte Angriffsoperationen. Das Flugzeug hat keine Nutzlastkapazität.

Ich werde dir gleich gute Nachrichten bezüglich des Aktuatorproblems mit dem horizontalen Stabilisator des KAAN teilen. Bitte entscheidet selbst, ob es richtig oder falsch ist.

Bevor Sie Ihre Entscheidung treffen, machen Sie bitte einen groben Vergleich zwischen Bildern westlicher und russischer Horizontalstabilisatoren. Die F-35 ist eine Ausnahme, da dieses Flugzeug ein völlig anderes Missionsprofil hat.
 
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OPTIMUS

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According to the statement of Mr. Altinay, Chairman of the Board of ALTINAY Technology Group, the tail actuators required for the KAAN Aircraft were developed locally, qualified, and delivered to TUSAS.

Mr. Altinay also confirms that foreign companies were assigned to this task and returned to TUSAS with a report saying it couldn’t be done.

As far as I know, one of these companies is American and the other is German. You can figure out which companies they are by inferring from the previous message.

Now, is it right to insist on a solution that will lead to the wrong result, spending thousands of engineering hours, just to stick to a side list? Or is it better to go for a simple design change that has already proven itself? Other manufacturers chose the second way.
 

Samba

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What was the case with P0?

According to the statement of Mr. Altinay, Chairman of the Board of ALTINAY Technology Group, the tail actuators required for the KAAN Aircraft were developed locally, qualified, and delivered to TUSAS.

Mr. Altinay also confirms that foreign companies were assigned to this task and returned to TUSAS with a report saying it couldn’t be done.

As far as I know, one of these companies is American and the other is German. You can figure out which companies they are by inferring from the previous message.

Now, is it right to insist on a solution that will lead to the wrong result, spending thousands of engineering hours, just to stick to a side list? Or is it better to go for a simple design change that has already proven itself? Other manufacturers chose the second way.
I am not an expert on the subject and technical details of vertical stabilizer. But in all images and schematics KAAN does not seem to have different sized ones than of the ones on f22 su57 or f35. What is fundamentally wrong on KAAN? Eeven if it is wrong, why do you think TAI chooses this way? Do they expect better results?

At the end of the day, everyone called Japanese scientist mad man for what he offered for chip production and they said it is impossible. Today it is possible and what made the difference.
 

Zafer

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It is a shame Kaan project secrets are revealed on defencehub, admins should take action.
 
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