Turkey Widens War Tech Hunt by Tapping Pakistan’s China Ties

[Glass🚬]

Turkey Widens War Tech Hunt by Tapping Pakistan’s China Ties​

By
Selcan Hacaoglu
2. März 2021, 11:32 MEZ

• Turkey wants to produce fighter jets, missiles with Pakistan
• Pakistan makes jets with China, said to use its missile design

A Pakistan Air Force JF-17 Thunder jet, manufactured by Chengdu Aircraft Corp. of China.
Photographer: Jason Alden/Bloomberg


Turkey is pushing to co-manufacture warplanes and missiles with Pakistan, a hookup that could also give it access to prized war technology from China.


Turkish defense and government officials have held periodic talks with Pakistani counterparts -- the last high-level discussion was in January -- about developing and manufacturing military hardware with Pakistan, according to people from both countries who are familiar with the negotiations. The people didn’t say when they’ll meet again or how close they are to an agreement.


A deal would get NATO-member Turkey closer to some of China’s military technology. Pakistan builds its JF-17 fighter jets with China and is said to have adapted Chinese designs for its Shaheen ballistic missile.


Turkey sees nuclear power Pakistan as a strategic ally and potential partner in building its Siper long-range missile-defense project and TF-X fighter jet, the people familiar said, speaking on condition of anonymity to discuss strategic goals. The people didn’t say whether the talks have gotten to the point of seeking Beijing’s consent to share Chinese defense technology. China’s Foreign Ministry didn’t respond to requests for comment on the issue.


Pakistan Looks to Aviation in Ambitious Defense Export Push

Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan has hailed “very serious potential” for collaboration with Pakistan on defense projects, and top defense officials have met in recent months. Pakistani Defense Secretary Mian Muhammad Hilal Hussain met with top Turkish officials including Defense Minister Hulusi Akar in December, and discussed defense industry cooperation, the people familiar said. Akar has also met with Pakistan’s defense minister, military chief and air force chief, and accompanied Erdogan on a visit to Pakistan over the past year.
The latest in global politics

The countries already have some cooperation in the defense industry, including co-producing warships Turkey has sold Pakistan.
Turkish adoption of Chinese military technology could cause new frictions with the U.S., which would be loath to see Ankara move further away from the western military alliance. Washington is already sanctioning Turkey for buying a missile-defense system from Russia, and has suspended Turkish companies from participating in the development of Lockheed Martin Corp.’s F-35 stealth fighter jet.
The Turkish officials who spoke on the contacts with Pakistan said the outreach meshes with Ankara’s aspiration to become a power center in an increasingly multipolar world.

Turkey signed the S-400 deal with Russia two years after it scrapped plans to buy a Chinese missile defense system, under pressure from the U.S. Ankara is now negotiating a potential purchase of a second S-400 system, and a co-production deal with Moscow.

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[Cabatli_TR]

Turkey sees nuclear power Pakistan as a strategic ally and potential partner in building its Siper long-range missile-defense project and TF-X fighter jet, the people familiar said, speaking on condition of anonymity to discuss strategic goals.

Potential partner for Siper and TfX ! Great news If It is true.

 

[Anmdt]

Turkey Expands War Tech Search by Tapping Pakistan’s China Ties​

By
Selcan Hacaoglu
2. März 2021, 11:32 MEZ

• Turkey wants to produce fighter jets, missiles with Pakistan
• Pakistan makes jets with China, said to use its missile design

A Pakistan Air Force JF-17 Thunder jet, manufactured by Chengdu Aircraft Corp. of China.
Photographer: Jason Alden/Bloomberg


Turkey is pushing to co-manufacture warplanes and missiles with Pakistan, a hookup that could also give it access to prized war technology from China.


Turkish defense and government officials have held periodic talks with Pakistani counterparts -- the last high-level discussion was in January -- about developing and manufacturing military hardware with Pakistan, according to people from both countries who are familiar with the negotiations. The people didn’t say when they’ll meet again or how close they are to an agreement.


A deal would get NATO-member Turkey closer to some of China’s military technology. Pakistan builds its JF-17 fighter jets with China and is said to have adapted Chinese designs for its Shaheen ballistic missile.


Turkey sees nuclear power Pakistan as a strategic ally and potential partner in building its Siper long-range missile-defense project and TF-X fighter jet, the people familiar said, speaking on condition of anonymity to discuss strategic goals. The people didn’t say whether the talks have gotten to the point of seeking Beijing’s consent to share Chinese defense technology. China’s Foreign Ministry didn’t respond to requests for comment on the issue.


Pakistan Looks to Aviation in Ambitious Defense Export Push

Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan has hailed “very serious potential” for collaboration with Pakistan on defense projects, and top defense officials have met in recent months. Pakistani Defense Secretary Mian Muhammad Hilal Hussain met with top Turkish officials including Defense Minister Hulusi Akar in December, and discussed defense industry cooperation, the people familiar said. Akar has also met with Pakistan’s defense minister, military chief and air force chief, and accompanied Erdogan on a visit to Pakistan over the past year.
The latest in global politics

The countries already have some cooperation in the defense industry, including co-producing warships Turkey has sold Pakistan.
Turkish adoption of Chinese military technology could cause new frictions with the U.S., which would be loath to see Ankara move further away from the western military alliance. Washington is already sanctioning Turkey for buying a missile-defense system from Russia, and has suspended Turkish companies from participating in the development of Lockheed Martin Corp.’s F-35 stealth fighter jet.
The Turkish officials who spoke on the contacts with Pakistan said the outreach meshes with Ankara’s aspiration to become a power center in an increasingly multipolar world.

Turkey signed the S-400 deal with Russia two years after it scrapped plans to buy a Chinese missile defense system, under pressure from the U.S. Ankara is now negotiating a potential purchase of a second S-400 system, and a co-production deal with Moscow.

Bloomberg - Are you a robot?

Sorry but only 10% of the article makes sense, rest is trash

 

[Glass🚬]

Sorry but only 10% of the article makes sense, rest is trash

We will see how things will develop.

 

[Anmdt]

We will see how things will develop.

At least from this point on Turkey doesn't need to have access any tech from China.
Cooperation with Pakistan is high likely but it has nothing to do with China.

 

[Glass🚬]

At least from this point on Turkey doesn't need to have access any tech from China.
Cooperation with Pakistan is high likely but it has nothing to do with China.

An upcoming cooperation with Pakistan will one way another also bring in the Chinese.

 

[Anmdt]

An upcoming cooperation with Pakistan will one way another also bring in the Chinese.

And It shouldn't.

 

[the]

What does Pakistan have to gain out of this? Drone technology? I doubt Baykar would accept the possibility of China having access to hardware (the drones) or the software. Sure, they may be able to jointly produce the TF-X, but then you risk competitors gaining access to an arguably more significant and confidential programme.

If NATO/USA cannot permit S-400s inactivated, then why would they accept the possibility of China having a backdoor to a NATO member's national fighter programme?

 

[Glass🚬]

What does Pakistan have to gain out of this? Drone technology? I doubt Baykar would accept the possibility of China having access to hardware (the drones) or the software. Sure, they may be able to jointly produce the TF-X, but then you risk competitors gaining access to an arguably more significant and confidential programme.

If NATO/USA cannot permit S-400s inactivated, then why would they accept the possibility of China having a backdoor to a NATO member's national fighter programme?

SIPER, TF-X are projects which outlive NATO´s existence. USA will be even more irrelevant in the coming years.

And It shouldn't.

This century is theirs, cooporation should be explored where its possible and the chinese are the nation which are becoming more advanced then the americans. That is just the way it is. Important to remain rational and look at the things from a mid- to longterm perspective.

 

[Anmdt]

This century is theirs, cooporation should be explored where its possible and the chinese are the nation which are becoming more advanced then the americans. That is just the way it is. Important to remain rational and look at the things from a mid- to longterm perspective

The century is either theirs or not theirs,i would be in favor of being not "theirs"
We have nearly nothing common with China, starting from culture, religion, national habits and ending up with greater strategic goals.

 

[Blank1]

What does Pakistan have to gain out of this? Drone technology? I doubt Baykar would accept the possibility of China having access to hardware (the drones) or the software. Sure, they may be able to jointly produce the TF-X, but then you risk competitors gaining access to an arguably more significant and confidential programme.

If NATO/USA cannot permit S-400s inactivated, then why would they accept the possibility of China having a backdoor to a NATO member's national fighter programme?

Look at it this way " What will we gain from this ? " If there is even an ounce of truth to this, It is still significant. Pakistan is the only Muslim country with nuclear and missile program with full echo system. They just don't bluster about it. In the past they were accused of too generous in sharing the tech but they say all accusations are base less. We need there help if we want our rights to be secured c/z we need parallel weapons what our enemies have, nuke for nuke & missile for missile.
If we sell them or precisely if the decide to buy our drone they are our brothers they will respect our concerns, Just like they haven't let the Chinese to look into F16s.
They have a program called "Project Azm" which includes anti ballistic missile defence system, 5th gen jet, MALE drone & respective ammo, They will love our partner ship as we have same goals.

 

[the]

Look at it this way " What will we gain from this ? " If there is even an ounce of truth to this, It is still significant. Pakistan is the only Muslim country with nuclear and missile program with full echo system. They just don't bluster about it. In the past they were accused of too generous in sharing the tech but they say all accusations are base less. We need there help if we want our rights to be secured c/z we need parallel weapons what our enemies have, nuke for nuke & missile for missile.
If we sell them or precisely if the decide to buy our drone they are our brothers they will respect our concerns, Just like they haven't let the Chinese to look into F16s.
They have a program called "Project Azam" which includes anti ballistic missile defence system, 5th gen jet, MALE drone & respective ammo, They will love our partner ship as we have same goals.

It's not really the same. One would think that by now, most developed nations could produce a nuclear weapon if they wanted to. Yes, it provides the state with prestige amongst the international stage, but at what consequence? North Korea sits on one of the most resource rich regions in the world. Yet, there economic and social growth is hindered by the pursuit for nuclear weapons.
It's not as if the TAF is going to deploy nukes against the PKK or Daesh, so obviously a more conventional form of weapon (in the form of drones) is used.

 

[xizhimen]

The century is either theirs or not theirs,i would be in favor of being not "theirs"
We have nearly nothing common with China, starting from culture, religion, national habits and ending up with greater strategic goals.

We don't care whose century it is, as long as it's not America's, we'll be happy.

 

[Blank1]

It's not really the same. One would think that by now, most developed nations could produce a nuclear weapon if they wanted to. Yes, it provides the state with prestige amongst the international stage, but at what consequence? North Korea sits on one of the most resource rich regions in the world. Yet, there economic and social growth is hindered by the pursuit for nuclear weapons.
It's not as if the TAF is going to deploy nukes against the PKK or Daesh, so obviously a more conventional form of weapon (in the form of drones) is used.

I also mentioned about 5th gen jets, missiles and ballistic missile defence. If developing a nuke was that easy!
There will always be consequences to have a nuke BUT only for those who don't bow to US, North Korea is a best example. If Iraq or Libya had nukes results would be different or at least they would be intact.
Now amount of drones can eliminate PKK as long they got constantly supplied with every thing they need from their dady.

 

[Cabatli_TR]

Mr Çavuşoğlu: Pakistan wants to join Milden national submarine program. Most likely negotiations are proceeding.

Bloomberg: Turkey and Pakistan are negotiating for Siper long range SAM and TF-X partnership.

If an official deal are signed for these programs, Turkey and Pakistan will combine own armed forces with common national platforms. This strategy will enhance operational capabilities of both country to the another level. When these products are matured, I believe Other countries will follow the steps of Pakistan.

Other programs that Pakistan selected Turkey;

• Milgem
• T-129 Atak
• Midget submarine program
• Agosta submarine upgrade
• Fleet replenishment tanker
• AselPod

 

[Cabatli_TR]

Btw, Malaysia was another country interested in Tf-X partnership. First metal of TfX has been cut in recent weeks. We may see generals from both country at roll out ceremony of TfX to be held on March 18, 2023.

 

[Kaptaan]

One thing you guys can bet on. Because of the danger from India, a country with nearly 7 times population of Pakistan* going forward the armed forces will recieve primary importance and investment. This is notr a country that in 20 years will have a token military. Rest assured the military will be built up one way or another. Expect triad nuclear deterance, land/air/submarine and nuke powered subs at some point. So it would be very advantagous for both countries to cooperate in building future platforms.

*Imagine Turkey facing every European country including Russia alone. This staggering disparity is what drives the focus on military development in Pakstan.

 

[what]

We don't care whose century it is, as long as it's not America's, we'll be happy.

Be careful what you wish for, could be the return of the Mongols /s.

 

[what]

Mr Çavuşoğlu: Pakistan wants to join Milden national submarine program. Most likely negotiations are proceeding.

Bloomberg: Turkey and Pakistan are negotiating for Siper long range SAM and TF-X partnership.

If an official deal are signed for these programs, Turkey and Pakistan will combine own armed forces with common national platforms. This strategy will enhance operational capabilities of both country to the another level. When these products are matured, I believe Other countries will follow the steps of Pakistan.

Other programs that Pakistan selected Turkey;

• Milgem
• T-129 Atak
• Midget submarine program
• Agosta submarine upgrade
• Fleet replenishment tanker
• AselPod

This is the kind of cooperation I want to see, it will make the development more feasible and the products cheaper because they will be ordered in bigger numbers by two countries.

Source for the selected programs by any chance?