Indonesian Politics (History, Issue, culture etc)

schuimpjes

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However, limiting accessing porn content to adult is practically impossible.
I don't want to limit for the adult, only the children. Actually, I don't know why must limit the children too and I really supporting sex education (children have to have a knowledge about that too, no joke) , but assume we do that for the sake of "budaya or other obscure things".

The current administration is actually doing that. Unfortunately, with so many hardships (too long to list) either deliberately or accidentally imposed by our own gov't in day to day life, many would flock to radicalization narrative even without religious motive in the first place (saw that happen to 2 of my personal friend)
Damn, 2 poor people.
 

schuimpjes

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Based on this article, CIA ever gave a recommendation to PRRI to attack Caltex refinery facility (US Company) to drive Seventh Fleet to attack Indonesia.

And the article above also talking little bit about Prabowo Subianto's father (Soemitro Djojohadikusumo).

Edit : False Flag like that ever proposed as Operation Northwoods. Attacking American people itself and American Companies in South, especially Florida and around Cuba, as an excuse to attack Castro's Cuba.

But, that proposed operation never happened because JFK didn't want that cold blooded operation to happened.
 
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schuimpjes

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"Salah satu hambatan kecil terjadi ketika siswa Indonesia mengikuti keahlian “Perlindungan VIP” dan berlatih menggunakan senjata merek Uzi. Penggunaan senjata buatan Israel itu agak mengundang kontroversi, karena walaupun Mossad diam-diam telah memberikan bantuan periodik kepada Bakin sejak 1969, namun tetap saja menyetok senjata buatan Israel dipandang sebagai isu yang terlalu sensitif secara politik."

 

Parry Brima

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Menkominfo should be abolished, along with lembaga sensor

In terms of movies, I think we still need lembaga sensor. Those movie theatre chains don't care about movie rating, all they care is money.

I once watched a movie with "Dewasa" rating and there were several kids in front of me, without their parents/elders, buying the tickets.

I protested to the box office clerk, why you sold them tickets to watch "Dewasa" rated movie? She answered lightly "filmnya ga ada apa2xnya koq...."

:D
 

schuimpjes

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"Amerika memberikan bantuan keuangan secara rahasia untuk menggaji 60 personel, kendaraan untuk pengintaian, biaya sewa rumah aman (safe house) di Jalan Jatinegara Timur Jakarta Timur, tape recorder mutakhir merek Sony TC-800, serta peralatan penyadap telepon."

US paid the salary of Satsus Intel (Satuan Khusus Intelijen) of Deputi II BAKIN personnel back then wtf wkwk. So the salary was by the US + Indonesian Government.

Ampun pak harto.
 

trishna_amrta

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A simplified history of Nusantara. I somehow perceived many here (Indonesian posters) not aware of some major history of our Nusantara. These cartoon target audience is US elementary school student so its get simplified a lot and not very accurate for my taste. However, because of that I choose these series because of it making it far easier for the younger demographic to understand





 

schuimpjes

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Aidit ever hugged the man that killed communism, Deng Xiaoping.

PRC that you see now is because of his experiment to applicate Capitalism in Shenzen which turn out to be really great.
 

Gundala

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"Amerika memberikan bantuan keuangan secara rahasia untuk menggaji 60 personel, kendaraan untuk pengintaian, biaya sewa rumah aman (safe house) di Jalan Jatinegara Timur Jakarta Timur, tape recorder mutakhir merek Sony TC-800, serta peralatan penyadap telepon."

US paid the salary of Satsus Intel (Satuan Khusus Intelijen) of Deputi II BAKIN personnel back then wtf wkwk. So the salary was by the US + Indonesian Government.

Ampun pak harto.
LOL, there are more to it if we look at the history. Back then the word "Kalibata" really deter people ;)
There are few overseas operation conducted by our intel officers thats worth mentioning to remember, but it seems like those things are still lock in the box after decades. Too bad, those people can't be recognized at least by their hard works without mentioning names. Specially those ops that were conducted in South East Asia Region.
 

schuimpjes

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Specially those ops that were conducted in South East Asia Region.
@Gundala
This was one of them
Screenshot_2021-01-08-17-57-51-839_com.android.chrome.jpg

Ali Moertopo, head of Opsus (de jure part of Bakin, de facto standalone organization) . The case of ex DI/TII members used to hunt the PKI member was one of the case that Opsus was different with Bakin. That ex DI/TII members were funded by Ali Moertopo by using EHEM EHEM Ibnu Sutowo's Pertamina money, you know lah wkwk.

You can read Kenneth Conboy's book "Intel: Inside Indonesia's Intelligence Service", this book is a gold mine.

Note: Red circle on picture above is about Opsus arming Lon Nol (Anti-Communist) in Cambodia. Lon Nol was fought against Khmer Rouge (Red Khmer).
 
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Gundala

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Ali Moertopo, head of Opsus (de jure part of Bakin, de facto standalone organization) . The case of ex DI/TII members used to hunt the PKI member was one of the case that Opsus was different with Bakin. That ex DI/TII members were funded by Ali Moertopo by using EHEM EHEM Ibnu Sutowo's Pertamina money, you know lah wkwk.

You can read Kenneth Conboy's book "Intel: Inside Indonesia's Intelligence Service", this book is a gold mine.

Note: Red circle on picture above is about Opsus arming Long Nol (Anti-Communist) in Cambodia. Long Nol was fought against Khmer Rouge (Red Khmer).
Kenneth Conboy really make some interesting books, the one about RPKAD is also interesting. When we combine those with autobiography of some generals such as Benny Murdani and others we could connect the dots and see how we can conduct overseas intel ops with good results back then. That Cambodia ops outcome continue until now with Kopasus members still doing training.

Also there are some autobiography from "not so famous" generals that further explain in more detail of their field operation. The only thing that still make me so "kepo" but couldnt find any book that gives more information is about that opsus in Vietnam you mentioned in Kenneth's book. I only have few information from hearsay, but thats about it. Tho one retired US general have said in one University discussion forum that Indonesia play some parts in Vietnam war, most likely he was talking about intel ops (the one that can only be seen but unable to give a fact/covert ops).
 

schuimpjes

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Indonesia play some parts in Vietnam war,
Both covert and overt. The overt was Garuda Contingent that deployed in at least 1973, Dading Kalbuadi was one of the guys that deployed to Vietnam.

That Garuda Contingent was not for war right there, but only to make sure everything was went on as planned as in Paris Peace Accords, this mission was named ICCS (prisoners exchange etc, part of Vietnamization). Canada was there same as us before, but get sick of 2 (or more) participating communist countries and replaced by Iran.

 
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Var Dracon

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A simplified history of Nusantara. I somehow perceived many here (Indonesian posters) not aware of some major history of our Nusantara. These cartoon target audience is US elementary school student so its get simplified a lot and not very accurate for my taste. However, because of that I choose these series because of it making it far easier for the younger demographic to understand





Still has inaccuracies. The Majapahit ships are depicted as the ships in Borobudur temple carvings, which are 500 years older. Even modern historian declared it as sesat (misguided) and menyesatkan (misleading). The usage of borobudur ships after 1200 AD is doubtful. The ships used by Majapahit navy are jong, malangbang, kelulus, (these three being the main), and also lancaran, penjajap, pelang, jongkong, cerucuh, tongkang.

Also, the Majapahit warriors are depicted as (maaf) primitive: They are bare-chested and armed with spears, blades, and bows. While these equipments may be true for lower level soldier (practically Nusantaran - not only Javanese - armies employed forced levies even until 19th century - the bulk of the army is mustered from local villagers without pay, the only form of pay is loot), there are also trained troops (such as Bhayangkara) who used more sophisticated weapon and armor.
Gajah Mada in the video is depicted using gray-colored armor - in reality he used gold-decorated armor.
 

Madokafc

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Still has inaccuracies. The Majapahit ships are depicted as the ships in Borobudur temple carvings, which are 500 years older. Even modern historian declared it as sesat (misguided) and menyesatkan (misleading). The usage of borobudur ships after 1200 AD is doubtful. The ships used by Majapahit navy are jong, malangbang, kelulus, (these three being the main), and also lancaran, penjajap, pelang, jongkong, cerucuh, tongkang.

Also, the Majapahit warriors are depicted as (maaf) primitive: They are bare-chested and armed with spears, blades, and bows. While these equipments may be true for lower level soldier (practically Nusantaran - not only Javanese - armies employed forced levies even until 19th century - the bulk of the army is mustered from local villagers without pay, the only form of pay is loot), there are also trained troops (such as Bhayangkara) who used more sophisticated weapon and armor.
Gajah Mada in the video is depicted using gray-colored armor - in reality he used gold-decorated armor.

You know lah at the time, even European nobles or kingdom Levy is mostly spear armed peasants with fur jacket or coats and only nobles, squire and knight order using elaborate armor , and even then only handfull of them have and maintain warhorse.

Majapahit armies at the time mostly consist of Naval infantry, and they are relatively lightly equipped but heavily armed and have plethora of support weaponry and guns. Their Conquest of Tumasik is glaring example of Majapahit Navy and Naval infantry prowess. Btw, with the more affluent later era of Majapahit, it seems their armies protection equipment and weaponry become more complex and elaborate. Waju Rante or Chainmail had been used by officers and cuirass is too
 

Madokafc

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I wonder what would be happened if it's Surabaya who won the Java hegemony during long war of Surabaya- Mataram in the 16th Century. They are clearly more Naval oriented forces , had promoting Shipyard industry and trade and had expanding vision too among Islands in Nusantara.
 

trishna_amrta

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Still has inaccuracies. The Majapahit ships are depicted as the ships in Borobudur temple carvings, which are 500 years older. Even modern historian declared it as sesat (misguided) and menyesatkan (misleading). The usage of borobudur ships after 1200 AD is doubtful. The ships used by Majapahit navy are jong, malangbang, kelulus, (these three being the main), and also lancaran, penjajap, pelang, jongkong, cerucuh, tongkang.
As I had stated previously, it was over simplified, thus not historically accurate as details goes. Those video series were meant for US grade school.

Also, the Majapahit warriors are depicted as (maaf) primitive: They are bare-chested and armed with spears, blades, and bows. While these equipments may be true for lower level soldier (practically Nusantaran - not only Javanese - armies employed forced levies even until 19th century - the bulk of the army is mustered from local villagers without pay, the only form of pay is loot), there are also trained troops (such as Bhayangkara) who used more sophisticated weapon and armor.
Gajah Mada in the video is depicted using gray-colored armor - in reality he used gold-decorated armor.
Who need body armour when you already have "Kanuragan". Anyway, body armour isn't always practical in a tropical environment. Try marching while wearing a modern plate carrier (along with the ballistic plates), and you will know what I'm talking about.

There are archaeological evidence of scale armour. And I'm guessing our Mahapatih (referring to Gajah Mada here, not the current one) was described to wear breastplate, which make a lot of sense considering it's the most practical form of body armour in a tropical environment.

You know lah at the time, even European nobles or kingdom Levy is mostly spear armed peasants with fur jacket or coats and only nobles, squire and knight order using elaborate armor , and even then only handfull of them have and maintain warhorse.
European levies at the time period typically wear maille armour. However, one should be wary that that armour at the time (even today) were made to a vastly different standard. The maille that the levies (peasant troops) was wearing are most likely of lower quality (butted maille rather than riveted) than those worn by the nobility. The only reason European at the time could afford better armour is simply they have the climate that support the wearing of multi layered armour, and nothing to do with financing or metalworking capability.

I wonder what would be happened if it's Surabaya who won the Java hegemony during long war of Surabaya- Mataram in the 16th Century. They are clearly more Naval oriented forces , had promoting Shipyard industry and trade and had expanding vision too among Islands in Nusantara.
Surabaya (city state), doesn't seek territorial hegemony in traditional sense. They were aiming for securing more trade / commerce influence. Their expansion was limited to securing trading post & ports, similar to those of European chartered companies such as VOC in the later period. While Mataram seek for territorial expansion in traditional sense.
 

Ryder

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Honestly I would love to read more about the Ottoman Empire and its relations with Aceh Sultanate and the various Sultanates in Indonesia.

I really wonder the curiousity of the Turks visiting Indonesia. For sure it was quite the different experience.

I wonder if any Turks might have stayed and settled.
 

Indos

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Honestly I would love to read more about the Ottoman Empire and its relations with Aceh Sultanate and the various Sultanates in Indonesia.

I really wonder the curiousity of the Turks visiting Indonesia. For sure it was quite the different experience.

I wonder if any Turks might have stayed and settled.

Yup there are many Turkish decent in Aceh, not only Turkish, but also Persian and Arab decent as well. Offspring of Turkish soldiers sent from Turkey to help Aceh Sultanate fight against Portuguese
 

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