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In anticipation of a friend joining this forum (hopefully soon) to discuss a question posed to me elsewhere, I figured I would start a thread for it more generally.
For first point of discussion, he wanted to discuss the captains/heroes/guests list of Homer--->Joyce---->Fitzgerald in Illiad, Ulysses and Great Gatsby respectively.
IMO, the influences are clear and I think there are some broad similarities in syntax but also differences (I find Joyce goes most tongue in cheek given some of the names he includes).
Fitzgerald definitely after all gives a more heady explanation concurrently with each set of characters rather than just list them in bulk like the previous two. But it makes sense in the context for fitzgerald to employ that given setting and nature of the story (especially at that point) if you think about it relative to the previous two (literary influences w.r.t this "list").
For reference:
Illiad (Homer) famous list:
(Starts at: "And now, O Muses, dwellers in the mansions of Olympus, tell me- for you are goddesses and are in all places so that you see all things, while we know nothing but by report- who were the chiefs and princes of the Danaans? As for the common soldiers, they were so that I could not name every single one of them though I had ten tongues, and though my voice failed not and my heart were of bronze within me, unless you, O Olympian Muses, daughters of aegis-bearing Jove, were to recount them to me. Nevertheless, I will tell the captains of the ships and all the fleet together." )
Ulysses (Joyce):
(Starts at: "From his girdle hung a row of seastones which dangled at every movement of his portentous frame and on these were graven with rude yet striking art the tribal images of many Irish heroes and heroines of antiquity," ...)
Great Gatsby (Fitzgerald):
(Starts at: "Once I wrote down on the empty spaces of a time-table the names of those who came to Gatsby's house that summer. It is an old time-table now, disintegrating at its folds and headed "This schedule in effect July 5th, 1922." But I can still read the grey names and they will give you a better impression than my generalities of those who accepted Gatsby's hospitality and paid him the subtle tribute of knowing nothing whatever about him.")
@Joe Shearer (when he is back) @Saiyan0321 et al.
Buddy will make himself known here I suppose when he (hopefully) joins
For first point of discussion, he wanted to discuss the captains/heroes/guests list of Homer--->Joyce---->Fitzgerald in Illiad, Ulysses and Great Gatsby respectively.
IMO, the influences are clear and I think there are some broad similarities in syntax but also differences (I find Joyce goes most tongue in cheek given some of the names he includes).
Fitzgerald definitely after all gives a more heady explanation concurrently with each set of characters rather than just list them in bulk like the previous two. But it makes sense in the context for fitzgerald to employ that given setting and nature of the story (especially at that point) if you think about it relative to the previous two (literary influences w.r.t this "list").
For reference:
Illiad (Homer) famous list:
The Internet Classics Archive | The Iliad by Homer
The Iliad by Homer, part of the Internet Classics Archive
classics.mit.edu
(Starts at: "And now, O Muses, dwellers in the mansions of Olympus, tell me- for you are goddesses and are in all places so that you see all things, while we know nothing but by report- who were the chiefs and princes of the Danaans? As for the common soldiers, they were so that I could not name every single one of them though I had ten tongues, and though my voice failed not and my heart were of bronze within me, unless you, O Olympian Muses, daughters of aegis-bearing Jove, were to recount them to me. Nevertheless, I will tell the captains of the ships and all the fleet together." )
Ulysses (Joyce):
(Starts at: "From his girdle hung a row of seastones which dangled at every movement of his portentous frame and on these were graven with rude yet striking art the tribal images of many Irish heroes and heroines of antiquity," ...)
Great Gatsby (Fitzgerald):
(Starts at: "Once I wrote down on the empty spaces of a time-table the names of those who came to Gatsby's house that summer. It is an old time-table now, disintegrating at its folds and headed "This schedule in effect July 5th, 1922." But I can still read the grey names and they will give you a better impression than my generalities of those who accepted Gatsby's hospitality and paid him the subtle tribute of knowing nothing whatever about him.")
@Joe Shearer (when he is back) @Saiyan0321 et al.
Buddy will make himself known here I suppose when he (hopefully) joins
