TR TF-X KAAN | F-16 Özgür | Hürjet | Hürkuş - Fighter & Trainer Aircraft Projects

[MADDOG]

İsmail Demir looks to be giving safe dates. TAI can fly the TF-X in late 2023.

 

[uçuyorum]

It's been this way for a while, İsmail Demir is always being more careful and Temel Kotil being more ambitious with statements and dates.

 

[Cabatli_TR]

Mr. Demir didnt want 2 jet aircraft projects developed at the same time but Mr. Kotil insisted on this and they have developed Hurjet with their own resources. Although the boss of defence industry is Mr. Demir, the CEO of company is Mr. Kotil. Ultimately, I think due to Kotil's ambitious stance and risk loving and excited nature, the company will prepare TFX and fly by the end of this year or the beginning of 2024 at the latest.

 

[MADDOG]

Mr. Demir didnt want 2 jet aircraft projects developed at the same time but Mr. Kotil insisted on this and they have developed Hurjet with their own resources. Although the boss of defence industry is Mr. Demir, the CEO of company is Mr. Kotil. Ultimately, I think due to Kotil's ambitious stance and risk loving and excited nature, the company will prepare TFX and fly by the end of this year or the beginning of 2024 at the latest.

Precisely so. I know Kotil and Demir from their THY days

 

[Bogeyman]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1639529472884977665

(Is Eurofighter or Tempest on the agenda?)

Our agenda is to work on our own planes.

It should be demonstrated that Turkey is not without alternatives. All options should be considered.

Tempest is not on our agenda at the moment.

While meeting with the UK at the beginning of the MMU project, we said that while there was no project like TEMPEST, MMU could be a joint project.

They said they weren't interested. A year later, they announced the project themselves. It was a test of sincerity. They failed that test.

 

[Bürküt]

"It was a test of sincerity" harsh words that someone in this position shouldn't say...

 

[Combat-Master]

"It was a test of sincerity" harsh words that someone in this position shouldn't say...

I still remember when Temel Kotil while standing next to British ambassador said, that maybe one day Turkey may sell TFX to the UK.. .. ... . . . .......... . . ....... . . ..

 

[Heartbang]

I still remember when Temel Kotil while standing next to British ambassador said, that maybe one day Turkey may sell TFX to the UK.. .. ... . . . .......... . . ....... . . ..

Selling TFX to UK sounds quite bonkers on the tin but its not implausible for TFX to out-sell the F-35 when all is said and done.

 

[YeşilVatan]

Selling TFX to UK sounds quite bonkers on the tin but its not implausible for TFX to out-sell the F-35.

When we finally do mass production, other states will notice. There is a non-zero percent possibility that we arm a third of the planet because westerners have that ivory stick up their rectum and chinese products are subpar.

 

[Heartbang]

When we finally do mass production, other states will notice. There is a non-zero percent possibility that we arm a third of the planet because westerners have that ivory stick up their rectum and chinese products are subpar.

Exactly.

 

[Combat-Master]

Selling TFX to UK sounds quite bonkers on the tin but its not implausible for TFX to out-sell the F-35.

Well for the UK to come out a few months later with the Tempest, that was indeed a silly remark - I'd just be happy BAE is holding hands in developing TFX. Imagine if SAAB was still involved with TFX, what a nightmare it would have been. Our politicians and heads of companies certainly need to be more aware of what they put out there.

As for TFX out-selling F-35, improbable but not impossible, like 1% chance of that happening.

 

[Sanchez]

Highly doubt TF-X will ever be cheaper to produce than F-35. It's 80mil a piece now because they built 800 and keep building more. What keeps F-35 from being the most produced modern jet ever is US not selling it to anyone.

 

[GoatsMilk]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1639529472884977665

(Is Eurofighter or Tempest on the agenda?)

Our agenda is to work on our own planes.

It should be demonstrated that Turkey is not without alternatives. All options should be considered.

Tempest is not on our agenda at the moment.

While meeting with the UK at the beginning of the MMU project, we said that while there was no project like TEMPEST, MMU could be a joint project.

They said they weren't interested. A year later, they announced the project themselves. It was a test of sincerity. They failed that test.

His last statement is a little bit odd. I get that while Turkiye was unaware of the tempest project that they offered joint development on the MMU. Ok they were not interested and then a year later they announced their own project.

But isnt that business? The UK is doing whats in her own interests just like it would have been in our interests to joint develop with the UK because they have lots of abilities and history in the field?

The "sincerity" part i don't understand, were things implied behind the scenes?

 

[Heartbang]

Highly doubt TF-X will ever be cheaper to produce than F-35. It's 80mil a piece now because they built 800 and keep building more.

It was in excess of 100 million dollars initially. Came to 80 million mark on the merit of those 800 units. We'll start at that mark and only go down from there, all while delivering an equally competent, if not exceedingly superior platform.

Mark my words, TFX WILL outsell the F-35.

 

[boredaf]

Mark my words, TFX WILL outsell the F-35.

I'll eat a model of F-35 if that ever happens. I understand being excited and proud but letting it go to our heads this much is dangerous. No need to turn into Russia and lose ourselves in our own hype while not even having a end product in our hands.

 

[TheInsider]

TFX can't outsell the F-35 period. It is not possible. We have no production capacity for it. We can't produce 150 TFX per year. We can never match the production rate of the F-35 production line. The moment TFX is available for sale all the production slots will be full I agree but even with an 8-per-month production rate, TAI can only produce 96 TFX per year and i have huge doubts that TAI can scale production to that level. Don't forget that means we need to produce 16 engines, 8 Burfis RF suite etc per month.

I like Temel Kotils stance on the MMU. Turkiye should take calculated risks. We are underdogs and taking risks is the only way we can climb to the top. We can't wait till 2025 for the first flight. We have a fighter that can do taxi tests I think the end of 2023 for the first flight is a logical risk to take. TAI should deliver a completed TFX in 2028 at the latest.

 

[Combat-Master]

I will resist the urge to Temel Koat things

 

[MADDOG]

 

[boredaf]

We have no production capacity for it.

It's not even just that, buying F-35 (or most other big military purchases) aren't just about F-35 itself, it is about being on the good side of the US. On top of not having the production capacity for it, we don't have the same standing with as many rich countries as US does. Not to mention some of those countries were also partners in F-35 project.

I'd be perfectly happy with being able to produce our own jet by ourselves, any export is just a bonus on top of that.

 

[TheInsider]

TFX will be sold out the moment it is available. There is a huge market out there. I expect some F-35 users to also buy TFX for air superiority and form a hi-lo mix. I expect TurAF to buy 24 TFX per year for roughly 2 billion $ at the start of the production. TAI will probably export 24 TFX per year on top of that by increasing the production in 2030-2032. TFX production will probably switch to a national engine in 2030.