TR Turkish Air Forces|News & Discussion

boredaf

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So there is a reason why Germans put almost nothing but air defense missiles on their ships. They were just hoping one of them might not fail.
We are talking about a country that couldn't even keep their armoured vehicles, which weren't even old, in a good enough condition to join a NATO exercise.
 

Sanchez

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9871 was delivered to Turkey in 2019 :( Sitting there, no external modifications visible. Hope HavaSOJ get some steam soon.
"Canadian Ambassador to Turkey, Georgia and Azerbaijan Kevin HAMILTON shared an image of the Bombardier Global 6000 Business Jet with tail number 9871 and registration number TC-SJC, one of the four aircraft (9854, 9855, 9869 and 9871) purchased from Canadian Bombardier under the HAVA SOJ Program, taken at TAI facilities. TAI had also purchased a second-hand Bombardier Global 6000 Business Jet in 2023 for modification for Test Bed (KAAN MMU/TF-X Program) purposes, which had flown in the USA in 2015 with the tail registration number N10HD. ASELSAN completed the Factory Acceptance Tests (FAT) of the mission system to be installed on the first HAVA SOJ Aircraft (Bombardier Global 6000 Business Jet with tail number 9854) in December 2023, and the Certification procedures were expected to be completed as of February 4. Following the completion of the certification procedures, the HAVA SOJ Mission System consoles and electronic equipment will be installed on the first aircraft. ASELSAN aims to complete the FAT process of the mission systems and payloads to be used in the second and third HAVA SOJ aircraft by the end of 2024. According to the information I have obtained, there will only be a change regarding the new generation MİLSİS ELINT Pod to be carried under the wing of the HAVA SOJ Aircraft. Deliveries under the HAVA SOJ Project are targeted to be completed by 2028."

 

Chocopie

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Actually their armament ain‘t so bad (could be more VLS cells for its destroyer displacement).

Sachsen class frigates are armed with:
1x 76mm OTO Melara gun
32x VLS (SM2 IIIA or quad-packed ESSM)
2x RAM launchers as CIWS
8x Harpoon AShM
6x MU90 light torpedos
2x 27mm autocannon

SM2 have also anti-ship capability. Missiles aren‘t 100% failsafe, especially onboard a ship (vibrations, sea-water, climate conditions). Without reloading possibility at sea every VLS cell is worth gold. Now ze Germans flushed $3.5 million down the toilet into the Red Sea.
 

UcanTost

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This is what happens when you buy western even when you are a western nation.
American made SM-2 missiles of Germany "malfunctioned" when they fired upon ghost American drone.
To this day there are people who say we should have bought Patriot and F-35. May as well become another colony of westerners while at it.
Fake news and not about exocet missiles in farkland wars
 

Fuzuli NL

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This is what happens when you buy western even when you are a western nation.
American made SM-2 missiles of Germany "malfunctioned" when they fired upon ghost American drone.
To this day there are people who say we should have bought Patriot and F-35. May as well become another colony of westerners while at it.
ANKArma
 

Fatman17

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Screenshot_20240228_140325_Samsung Internet.jpg
Screenshot_20240228_140325_Samsung Internet.jpg
Screenshot_20240228_140343_Samsung Internet.jpg
 

Sanchez

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All systems hav a 'backdoor'. Remember 'Falkland war' and Exocet issue.
Just seeing this. What Exocet issue? Argentina used every Exocet they had available and depleted their miniscule stocks of ship and air launched Exocets and used them to great effect. We have 6 or 8(last two missiles that missed sometimes being attributed to Gabriels from Israel) Exocet launches from Argentina with 4 hits and 2 misses, and Sheffield and Atlantic Conveyor being sunk as a result. That's a 66% hit conversion and 50% kill rate. For a 70s missile system with tubes for a radio, that's perfect. I wish Harpoons were just as successful in the same 1980s.

Can we please rest this tale of Argentinian Exocets? Multiple people over the years have wrote about the real history in Turkish, it's really sad that same old easily proven myths still persisting.
 

Afif

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for a forum meant to be about discussing defense topics, the turkish posters here are way, way too into boomer dayı conspiracy theories. so childish. it's not even just one or two dudes either. quality of discussion around here is much lower than I thought it'd be..

a guy was around posting about how turkish f16s have backdoors and shit lmao.

Don't be discouraged. There are some really knowledgeable and professional people around here. Stick around and you will find them.
 

Bogeyman 

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Towards the end of the article, the relevant topic is explained under the title "Malvinas".

Just seeing this. What Exocet issue? Argentina used every Exocet they had available and depleted their miniscule stocks of ship and air launched Exocets and used them to great effect. We have 6 or 8(last two missiles that missed sometimes being attributed to Gabriels from Israel) Exocet launches from Argentina with 4 hits and 2 misses, and Sheffield and Atlantic Conveyor being sunk as a result. That's a 66% hit conversion and 50% kill rate. For a 70s missile system with tubes for a radio, that's perfect. I wish Harpoons were just as successful in the same 1980s.

Can we please rest this tale of Argentinian Exocets? Multiple people over the years have wrote about the real history in Turkish, it's really sad that same old easily proven myths still persisting.
I gave a link on the subject.
 

IC3M@N FX

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When America says Russian systems have kill switches or Chinese 5G, routers, chips etc. are not to be trusted these western equipment fanatics believe that instantly but not the other way around even when they confess to it. It is like talking to bunch of love struck teens with love googles that refuse to see what is right in front of their eyes. Pretty pathetic if you ask me.

Let's not kid ourselves.... if we export KAAN or anything complex like an air defense system will have backdoors in both hardware & software.
No country in the world would not want to use that, as a country you always have the risk that the weapons will be passed on or turned against you.
 

Sanchez

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I gave a link on the subject.
I read that years ago, doesn't say much about Exocets. I'll take mission logs from both Argentinians and Brits over "he did this", "she did that". We have days, dates and effects of the missiles visible on the sea in the form of hulking wrecks. Falklands War lasted a little less than 2 months. War started at beginning of April. Sheffield was hit on May 4, Atlantic Conveyor was hit on May 25. These theories all say that Exocet was so super duper effective that Brits ran to the French and forced them to give "source codes" of the missiles so they could stop them and after this French treachery, Exocets were no longer a cause of concern. They do so because they don't know how to read calendars.

This theory requires you to believe that Brits got the necessary info and afterwards Exocets were as good as useless against British ships. This is of course wrong, because from reading through historic records, we know that by June Argentinians were already out of air launched Exocets. They had few ship borne launchers but due to British air superiority and submarines, they were near unable to bring out their ships. So they ingeniously removed few ship borne launchers and used them as fixed positions on land. Exocet that hit Glamorgan on June 12 was from such battery. 2 days later, Argentinian force on the islands would surrender and war would end on June 14. The theory that French giving codes or information about the Exocets leading to Brits nullifying the Exocet threat doesn't hold water, because in the last days of the war, they were still struck by Exocets. They had less than 15-20 missiles. And as said above, when they used them, they used them to great effect, more than you can ask from any weapon system is such heavy EW presence and without good radars. Argentinians were using converted naval radars on C-130s to give themselves an advantage.

Brits of course did all they could to alleviate the threat. We know that MI6 were employed to stop Argentina and neighbours like Peru from getting more Exocets after the war. They mostly failed, as Argentina would later get their new aircraft from France and new Meko frigates and submarines from Germany.
 

Baryshx

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It is about the visit of the Turkish Minister of National Defense to the UK 2 days ago;

When asked whether the Eurofighter issue was on the agenda during the visit of Yaşar Güler, Minister of National Defense, to the UK, ministry sources said: "Our Minister visited the UK upon an official invitation. During this visit, views were exchanged on bilateral and regional defense and security issues. One of the agenda items during this visit was the Eurofighter issue. The positive approach of Germany, one of the Eurofighter consortium countries, on this issue is expected. Technical discussions continue with the representatives of the UK and the manufacturer companies."

 
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Huelague

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Just seeing this. What Exocet issue? Argentina used every Exocet they had available and depleted their miniscule stocks of ship and air launched Exocets and used them to great effect. We have 6 or 8(last two missiles that missed sometimes being attributed to Gabriels from Israel) Exocet launches from Argentina with 4 hits and 2 misses, and Sheffield and Atlantic Conveyor being sunk as a result. That's a 66% hit conversion and 50% kill rate. For a 70s missile system with tubes for a radio, that's perfect. I wish Harpoons were just as successful in the same 1980s.

Can we please rest this tale of Argentinian Exocets? Multiple people over the years have wrote about the real history in Turkish, it's really sad that same old easily proven myths still persisting.
I cant confirm the history of Exocet in Falkland war. It was shown in a reliable german documentary.
 

Saithan

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Can we stop derailing the thread please :) People are free to believe whatever they want.

Personally I find it interesting that 2 missiles would misfire, and I will not rule out that the US drone could have EW capability that would enable "IFF misfire", but that is due to mistrust.

I recall reading an article a few years back about how Military communication device from Swiss, that TSK used, had a backdoor. So I won't rule out anything. If that means we're pushing to develop our own products, that's good enough for me.
 

dBSPL

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I think the key statement in this post is that 'for the first time our F-16s have refueled with the A330 MRTT'. I hope we will see hundreds more, but of course not with a French Air Force plane.
 

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