TR Casual Discussion TOGG - Türkiye's Automotive Joint Venture Group

TR_123456

Experienced member
Staff member
Administrator
Messages
4,743
Reactions
11,609
Nation of residence
Nethelands
Nation of origin
Turkey
Do we have a semiconductor producing company?
 

Combat-Master

Baklava Consumer
Moderator
Messages
3,667
Reactions
15 25,473
Nation of residence
United Kingdom
Nation of origin
Turkey
We still need one,arent there any plans?

Definitely. I haven't read anything about foundries being set up for TOGG - only that TOGGs EV won't suffer from the current component shortages hitting the automotive sector.

Perhaps the government can get all the Turkish electronics giants to form a joint venture group, similar to TOGG...
 

Pilatino

Well-known member
Messages
329
Reactions
3 663
Nation of residence
Turkey
Nation of origin
Turkey

SiRo will establish a factory next to TOGG's production center in Gemlik. The Ministry of Industry and Technology signed the 20 GWh battery investment plan and incentive application file of SiRo, which will operate in domestic battery production at the factory.​



SiRo will establish a factory next to TOGG's production center in Gemlik. The Ministry of Industry and Technology signed the 20 GWh battery investment plan and incentive application file of SiRo, which will operate in domestic battery production at the factory.

Industry and Technology Minister Mustafa Varank received TOGG Chairman Rifat Hisarcıklıoğlu and Farasis Energy Co-Founder and CTO Keith Kepler. During the meeting, Hisarcıklıoğlu and Kepler signed the investment plan and incentive application file.

View attachment 34478



In Comparison. The largest Battery Factories in 2020.

SiRo (Silk Road) 20GW/Year

View attachment 34479
Gw / year vs gw / hour?
 

TheInsider

Experienced member
Professional
Messages
3,785
Solutions
1
Reactions
27 13,599
Nation of residence
Turkey
Nation of origin
Turkey
Gw / year vs gw / hour?
20 GWh/year means the factory will produce 20 GWh of battery every year.
1 GWh=1,000,000 kWh
If we use a battery pack of 80kWh per car this means we can produce 250,000 cars per year.

As for the semiconductors, GaN-based semiconductors will be produced by Aselsan(for the applications like 5G internet), for silicon-based semiconductors, we will go fabless like AMD. Malaysia and TSMC will produce our designs for the products like FPGAs, industrial CPUs or modems. For the high-end semiconductors like high performance GPUs and CPUs, we will cooperate with Qualcomm. And lastly, a lot of semiconductor-based sensors will be produced by Nero Industry.


TR also plans to set up a fab for silicon chips but that will most likely be exclusive to the defense industry.
 
Last edited:

Zafer

Experienced member
Messages
4,416
Reactions
6 7,075
Nation of residence
Turkey
Nation of origin
Turkey
GWh/year means the factory will produce 20 GWh of battery every year.
1 GWh=1,000,000 kWh
If we use a battery pack of 80kWh per car this means we can produce 250,000 cars per year.
That makes 400000 cars at 50kW battery capacity.
 

Ecderha

Experienced member
Messages
4,471
Reactions
4 7,724
Nation of residence
Bulgaria
Nation of origin
Turkey
Do we have a semiconductor producing company?
I would like to give you little info about Big Car producers.
Lets make this clear and it is very impotent I will talk about CAR chip/micro-controller.

So
Does BMW, Mercedes, VW, Ford, Peugeot etc. have semiconductor producing branch or company? No they do NOT have!

What they do is following.
1. Invite companies for presentation. Invited companies are selected one or "White listed" from above car companies .
2. Car producers "present" that They need "new module " for their new car which they will start build in next 2-3 years.
3. After 2-3 months Car producers start auction for best offer from invited and interested ones. Later best offer is selected they select 1 or 2 of them from "white listed" companies.
4. Sign contract and development is started
----------------------------------

Sign contract with selected company. Is it have semiconductor producing capability? No they do NOT.
What they do to build the "new module" (let say it is Auto Gear-shifter or Window lifter ) is following:

- Make the cover (plastic, metal, leather etc).
- Inside the cover is printed circuit board (PCB)
- On PCB are at list 2 chip/micro-controller (First to drop voltage from 12voltage to 5v. This 5voltage is need it for Second chip/micro-controller because it is work on 5voltx )
- almost 90% of time they choose the Best (mean have the features and prices against others) chip/micro-controller which is JAPAN.
others like German-> infineon or France -> SK or usa motorola etc. DO NOT have succeed to reach JAPAN products (chip/micro-controller)



So result is STILL valid in present days.
make contract with Japan -> example https://www.renesas.com/us/en/products/automotive-products and get chip/micro-controller for all module which you company will build for the new car
 

TR_123456

Experienced member
Staff member
Administrator
Messages
4,743
Reactions
11,609
Nation of residence
Nethelands
Nation of origin
Turkey
I would like to give you little info about Big Car producers.
Lets make this clear and it is very impotent I will talk about CAR chip/micro-controller.

So
Does BMW, Mercedes, VW, Ford, Peugeot etc. have semiconductor producing branch or company? No they do NOT have!

What they do is following.
1. Invite companies for presentation. Invited companies are selected one or "White listed" from above car companies .
2. Car producers "present" that They need "new module " for their new car which they will start build in next 2-3 years.
3. After 2-3 months Car producers start auction for best offer from invited and interested ones. Later best offer is selected they select 1 or 2 of them from "white listed" companies.
4. Sign contract and development is started
----------------------------------

Sign contract with selected company. Is it have semiconductor producing capability? No they do NOT.
What they do to build the "new module" (let say it is Auto Gear-shifter or Window lifter ) is following:

- Make the cover (plastic, metal, leather etc).
- Inside the cover is printed circuit board (PCB)
- On PCB are at list 2 chip/micro-controller (First to drop voltage from 12voltage to 5v. This 5voltage is need it for Second chip/micro-controller because it is work on 5voltx )
- almost 90% of time they choose the Best (mean have the features and prices against others) chip/micro-controller which is JAPAN.
others like German-> infineon or France -> SK or usa motorola etc. DO NOT have succeed to reach JAPAN products (chip/micro-controller)



So result is STILL valid in present days.
make contract with Japan -> example https://www.renesas.com/us/en/products/automotive-products and get chip/micro-controller for all module which you company will build for the new car
Nice presentation but did you also think of the reason why i asked this?
 

TR_123456

Experienced member
Staff member
Administrator
Messages
4,743
Reactions
11,609
Nation of residence
Nethelands
Nation of origin
Turkey
I hope you will tell the reason
This is the reason,


You cant produce cars without semiconductors/chips.
If we have indigenous production of ''chips'',the shortage will not effect us.
This goes for all the industries where we need chips.
 

Ecderha

Experienced member
Messages
4,471
Reactions
4 7,724
Nation of residence
Bulgaria
Nation of origin
Turkey
This is the reason,


You cant produce cars without semiconductors/chips.
If we have indigenous production of ''chips'',the shortage will not effect us.
This goes for all the industries where we need chips.
Thank you for explanation.
"If we have indigenous production of ''chips'',the shortage will not effect us."
On first look you are Right.

But as I said "BMW, Mercedes, VW, Ford, Peugeot" choose to use Japan ''chips" and THERE ARE the shortages there.


Also "BMW, Mercedes, VW, Ford, Peugeot" have option to use "Local/ indigenous production of ''chips".
Example BMW -> German-> Infineon. ISSUE is that local did not provide ''chips" which meet the requirements(there are side effects which I don't want to go in details)
But German-> Infineon have "chips" I mean no shortages. But this does not fix the problem.


So IF and only IF
"we have indigenous production of ''chips'' and they meet requirements and used and there does not happened Issue as above.
Main factor of shortage is that in JAPAN one of FAB producing ''chips'' got FIRE.
Second is COVID-19
 

Stuka

Contributor
Think Tank Analyst
Messages
713
Reactions
5 4,538
Nation of residence
United Kingdom
Nation of origin
Turkey
1635460842833.png
 

TheInsider

Experienced member
Professional
Messages
3,785
Solutions
1
Reactions
27 13,599
Nation of residence
Turkey
Nation of origin
Turkey
SIRO factory will produce NMC 811 pouch-type cells. There will also be state-of-the-art R&D facilities inside the factory for battery research. I expect SIRO factory to switch to Silicone-Carbon anode as it is a direct upgrade from the graphite anode that is used in NMC(nickel, manganese, cobalt) batteries.
 

the

Well-known member
Messages
321
Reactions
756
Nation of residence
United Kingdom
Nation of origin
Turkey
if the new logo contains the name in addition to the emblem then the previous logo looks better.
 

neosinan

Committed member
Messages
213
Reactions
7 970
Nation of residence
Turkey
Nation of origin
Turkey
20 GWh/year means the factory will produce 20 GWh of battery every year.
1 GWh=1,000,000 kWh
If we use a battery pack of 80kWh per car this means we can produce 250,000 cars per year.

As for the semiconductors, GaN-based semiconductors will be produced by Aselsan(for the applications like 5G internet), for silicon-based semiconductors, we will go fabless like AMD. Malaysia and TSMC will produce our designs for the products like FPGAs, industrial CPUs or modems. For the high-end semiconductors like high performance GPUs and CPUs, we will cooperate with Qualcomm. And lastly, a lot of semiconductor-based sensors will be produced by Nero Industry.


TR also plans to set up a fab for silicon chips but that will most likely be exclusive to the defense industry.
You really should add Kalyon PV to this list. They produce not only wafers for their PV but they also produce Ingots as well. That's semiconductor materials by all intended purposes.

Imho, We also should try to find investors for assembly of IC like Malaysia and Even Tunisia is doing. It is true that High value is in wafer and ingot production but there is also good job creation in final assembly. This would be really good for our automotive and electronics sectors as well.
 

Follow us on social media

Top Bottom