TR Missile & Smart Munition Programs

[Zafer]

Akıncı with air strike capability will be like a castle in the air; it will sit there and wait for the enemy to approach and unleash the hell on the incoming threat. Better deploy them in fleets.

 

[Combat-Master]

I was not thinking about the AESA light radar that Akinci is supposed to get, but a big new radar with considerable range carried in some way by aksungur or Akinci. (kinda like UAV AWACS)

Akinci would be more capable of carrying such a power hungry piece of kit, aksungur could be outfitted with APU. Eitherway, there definetely has to be an advancement in all areas of aerial warfighting where UCAVs can be used as force and sensor multipliers.

 

[Cabatli_TR]

I was not thinking about the AESA light radar that Akinci is supposed to get, but a big new radar with considerable range carried in some way by aksungur or Akinci. (kinda like UAV AWACS)

China did something like this and called it “ flying radar”. I believe we will see these kind of drones with better radars in future. The drones with many different configuration will form a deadly war concept to deal with enemy threats.

 

[Yasar_TR]

Aesa radars need a lot of power. So the platform carrying them has to have engines that can provide enough juice for say 3+ megawatt transmission power and 5+ KW average power. Why do you think 5th generation planes have very powerful engines (apart from high super cruise capability)?
The radar mounted on the F/A-22 Raptor and F-35 Joint Strike Fighter (JSF) can be used to fry electronic parts of ground-based radars and disable airborne cruise missiles, program officials for the planes acknowledge. They say the apg81 and apg79 can radiate so much power that they would cause physical damage.
UK’s type 45 carries Sampson radar that has a range of 400km and a power output of 25kW. They had ask Russian pilots to move away to prevent lethal damage before they turned on the radar.

 

[Turko]

Ramjet missiles are fast (Mach6) and long range (200 - 300km range or even more). Most problematic part is detection of enemy fighter jet (especially if she is stealth)

Why not stick them onto AWACs if they have 300km range? I heard there was such project.

EDIT:
İt is the cheapest AEW aircraft. AFAIK we also had such business jet project.
Underwings we could add some ramjet air to air missiles. Business jets are smarter and maneuver.

 

[azaher77]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1331643920741261313

F-16 Block 40 fighter aircraft belonging to the Turkish Air Force conducting a test activity with the SOM Cruise Missile

 

[Reviewbrah]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1331643920741261313

F-16 Block 40 fighter aircraft belonging to the Turkish Air Force conducting a test activity with the SOM Cruise Missile

Probably related to Ozgur modernization

 

[Yasar_TR]

Tubitak is working on ramjet engine. If everything goes well Roketsan can develop AA missiles with ramjet in several years.

I was wondering how much the combination of ramjet missile on Akinci UCAV would help our air defenses

We have the classical thought of fast jet with missile in our mind, but since UCAV's get more and more operational we should switch our mindset as well. Fast jet is not really needed when the missile does the work. Fast jet advantage is only when you want intercept roles.

Ramjet missiles are fast (Mach6) and long range (200 - 300km range or even more). Most problematic part is detection of enemy fighter jet (especially if she is stealth)

Question: is it possible to use Akinci like UCAV's in air defense roles? Say equipped with AA ramjet missiles, but there is a long range airborne AESA radar needed for detection.

Ramjet maxes out at 6 mach. It will not work unless it is at supersonic speeds. So it has to have a solid fuel engine or booster to bring it to the right speed.
In the case of the Meteor missile; solid propellant nozzleless booster is integrated within the ramcombustor and accelerates the missile to a velocity where the Throttleable Ducted Rocket drive can take over. Because the ramjet motor is throttle controlled, it can decrease it’s speed to conserve fuel and hence can go a lot further. When it is within target acquirement distance it speeds up and reaches it’s maximum speed of 4 Mach.
The air is rammed in to the combustion chamber because of the high speed attained through the booster stage which generates enough pressure to activate the ramjet propulsion. The air inside the combustion chamber is at subsonic speeds. When you increase the speed of air rammed in to the combustion to supersonic speeds then you get Supersonic Combustion Ramjet : Scramjet. The speeds attained by scramjet engines are 6+ Mach to theoretically 24 Mach.
Meteor missile is 2 million Euros a piece. So not cheap! Needs to be on a platform that will do it justice.

 

[Yasar_TR]

Ramjet maxes out at 6 mach. It will not work unless it is at supersonic speeds. So it has to have a solid fuel engine or booster to bring it to the right speed.
In the case of the Meteor missile; solid propellant nozzleless booster is integrated within the ramcombustor and accelerates the missile to a velocity where the Throttleable Ducted Rocket drive can take over. Because the ramjet motor is throttle controlled, it can decrease it’s speed to conserve fuel and hence can go a lot further. When it is within target acquirement distance it speeds up and reaches it’s maximum speed of 4 Mach.
The air is rammed in to the combustion chamber because of the high speed attained through the booster stage which generates enough pressure to activate the ramjet propulsion. The air inside the combustion chamber is at subsonic speeds. When you increase the speed of air rammed in to the combustion to supersonic speeds then you get Supersonic Combustion Ramjet : Scramjet. The speeds attained by scramjet engines are 6+ Mach to theoretically 24 Mach.
Meteor missile is 2 million Euros a piece. So not cheap! Needs to be on a platform that will do it justice.

To add to this. Once we have mastered the ramjet engine, the natural next step will be the scramjet missiles. These missiles will be real game changers for us. As it stands no one has the means to stop these. They will be real carrier killers, launched from ships or planes.

 

[Yasar_TR]

Land-Based Anti-Ship Missiles and the U.S. Marine Corps: Options Available - Naval News

Peter Ong reports on the Land-Based Anti-Ship Missile (LBASM) options on the table for the USMC and US Army ground forces to use against threatening enemy ships, with the latest from Virtual Modern Day Marine Expo 2020.

www.navalnews.com

US is planning to use it’s ATACAMS modified HIMARS missiles as land and ship launched anti ship missiles with their 300 km range.
This brings me to a previous message once shared by Mr Cabatli over a year ago about the 500km range Bora 2 with an active seeker head and data link to hit moving sea targets. I hope by now we have this missile in our inventory!!

The Noble Quran - Quran.com

The Quran translated into many languages in a simple and easy interface

defence.pk

 

[Turko]

We will see more Turkish precision strike missiles that is going to be developed thanks to the experiences gained from other missile programs.
G40 propulsion with Kuzgun seeker head for lock-on before/after launch/update precision stike NLOS missile. Land based Miniature bombs with artillery rocket propulsion, Land based Atmaca variant for ground/ship strike, Bora-2Naval for anti-ship roles...etc

We haven't seen G40 but there are its derivatives. They must deliberately hide G40 from us. Show us god damn missile.

 

[Huelague]

China did something like this and called it “ flying radar”. I believe we will see these kind of drones with better radars in future. The drones with many different configuration will form a deadly war concept to deal with enemy threats.

View attachment 7210

Bro, is it possible to integrate an "airborne radar" on a satallite?

 

[Timur]

Bro, is it possible to integrate an "airborne radar" on a satallite?

sattelites depending on their station above are really far away:

23.000 km for middle altitudes 12 hours of orbit period
~35.000 km for geo stationary orbit

low earth orbits are 200 km -2000km dont ask me how long satteöotes can stay on this orbit.. (should be about ~15 min of contact with the sattelite than)


I dont think a 300 km radar makes sence on a sattelite

and than you need to power them..

 

[Cabatli_TR]

Bro, is it possible to integrate an "airborne radar" on a satallite?

If it is an airborne SAR radar, Göktürk-3 will have a SAR payload.

 

[Bogeyman]

If it is an airborne SAR radar, Göktürk-3 will have a SAR payload.

Instead of SAR satellites, we can use SAR pods in UAVs for now. MİLSAR was developed for this.

https://www.meteksan.com/files/urunler_pdf/milsar_en_yeni.pdf

 

[AzeriTank]

We will use them in air defence roles but Akinci will be a big target for fast manned fighters when they are detected. I think the detection ranges of manned aircrafts’ AESA radars will be longer than the one Akinci has so Turboprop Akinci should be operated inside same network with other striking units. Akinci-like unmanned and relatively slow drones should fire the missiles before enemy aircrafts and It is only possible when they are linked with airborne early warning radars. MIUS with 950km/h and 1t missile payload will be more convenient to AA engagagement roles.

Bro, Akinji able to shoot down coming cruise missiles, it might also be good that it is able to stop saturation attack in the future. being able to get AKinji on Anadolu, you are able to stop lots of missiles while other ships reload their VLS

 

[Turko]

According to internet it is not so easy. Akıncı needs data link transmitter from radar or AEW. Then also needs download the coordinates into missile.

US navy had such project. They wanted to launch SM6 missile from an aircraft. But they didn't start.

 

[AzeriTank]

According to internet it is not so easy. Akıncı needs data link transmitter from radar or AEW. Then also needs download the coordinates into missile.

US navy had such project. They wanted to launch SM6 missile from an aircraft. But they didn't start.

they are able to do it with its AESA radar...

 

[Huelague]

Turkey's VP says starts national air-air missile tests

Turkey also starts serial production of first national sea missile, Fuat Oktay says - Anadolu Agency

www.aa.com.tr

 

[Yasar_TR]

As a country with an up and coming on the rise defence industry, Turkey should be looking in to the production of Hyper Velocity Projectile weapons.
just by design geometry and materials used BAE Systems has managed to make a projectile that can achieve hypersonic speeds if fired from a naval127mm or army 155mm gun.

The HVP’s low drag aerodynamic design enables high-velocity, maneuverability, and decreased time-to-target. These attributes, coupled with accurate guidance electronics, provide low-cost mission effectiveness against current threats and the ability to adapt to air and surface threats of the future.

The high-velocity compact design relieves the need for a rocket motor to extend gun range. Firing smaller, more accurate rounds decreases the likelihood for collateral damage and provides for deeper magazines and improved shipboard safety.
US is already trialing this new technology..

Navy Quietly Fires 20 Hyper Velocity Projectiles Through Destroyer’s Deckgun - USNI News

Last summer USS Dewey (DDG-105) fired 20 hyper velocity projectiles (HVP) from a standard Mk 45 5-inch deck gun in a quiet experiment that’s set to add new utility to the weapon found on almost every U.S. warship, officials familiar with the test have told USNI News. The test, conducted by the...

news.usni.org

These projectiles can reach 90+km targets when fired from conventional guns with pinpoint accuracy. With Advanced Gun Systems they could hit 130 km.

https://www.thedrive.com/content-b/message-editor%2F1600374296177-325325fd.jpeg?quality=60