Citizenship law and the migration of 1947

Kaptaan

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Your hawking to British era laws to find resolution to issues in 2020. It is job of government to frame laws to address the issues of the present. British immigration law has been continously changed. In 1950s al of Pakistan ccould have moved to UK as Commonwealth citizens. On the other hand Polish, Estonians, Latvians, Italians, Germans were considerd "aliens".

By 1960s Commonwealth citizens were restricted but by early 1970s the "aliens" from Germany, Italy" etc were allowed freefall into UK as EU citizens. In UK we don;'t use immigration laws from 1947 to decide on the immmigration status or policies today. That would be absurd.
 

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@Saiyan0321 Please go to 3:30 and listen to it please. Truth and law often is function of those with power and influence to paint the narrative they want. While the poor Afghan refugees are vilified [I have no doubt there are bad eggs amongst them] the reality is MQM is a gangster mafia party that has terrorized and wrecked Karachi. It was MQM that has ruled the city for over 30 years and during Musharaf's time even had footprint in the federal government. Even now a much castrated MQM has shadow on Islamabad trhrought the coalition it provides to PTI government in Islamabad. Has Pakistan been cast as a Indian Muslim refugee dump. Yes sir. It has.

Listening. implementation of laws and policy. If the Executive makes sure that the system is not tightened nor allowed then the system will fall apart and you will have such disappearances and then through corruption and weak executive structure, allotment of ID cards., We saw the same happen in PKMAP and in northern Baluchistan
(iii) Citizen by Migration:
The persons who migrated to Pakistan from the territories in the indo-Pakistan subcontinent before the commencement of Pakistan Citizenship Act, 1951 are declared citizens of Pakistan.


The problem with the fourth was the status of British subject and British protected citizen since the second was the one which largely covered those that migrated from the Dominion of India to Dominion of Pakistan and vice versa whereas there were movements from princely states as well, large movements and the princely states themselves so to accommodate those that did not have British Subject Citizenship, the migration was added before 1951 so that those that had British protected citizen status could be given citizenship.

A new state would confer new citizenship.

Your hawking to British era laws to find resolution to issues in 2020. It is job of government to frame laws to address the issues of the present. British immigration law has been continously changed. In 1950s al of Pakistan ccould have moved to UK as Commonwealth citizens. On the other hand Polish, Estonians, Latvians, Italians, Germans were considerd "aliens".

By 1960s Commonwealth citizens were restricted but by early 1970s the "aliens" from Germany, Italy" etc were allowed freefall into UK as EU citizens. In UK we don;'t use immigration laws from 1947 to decide on the immmigration status or policies today. That would be absurd.

I am hawking on British Era law to describe how a movement between two sovereign states is different than the movement of people between dominions of a single polity that had no laws and how post the framing of such laws, the movement could no longer be done apart from illegal movement and illegal naturalization.

I have repeatedly stated that our Citizenship laws need amendments and need to be updated.
 

Saiyan0321

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Also if the people who moved from one sovereign state to another want a solution for their plight then they should stop using the argument of 1947 and focus on stronger arguments for their case.
 

VCheng

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I am hawking on British Era law to describe how a movement between two sovereign states is different than the movement of people between dominions of a single polity that had no laws and how post the framing of such laws, the movement could no longer be done apart from illegal movement and illegal naturalization.

I have repeatedly stated that our Citizenship laws need amendments and need to be updated.

Much of Pakistani law dates back into the days of the British Raj. As long as a law is on the books, it is valid, until amended or superseded by due process, present discussion included.
 

Saiyan0321

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It would be on topic to describe what are the citizenship laws of Pakistan, as they stand currently.

I pointed to the case laws and legal limitations on how naturalization cannot be done to Afghans. As i said, if they want citizenship and if their supporters want citizenship then they will have to bring forth changes as the current laws do not support it.
 

VCheng

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I pointed to the case laws and legal limitations on how naturalization cannot be done to Afghans. As i said, if they want citizenship and if their supporters want citizenship then they will have to bring forth changes as the current laws do not support it.

Your point is well made, and, also as you agreed above, there is a due process for changing and amending the Citizenship Act, if the government so chooses to proceed with such an option.
 

Saiyan0321

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Much of Pakistani law dates back into the days of the British Raj. As long as a law is on the books, it is valid, until amended or superseded by due process, present discussion included.

Indeed. So what do you think is the solution to this problem and if you were to approach it, how would you approach to find its solution?
 

VCheng

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Indeed. So what do you think is the solution to this problem and if you were to approach it, how would you approach to find its solution?

The answer to that question may be hidden in the details of the foreign aid that comes in various forms for the refugees within Pakistan and how they are disseminated.
 

Saiyan0321

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Your point is well made, and, also as you agreed above, there is a due process for changing and amending the Citizenship Act, if the government so chooses to proceed with such an option.

Well its a question we keep on 'Deferred' but i get the feeling that the situation needs a solution and fast and we habitually sit on a problem before it blows up.
 

VCheng

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Well its a question we keep on 'Deferred' but i get the feeling that the situation needs a solution and fast and we habitually sit on a problem before it blows up.

Pakistani Management Ishtyle 101, my friend. :D
 

Saiyan0321

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The answer to that question may be hidden in the details of the foreign aid that comes in various forms for the refugees within Pakistan and how they are disseminated.

Helps with the Goodwill as well as being the 2nd largest refugee nation and lets not forget Afghanistan and repatriation..

That doesnt answer my question though. :p
What solution would you say is the most feasible of the lot in your opinion?
 

Kaptaan

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movement of people between dominions of a single polity
I am well aware of that. My dad moved to UK under the same laws you allude to. Nobody said or has hinted at the mass scale migration in 1947 as "illegal". Political issue yes. Legal issue no. However the refugees from India migrated on the premise of "Muslim homeland". I mean you did not see mass migration from what is India into Sindh in 1930s etc when the same laws applied.

That migration was climax of politics of partition. Muslim nation etc
 

VCheng

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Helps with the Goodwill as well as being the 2nd largest refugee nation and lets not forget Afghanistan and repatriation..

That doesnt answer my question though. :p
What solution would you say is the most feasible of the lot in your opinion?

The most feasible solution is the one presently being followed: let the situation languish for as long as possible to get the maximum aid possible. After all, we are the nation that still denies its own citizens who chose Pakistani citizenship after the creation of Bangladesh the right to come here while they languish in internment camps for decades upon decades.
 

Kaptaan

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What solution would you say is the most feasible of the lot in your opinion?
All should be given Pakistan citizenship based on principle of natural law. Most have been in Pk for over 40 years. Or you might want to look up on Sharia law to find answers.
 

Kaptaan

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chose Pakistani citizenship
They chose Muslim homeland. They did NOT move to West Pakistan. They moved to East Pakistan. That went through a label change. Last time I checked Banglas are still Muslim majority.
 

Kaptaan

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If couple of million Christians from Nigeria decamped in Virgina threatening the demographyt [or whatever state you live in USA] I would love to see how your law abding Yanks would react. So spare a thought for native Sindhis.
 

VCheng

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They chose Muslim homeland. They did NOT move to West Pakistan. They moved to East Pakistan. That went through a label change. Last time I checked Banglas are still Muslim majority.

Incorrect. Pakistan has already accepted >170,000 people falling into this category, and tens of thousands still remain there.
 

Kaptaan

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Incorrect. Pakistan has already accepted >170,000 people falling into this category, and tens of thousands still remain there.
Yes. So you want to stir the explosive pot in Karachi more do you? So that you can then point fingers from afar at the "failing Pakistani state". I know if what has happened to Sindh happened in any of US states you would have had a repeat of civil war V.02 requiring US Army. All those hill billies would be out to protect their "freedom" from the hordes.
 

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Is this what you want ?

AMIDST the growing clamour over the state’s neglect of Karachi, the MQM-P has once again raised the controversial demand for the division of Sindh. While addressing a rally in the metropolis on Friday, the party’s leadership renewed the call for the formation of a ‘South Sindh’ province to be carved out of Sindh’s urban areas.

 

VCheng

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Yes. So you want to stir the explosive pot in Karachi more do you? So that you can then point fingers from afar at the "failing Pakistani state". I know if what has happened to Sindh happened in any of US states you would have had a repeat of civil war V.02 requiring US Army. All those hill billies would be out to protect their "freedom" from the hordes.

Legally, Pakistan is obligated to accept all those citizens that reaffirmed their nationality in 1971 and refused Bangladeshi nationality. To not honor its commitments due to political expediency is a continuing national disgrace.
 

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