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  1. Joe Shearer

    Azad Kashmir claim on Gilgit Baltistan

    Drink deep or drink not of the Pierian Spring. Think, for a moment, if this doctrine spread insidiously to regions outside its stout advocate of the moment. These aspects, as you well know, in your role as perhaps the most well-informed among members of the branches of international law...
  2. Joe Shearer

    Azad Kashmir claim on Gilgit Baltistan

    I can only diffidently point out that it is a singular lack of record, confined to those areas least congenial to presentation as anything other than an attempt to win by force of arms what was not available through the constitutional arrangements that had been made.
  3. Joe Shearer

    Azad Kashmir claim on Gilgit Baltistan

    I acknowledge the confidence with which this statement is made, but Myself when young did eagerly frequent Doctor and Saint and heard great argument About it and about, but evermore Came out by the same door as in I went.
  4. Joe Shearer

    Azad Kashmir claim on Gilgit Baltistan

    Where was the aggression? Not a soldier in sight, and it is termed aggression? Further, the authority to rule was handed over by the Dewan, presumably acting on behalf of his principal, the Nawab; so, what annexation? M. N. Buch, the befuddled recipient of the 'keys to the kingdom', had no idea...
  5. Joe Shearer

    Azad Kashmir claim on Gilgit Baltistan

    This is precisely what happened, and this is precisely what should have happened, in terms of the principle of contiguity. The same principle prevented the NWFP from joining India, a position that every Pakhtun should be extremely sensitive to. :D
  6. Joe Shearer

    Azad Kashmir claim on Gilgit Baltistan

    Not at all. It was a formal, constitutional treaty-bound status. The princes were in formal terms associated with the British Crown. The Viceroy was Viceroy insofar as he represented the British monarch, hence the term Viceroy; it is noteworthy that he continued, all along, to be the...
  7. Joe Shearer

    Azad Kashmir claim on Gilgit Baltistan

    Unlike the parallel sought to be drawn, there was no recognition accorded, nor - the Arzee Hukumat being located outside the state - was there military intervention or armed uprising. The recourse to arms is - I use the present tense advisedly - a Pakistani hallmark. Siachen was the exception...
  8. Joe Shearer

    Azad Kashmir claim on Gilgit Baltistan

    Since Mountbatten's role has been mentioned, he made it clear that any state with no contiguity to the Dominion of its choice would be constrained from seeking any alliance of that sort (alliance = accession, in the first instance). So Jodhpur had a right to seek accession to Pakistan, and the...
  9. Joe Shearer

    Azad Kashmir claim on Gilgit Baltistan

    This is not a negotiation, and was not a negotiation then. If one party has aspirations that cannot be met, and decides to overthrow the traces and seek its goals notwithstanding whatever had previously been agreed, it is in no way incumbent on the other party to agree to this immediate...
  10. Joe Shearer

    Azad Kashmir claim on Gilgit Baltistan

    @Kaptaan @Saithan @Saiyan0321 The discussion is getting somewhat intense. Let it be clearly understood that my own position is constituted of the following elements; My essential position is that the rule of law should prevail; this necessarily militates against the theory of revolutionary...
  11. Joe Shearer

    Azad Kashmir claim on Gilgit Baltistan

    There are some points of note here. It may or may not be an insult to declare that they meekly morphed (sic) into the will of the conqueror, to use your words. That deemed insult is not sufficient reason to create a back-story that provides for a heroic resistance; if there was such a...
  12. Joe Shearer

    Azad Kashmir claim on Gilgit Baltistan

    I would agree with you on the narrative as presented by you, but for some factual difficulties. There is not a single contemporary account of such a spontaneous joining of the Gilgit-Chitral contingent by the natives of Skardu. What is recorded is the siege (for a very long duration) of the...
  13. Joe Shearer

    Azad Kashmir claim on Gilgit Baltistan

    This requires some elaboration. Art. 370 was a temporary provision of the Indian Constitution, and there is nothing in the J&K Constitution, drafted by a native Constituent Assembly of residents of J&K, that supports this Article. It was drafted to provide for an alignment of the actions of...
  14. Joe Shearer

    Azad Kashmir claim on Gilgit Baltistan

    No, India DID NOT recognise the Aarzee Hukumat. I do not question your integrity, but the situation was far more complicated than that. There was also no blockade. There was a military support given to vassal states under the suzerainty of Junagadh, that had an independent right to decide their...
  15. Joe Shearer

    Azad Kashmir claim on Gilgit Baltistan

    That's as brutally honest as it gets. Classic Kaptaan clear-eyed realism. He's got a built-in bullshit filter.
  16. Joe Shearer

    Azad Kashmir claim on Gilgit Baltistan

    How utterly pleasant to be able to discuss a sensitive subject with members who are courteous and who write with graceful understanding and acknowledgement of contrary views. How I miss this at PDF. I am beginning to like this forum more and more.
  17. Joe Shearer

    Azad Kashmir claim on Gilgit Baltistan

    Oh, completely. The biggest blunder in independent India. I wonder if it is recoverable.
  18. Joe Shearer

    Azad Kashmir claim on Gilgit Baltistan

    May I take this opportunity, @Saithan, to compliment you on your balanced, sensitive and thoughtful posts in this thread. Very nice reading. This is also an opportunity to reassure you most sincerely that you need not hold back, and are fully entitled to make your points as forcefully as you...
  19. Joe Shearer

    Azad Kashmir claim on Gilgit Baltistan

    It is a mysterious happening. Even though I have very dear friends among the KPs, including one who has visibly gone completely right-wing - extreme right-wing - I am not convinced about their flight. This is even while I accept that the pressure on them was horrifying. They have much to...

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