TR Casual Discussion Çay Bahçesi

Quasar

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Iskander

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They say there are three things you can watch for a long time without getting tired:

1. how water flows
2. how the fire burns

What's the third thing?!

3. How Russian troops sadly leave Azerbaijan :LOL:
 

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Heartbang

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A local PC case manufacturer has been featured in LinusTechTips channel to an audience of nearly 16 million subscribers!

 
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Nilgiri

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Recent convo I had on agglutination with some Turkish friends:

Me:
its pretty fascinating to compare tamil and turkish for their agglutination. its the same order and everything. Konusuyorum (konusu + yor + um) vs pesukiren (pesu +kir + en) for i am speaking (english which has limited agglutination so uses more words). i.e the order of verb-root + tense + possesive pronoun....and there is some kind of similar sounds too in way this is done.

Me:
definitely turks like tamils often prefer closing with consonants, rather than leaving open vowels at the end etc it seems (sound wise) and love the r, n and m in the morphology bits within the agglutinative follow ons

Me:
and this is why to non-agglutinative folks, both languages seem very fast spoken, but in our heads its not that fast at all, because we are auto conjugating from experience

Me:
i think overall the speed of message is same for most languages, just agglutination offers more precision immediately.

Turkish friend:
Yediremiyeceklerimizlerdenmişcesine.

Turkish friend:
As if you are from the ones whom we can't make eat.

Me:
actually its not so strange to tamils lol, we have some like these, not as extreme but they are there...really there is no definite limit in the rules, so its open ended, just as many adjectives and tenses that make sense with the original verb/item root

Me:
once you have agglutination deeply, it all follows same thing overall....especially if you have the character set that allows the precision too

Me:
thats where korean and japanese had a bit of brrake put on, by using chinese characters..... even though they are agglutinative, the written language meant it had to turn into separate words more often (given logogram nature of written chinese, its very different to alphabet)

Me:
and also why with time, japanese and korean formed their own scripts by breaking down chinese ones into constituents....though korean one started from scratch (hangul) compared to japanese one which just broke it down (kana)

Me:
but interesting this is common feature of altaic-steppe .... and its shared with south india too and couple other places of world
 

Nilgiri

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Bit of a cheat, innit? Since the word "muvaffak" is a loanword from Arabic.

Well every language in the end is something of a sprachbund given history and context and absorption rate (into colloquial and then vernacular).

Longer it spends in the vernacular phase, the likelihood it gets standardised using the grammar rules.

This is seen in Tamil (and all our Dravidian sibling languages) too very same way to Turkish.....i.e old legacy contact make the loanword verb-stem (for agglutination)....from various other languages, but especially those in proximity in Central + Northern India (a different language family to ours...i.e Indo-European). i.e for Turkish this would be things like Arabic and Persian loanwords for these roots.

Whereas newer entrants from say English are kept more or less "as is", mostly out of convenience/fashion/slang....though some enter the process of formal agglutination....as nothing really prevents this for the starting root.

There is also a revivalist movement for "pure" Tamil (taking out even legacy loanwords and replacing with sometimes even archaic tamil words that long fell out of use) that has occured over last 50 or so years due to various political/ethno-nationalist reasons (i.e running against the influence of the North and Sanskrit etc to engineer some more pristine state, no matter how the vernaculars evolved due to reality and history)....but their success has only been partial as people are just used to household/community vernaculars in the end. Dunno if this has happened in Turkish so much.
 
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