TR Altay Main Battle Tank & Related Programs

GoatsMilk

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The good thing with South Korea is they don't b*tch around, don't give terms where and how to use it like some hypocrites*. It's a tank, a machine of war how does it sound to you when you buy a brandnew car and the dealer tells you "you can't use it offroad and don't pass X speed limits, otherwise..."

For example Poland if i remember correct were "kicked" out of the French-German MBT project, afterwards started talks with South Korea who btw. delivered the Tanks in a ridiculous short time. * likes to play around, delaying the deliveries of parts or even play the moral card (for weapons systems btw.).

I would favour military/defence cooperation with South Korea over Europe anyday.





*Germany

You have to keep in mind for the past 300 years the permier European nations had their way with everything, they are continuing to behave this way without realising that Asia is probably the future. Koreans with tanks, Turks with drones, etc step by step their monopolies are being chipped away. The moment an Asian power is able to build fighter jets at the level of the USA and things change again.
 

Chocopie

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The good thing with South Korea is they don't b*tch around, don't give terms where and how to use it like some hypocrites*. It's a tank, a machine of war how does it sound to you when you buy a brandnew car and the dealer tells you "you can't use it offroad and don't pass X speed limits, otherwise..."

For example Poland if i remember correct were "kicked" out of the French-German MBT project, afterwards started talks with South Korea who btw. delivered the Tanks in a ridiculous short time. * likes to play around, delaying the deliveries of parts or even play the moral card (for weapons systems btw.).

I would favour military/defence cooperation with South Korea over Europe anyday.





*Germany
I‘ve to disappoint you a little bit: Koreans also put restrictions on end users for their weapon systems (like everybody else, guess Turkey does the same). Poles would need Korean permission to sell/donate K2/K9/K239 to Ukraine.

But Koreans are in fact very „flexible“ and don‘t b*tch around like Europeans, e.g. Polish Krab SPH with K9 chassis rain hell on Russians in Ukraine as we speak.
 

Xenon54

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Don‘t forget it when Korea asks for drone cooperation ;)
Korea is one of the few nations where i wouldnt mind giving ToT, this business is give and take and we could strenghten eachothers defence industry, the T-155 Firtina have been and still are a blast in Syria operations. ;)
 

CAN_TR

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I‘ve to disappoint you a little bit: Koreans also put restrictions on end users for their weapon systems (kike everybiday else, bet Turkey does the same). For example, Poles would need Korean permission to sell/donate K2/K9/K239 to Ukraine.

But Koreans in fact don‘t b*tch around like Europeans, e.g. Polish Krab SPH with K9 chassis rain hell on Russians in Ukraine.
The chances of Russia conquering the whole world is higher than us donating Altay to Ukraine or someone else.
 

Xenon54

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The supply guarantee and reliability is above everything else. If we are to import these subsystems, even if it was a tier below of the competition, the contracts should be given to the most loyal to us. And I think this should have civil extensions as well. Korean companies should be favored against the northern Europeans in tenders.
Absolutely, with Koreans you can be sure they keep their words and dont put sanctions over some terrorists.
 

TheInsider

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There was word in turkish media about the Korean transmission being modified in Turkiye by Turkish engineers, so that's probably how it passed the durability tests. Also why so many purchased, isnt BMC planning to use their own powerpack after 2025.
Korean transmission uses some German components. Germans embargoed the delivery of Korean transmission to Turkiye with German components on it so Korea and Turkiye came together to bypass the German embargo. In the end, Koreans localized those components, and Turkiye and Korea managed to sign a contract. The contract has 2 phases. The first phase consists of the delivery of 90 power packs. The second phase is the optional delivery of 150 additional powerpacks. I guess if something goes wrong with the Turkish powerpack production will continue with the Korean powerpack. We need to get an export license from Korea if we want to sell Altay to third countries with the Korean powerpack but i doubt it will be a big problem unless we want to sell Altay to North Korea.
 

Agha Sher

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Korean transmission uses some German components. Germans embargoed the delivery of Korean transmission to Turkiye with German components on it so Korea and Turkiye came together to bypass the German embargo. In the end, Koreans localized those components, and Turkiye and Korea managed to sign a contract. The contract has 2 phases. The first phase consists of the delivery of 90 power packs. The second phase is the optional delivery of 150 additional powerpacks. I guess if something goes wrong with the Turkish powerpack production will continue with the Korean powerpack. We need to get an export license from Korea if we want to sell Altay to third countries with the Korean powerpack but i doubt it will be a big problem unless we want to sell Altay to North Korea.

This is great! When will serial production start?
 

YeşilVatan

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Korean transmission uses some German components. Germans embargoed the delivery of Korean transmission to Turkiye with German components on it so Korea and Turkiye came together to bypass the German embargo. In the end, Koreans localized those components, and Turkiye and Korea managed to sign a contract. The contract has 2 phases. The first phase consists of the delivery of 90 power packs. The second phase is the optional delivery of 150 additional powerpacks. I guess if something goes wrong with the Turkish powerpack production will continue with the Korean powerpack. We need to get an export license from Korea if we want to sell Altay to third countries with the Korean powerpack but i doubt it will be a big problem unless we want to sell Altay to North Korea.
What happens if Americans pressure Koreans to veto our deal?

You know nothing is beneath them.
 

Isbara

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I‘ve to disappoint you a little bit: Koreans also put restrictions on end users for their weapon systems (like everybody else, guess Turkey does the same). Poles would need Korean permission to sell/donate K2/K9/K239 to Ukraine.

But Koreans are in fact very „flexible“ and don‘t b*tch around like Europeans, e.g. Polish Krab SPH with K9 chassis rain hell on Russians in Ukraine as we speak.
No one will be dissappointed about this issue. Of course like any other defense contracts, the defense contracts with Korea include end user and end purpose articles.
But I don't think that Korea will bit.. around and sanction us or any other country just for using those products on the battlefield. :)
 
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Windchime

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There was word in turkish media about the Korean transmission being modified in Turkiye by Turkish engineers, so that's probably how it passed the durability tests. Also why so many purchased, isnt BMC planning to use their own powerpack after 2025.
I didn't say it would be produced or assembled in Turkiye, I said that according to statements by SSB officials in the media the Korean powerpack was going to be modified by Turkish engineers to reach a more desirable performance.
This is simply false. There are no technical inputs from BMC in the SnT transmission.
 

Windchime

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Korean transmission uses some German components. Germans embargoed the delivery of Korean transmission to Turkiye with German components on it so Korea and Turkiye came together to bypass the German embargo. In the end, Koreans localized those components, and Turkiye and Korea managed to sign a contract. The contract has 2 phases. The first phase consists of the delivery of 90 power packs. The second phase is the optional delivery of 150 additional powerpacks. I guess if something goes wrong with the Turkish powerpack production will continue with the Korean powerpack. We need to get an export license from Korea if we want to sell Altay to third countries with the Korean powerpack but i doubt it will be a big problem unless we want to sell Altay to North Korea.
Yup. To be precise, those parts were TCU, HSU, Range Pack, retarder and brakes. All were developed and replaced by either 2021 or 2022, which I can't precisely remember. SnT are claiming that they have successfully tested the new version of the transmission on test bench according to the Korean National Defense Standard, though DAPA and the Korean Army are planning for a separate acceptance test of their own.
 

Baryshx

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its funny you bring this up because i also feel their is a chance that when the war is over in Ukraine, the US may pressure Ukranian companies not to work with Turkish ones.
I think it is too late for Ukraine.

This is possible as long as Japan and Korea continue to go after the US. Already, Japan has a secret embargo on us.
 

No Name

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its funny you bring this up because i also feel their is a chance that when the war is over in Ukraine, the US may pressure Ukranian companies not to work with Turkish ones.
I'm not sure Ukrainian will have much to offer Turkeys outside of the engine, and that is something Turkey will supply Ukraine with its own indigenous engine projects thanks to the TEI.

As for Ukraine's economy, I have doubts the US will be interested in building back up Ukraine after the war, so they do not have much of a choice but to work with Turkey as the number one investor in Ukraine before was Turkey.
 

what

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Good news, if we can finally start the production.

But seems a bit expensive, the initial contract of 200m € comes down to 2m € per tank only for the transmission. The latter option would bring the costs significantly down, but still the initial contract is pretty steep pricing wise.
 

Merzifonlu

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Good news, if we can finally start the production.

But seems a bit expensive, the initial contract of 200m € comes down to 2m € per tank only for the transmission. The latter option would bring the costs significantly down, but still the initial contract is pretty steep pricing wise.
Engine+transmission.
 
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