India Coffee House

[TheInsider]

Would it be fair to take some town of Turkey that makes up 0.65% of Turkey population, and say look how under-represented they have been in highest turkish political echelons?

Turkiye has Albanians, Bosniaks, Circassians etc. All less than %1 of the population but individuals of those ethnicities are holding major offices in the republic so it is a fair assessment. If I'm not mistaken Indian Muslim population is roughly around %15 of the total Indian population. How many Muslims are there in the government of Modi? BTW there are "A LOT" of Kurds in the government of Erdogan.

 

[Nilgiri]

Turkiye has Albanians, Bosniaks, Circassians etc. All less than %1 of the population but individuals of those ethnicities are holding major offices in the republic so it is a fair assessment.

You really want me to list all the 1% minorities that have made it to high stations in India? Seriously dude?

Answer me this first:

Not to mention, just because members of some identity/community have achieved status or success in a country, does not mean that group do not suffer from some lack of human rights.

Or you are telling me the human rights problems for blacks in the US was answered by having a Black president (and many other blacks in positions of power, authority and success) for 8 years?

Your argument is flawed from the onset to begin with.

If I'm not mistaken Indian Muslim population is roughly around %15 of the total Indian population. How many Muslims are there in the government of Modi? BTW there are "A LOT" of Kurds in the government of Erdogan.

OK, and is their language a recognised one in the constitution?

If not, why are we comparing to a completely different setup of a country to begin with?

I bring up anything more than that, it will be "western propaganda" all over again.

So why would I bother?

Anyone can google or research Turkey Kurd human rights for themselves and decide for themselves surely?

It is not proper to assert anything as "better" when you do not understand the other side plainly enough to begin with.

 

[TheInsider]

Not to mention, just because members of some identity/community have achieved status or success in a country, does not mean that group do not suffer from some lack of human rights.

Or you are telling me the human rights problems for blacks in the US was answered by having a Black president (and many other blacks in positions of power, authority and success) for 8 years?

Average Kurd doesn't suffer more than an average Turk. There are equal opportunities in Turkiye regardless of you are Kurd or a Turk. There are no discrimination when you start a business, go to college, took the exams for military schools or run for presidency etc.

OK, and is their language a recognised one in the constitution?

Kurdish is not the official language of Türkiye but you can literally start a private Kurdish language institute if you want and there are Kurdish language departments in state universities.

 

[Nilgiri]

Average Kurd doesn't suffer more than an average Turk. There are equal opportunities in Turkiye regardless of you are Kurd or a Turk. There are no discrimination when you start a business, go to college, took the exams for military schools or run for presidency etc.


Kurdish is not the official language of Türkiye but you can literally start a private Kurdish language institute if you want and there are Kurdish language departments in state universities.

Anything I will say contrary to this will be "western propaganda".

Or the whole HDP = front for PKK will come out (in fact it already has from lool). i.e any HDP person saying something different to what you just said is some agent or agenda merchant I guess right? (Defeating whole purpose of their political representation you just trumpeted).

Anyway you win...there is really nothing much more to say. I dont want to pry into TR politics (all I'm saying is no country is perfect on human rights to assert to this level on another like was done).

People have told me to just believe what they say as the complete truth before.... I'm just not that kind of person....shrug.

I like finding, reading or hearing other perspectives.

It would not be proper I feel though to harangue another member here over such things though.....that is not what the forum is for as it just becomes a negative exercise.

 

[TheInsider]

HDP accepts being the political wing of PKK officially, literally. Debate is about whether the political wing of PKK should be closed or not. And up to this day no steps are taken which is IMHO high treason.

 

[TR_123456]

Else they would have done what Turks do to Kurds

This is the second time you talk bs about Türkiye.
I advise you to do some real research before making such a ridiculous statement.

 

[Nilgiri]

HDP accepts being the political wing of PKK officially, literally. Debate is about whether the political wing of PKK should be closed or not. And up to this day no steps are taken which is IMHO high treason.

OK man, this is going off topic into TR politics. I'm just saying lot of people dont understand Indian system....and lot of people don't understand Turkish one either.

So there is misunderstanding in applying one to another and trying to rank it.

 

[Nilgiri]

I decided to delete some of the more inflammatory replies prompted by the original (off topic, flawed and misconstrued) instigations and assertions....which will remain up so as to provide context for how the whole flare-up started.

There is sufficient material left untouched in convo chain that can be discussed more reasonably and addresses the premise of the initiation and response with reasonable discourse.

i.e Please do not assert flamebait falsehoods (regarding atrocities, mass crime etc) towards countries in effort to support one and diminish another.

It is best you simply say (for such contentious issues if you are not from the country) to an initiator on such topic, that he is wrong and to look up and research the matter more first etc.

This forum is not to create bad toxic atmosphere of negative assertions between members, especially by targeting whole countries in the process.

 

[Nilgiri]

For all interested in China observing @Joe Shearer @Blackbeardsgoldfish et al.

Regd Mainland Chinese impression of the UKR - RUS war....

Compare and contrast these two videos if interested and time permits:

Also consider the segment of populations represented in both (both not reflective of the whole...if you have been to Shanghai for example you will especially know why)...

i.e what is the different flavour of a take you can get from an immense complicated country?

Should the CCP itself be treated as a stark monolith....or must one look into its factions and what their nuanced and even quite different ideologies are? How does this reflect and impact in the power struggles and society churns?

Furthermore:
Should people also base some impression (on some matter) fully on the 30% of Indians that vote for the BJP federally...or the 70% that do not (leaving aside the large population that decides to not vote at all for time being)?
Can those 37% and 63% be divided into more factions and tiers of why/what?

Are these features found in all large and mid sized and even smaller sized populations in general?

questions, questions, questions....(I will delve even deeper in this thread over time....things are just getting started and time and audience is low + forming).

 

[Joe Shearer]

Should people also base some impression (on some matter) fully on the 30% of Indians that vote for the BJP federally...or the 70% that do not (leaving aside the large population that decides to not vote at all for time being)?
Can those 37% and 63% be divided into more factions and tiers of why/what?

This is the most difficult part of a democracy for people from a different kind of constitutional system to understand. I am sick of explaining that a particular government, with its promises and its threats, and its public posturings and private affiliations, does not represent a shift in thinking and outlook of the whole of the electorate, but only a part of it.

 

[Joe Shearer]

@Nilgiri

From 17:00 onwards,

 

[Nilgiri]

@Nilgiri

From 17:00 onwards,

The episodes at large have been quite good to watch.

 

[Nilgiri]

What do members think of this issue?

@Paro @Peace Lover @Rajaraja Chola @crixus @Joe Shearer @Jackdaws et al.

Indian student joining Ukraine Army to fight Russia is unacceptable, says Karti Chidambaram

Congress MP Karti Chidambaram has claimed that it is unacceptable for a foreign national to join Ukraine's fight against Russia. A 21-year-old student from Tamil Nadu had joined the paramilitary forces in Ukraine to fight against Russian invasion.

www.indiatoday.in

 

[Nilgiri]

This is the most difficult part of a democracy for people from a different kind of constitutional system to understand. I am sick of explaining that a particular government, with its promises and its threats, and its public posturings and private affiliations, does not represent a shift in thinking and outlook of the whole of the electorate, but only a part of it.

There is deeper somewhat related layer that I am seeing worldwide (India has its own unique variant).

That is....psychologically maybe about as low as 10% being radical enough can change (over enough time + intensity) the control and larger opinion and tolerance/norms of the whole society.

Sometimes as high as 40% is needed...and the average around 25% in a population for some major change/shift to occur from a minority committed enough to some change it wants on the whole.

But its agreed upon it does not need to be anywhere close to 50% (as one might think in simple "tyranny of majority force).

...basically given the presence of the "go along to get along effect" in the majority etc.

I think that is the overall consensus among the top psychologists and sociologists involved in this field.

IMO...This is both the raw potential of good (that such studies tend to focus on) but also the danger for the bad.

How Behavior Spreads, by Damon Centola was a good (recent) read.

 

[crixus]

What do members think of this issue?

@Paro @Peace Lover @Rajaraja Chola @crixus @Joe Shearer @Jackdaws et al.

Indian student joining Ukraine Army to fight Russia is unacceptable, says Karti Chidambaram

Congress MP Karti Chidambaram has claimed that it is unacceptable for a foreign national to join Ukraine's fight against Russia. A 21-year-old student from Tamil Nadu had joined the paramilitary forces in Ukraine to fight against Russian invasion.

www.indiatoday.in

I don't know if Indian govt has an policy related to individuals fighting on behalf of sovereign countries , to an extent I agree with junior Chidambaram what if Shias in India want to fight on behalf of Iran and Sunnis want to fight for Saudi while holding Indian passport.

I remember one Indian died in Iraq while fighting from American side , while holding Indian passport

Uday Singh Taunque - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Nilgiri]

I don't know if Indian govt has an policy related to individuals fighting on behalf of sovereign countries , to an extent I agree with junior Chidambaram what if Shias in India want to fight on behalf of Iran and Sunnis want to fight for Saudi while holding Indian passport.

I remember one Indian died in Iraq while fighting from American side , while holding Indian passport

Uday Singh Taunque - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

I will share my thoughts a bit later after maybe more opinions come forward.

I hope to see more Indians and members in general be as active as possible in this thread going forward.... we can discuss things much more expansively and broadly in one area rather than have it split in too many threads etc.

Members should pick up any reply here at any page here and simply add their 2 cents as they want to.

 

[Joe Shearer]

What do members think of this issue?

@Paro @Peace Lover @Rajaraja Chola @crixus @Joe Shearer @Jackdaws et al.

Indian student joining Ukraine Army to fight Russia is unacceptable, says Karti Chidambaram

Congress MP Karti Chidambaram has claimed that it is unacceptable for a foreign national to join Ukraine's fight against Russia. A 21-year-old student from Tamil Nadu had joined the paramilitary forces in Ukraine to fight against Russian invasion.

www.indiatoday.in

It's none of his business what a private citizen decides to do with himself. Chidambaram is OK, I guess, although the clouds and mists around him are getting denser and swirling around faster and faster, but this little punk opining on things is a bit difficult to bear.

 

[crixus]

It's none of his business what a private citizen decides to do with himself. Chidambaram is OK, I guess, although the clouds and mists around him are getting denser and swirling around faster and faster, but this little punk opining on things is a bit difficult to bear.

Joe did any Indian ever served in French Foreign Legion ?

 

[Zapper]

Joe did any Indian ever served in French Foreign Legion ?

Can't verify the authenticity but someone in one of the forums said this guy is an Indian legionnaire serving in Afghanistan

 

[Joe Shearer]

Joe did any Indian ever served in French Foreign Legion ?

If he did, he wouldn't say. Sneaky fellow.