Indonesia Indonesian Navy, Tentara Nasional Indonesia-Angkatan Laut (TNI-AL)

[Anmdt]

" Thales has been the leading partner of the Indonesian Navy for the last forty years, supplying combat systems for all warships in service. The strategic agreement will explore the co-development of a national Combat Management System (CMS) based on Thales’ TACTICOS CMS "

If you are not getting source code, and can not compile it from scratch that is not a national CMS. I am doubting if this agreement will fruit a national one but likely another rebranded CMS. 'Based on tacticos' also means; we will modify it as you like and you are not getting the source code.

That's why i don't like adding new species like Havelsan CMS into our service in the first argument, we have 2 Martadinata Class, 4 Diponegoro Class and in process Bung Tomo Class using TACTICOS which i hope we're getting standarise with and hopefully co-develop it into something indigeneous for our future ships, we don't adding new species into our inventory but alas i'm not policy maker.

They have installed terma on some KCR if i am not mistaken, and with Iver deal Terma was planned in the AAW frigates on the other hand installing Tacticos to an aged ship: bung tomo. It doesn't make sense in many way apart from the commonization.

 

[Cromwell]

If you are not getting source code, and can not compile it from scratch that is not a national CMS. I am doubting if this agreement will fruit a national one but likely another rebranded CMS. 'Based on tacticos' also means; we will modify it as you like and you are not getting the source code.

They have installed terma on some KCR if i am not mistaken, and with Iver deal Terma was planned in the AAW frigates on the other hand installing Tacticos to an aged ship: bung tomo. It doesn't make sense in many way apart from the commonization.

That's why i said alas i'm not a policy maker, alot of things in the country are contradictory from logics, we have C-Flex CMS in some of our missile boats, we have CMS from Kongsberg in our submarines, we have Thales TACTICOS and God knows we introduce unnecessary guest, Havelsan Advent

 

[Zinan 二]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1588920029466492928

 

[Parry Brima]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1588920029466492928

I read somewhere (forget where) that we signed a deal to build our own autonomous submarine. It's with the Germans IIRC.

 

[Lordimperator]

I read somewhere (forget where) that we signed a deal to build our own autonomous submarine. It's with the Germans IIRC.

When?

 

[Parry Brima]

When?

Found it.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1588729589391851520

The Germans provide the torpedo.

 

[JATOSINT]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1589076937825464321

 

[JATOSINT]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1589087035729809408

 

[Lordimperator]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1589105039649345537

Personally go with Atmaca, bigger warhead.

 

[Madokafc]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1589105039649345537

Personally go with Atmaca, bigger warhead.

ATMACA

My own personal opinion

So no no to ATMACA

 

[Lordimperator]

By the decree of supreme leader.
go for pointy Exocet.

ATMACA

View attachment 50123

My own personal opinion

View attachment 50124

So no no to ATMACA

Tbh, exocet already terrorized for RN and USN

 

[Anmdt]

By the decree of supreme leader.
go for pointy Exocet.

Tbh, exocet already terrorized for RN and USN

Atmaca comes with RF, IIR or Hybrid seeker and Network enabled. Exocet is not ( at least not the export version for the NEW ).

But yeah, if commonization is a matter Exocet makes the most sense.

Found it.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1588729589391851520

The Germans provide the torpedo.

Orca (AUV) - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

Kudos to PT. PAL if they can make this work. They will beat HHI and Boeing consortium and even make something with torpedoes bigger then Orca XLUUV.

And Diehl does not produce conventional HWT or Torpedo fire control systems but has supercavitation torpedo that likely won't be exported. Atlas elektronik does those jobs (HWT, Torpedo fire control, torpedo tubes etc with HDW). Diehl defence is more into missile business while Diehl controls branch might be providing them with automated control solutions.

 

[Lordimperator]

But yeah, if commonization is a matter Exocet makes the most sense

Agreed, also could exocet be integrated with Advent cms?
From the latest Polaris ex. Marine Nationale deemed they need exocet successor.

“the inadequacy of protection at sea for French ships”, but also “the inadequacy of the Exocet missile compared with other more modern missiles” and that it is urgent to remedy this.

Full:

Feedback on French Navy High Intensity Exercise POLARIS - Naval News

Review of the French Navy (Marine Nationale)'s feedback on the high-intensity exercise 'POLARIS' conducted from November 18 to December 3, 2021.

www.navalnews.com

 

[Lordimperator]

Kudos to PT. PAL if they can make this work. They will beat HHI and Boeing consortium and even make something with torpedoes bigger then Orca XLUUV.

Ahaha, press X.

 

[Anmdt]

Agreed, also could exocet be integrated with Advent cms?

Any missile can be integrated into any CMS as long both parties agree on that.

 

[Cromwell]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1589105039649345537

Personally go with Atmaca, bigger warhead.

Atmaca or Exocet would've been much more reasonable than this obsession over Brahmos though since we intend to operate 2 Arrowhead 40 with Advent CMS i can say why not with Atmaca, the specs are superior to Exocet though usually i make point on commonality reason. Both are fine, either we're getting something superior than what we usually have or something already common in our service.

 

[Gary]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1589105039649345537

Personally go with Atmaca, bigger warhead.

If the competitors are MBDA with Exocet, I'd rather have Atmaca, if it includes Kongsberg, I like the NSM lot more

 

[Lordimperator]

Which AShM will be fitted on 2 FAC made by Turkiye?

Both are fine, either we're getting something superior than what we usually have or something already common in our service.

 

[Parry Brima]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1589105039649345537

Personally go with Atmaca, bigger warhead.

Like I said in separate post/thread, prefer to use all TF-2000 armament configuration for AH140. Including Atmaca.

 

[Anmdt]

Like I said in separate post/thread, prefer to use all TF-2000 armament configuration for AH140. Including Atmaca.

I still don't understand why Indonesian Navy or the ones who manages the project clearly trying to make a multi-purpose frigate into an AAW destroyer - frigate. AH140 was meant to be cheap, affordable and in high numbers with basic equipment, not replacing Type 45 or Horizon Class.

Yes Iver Huitfeldt and De Zeven classes share the similar architecture and serves as AAW frigates but Indonesian Navy is not Dutch or Danish Navy, there is clearly a need for Type 45 - Horizon class like dedicated AAW asset to manage a wide area air defenses and even serve BMD role if needed. If we see the waters and possible frontlines to be defended need of two such AAW dedicated flagships are clear.