Pakistan Pakistan Tea House

[Joe Shearer]

View attachment 63803
All 7 British Open Squash Champions in one rare photograph

Fabulous.

Had no idea such a picture even existed.

 

[Fatman17]

I'm wondering if Pakistan has used up its nine lives.
Is this book available in pdf format?

 

[Fatman17]

Has anyone read this book?

 

[Joe Shearer]

View attachment 63810
Has anyone read this book?

<sigh>
I have been planning to buy this for so long, but there is always an emergency that drains my pockets. Soon.....

 

[Saiyan0321]

View attachment 63809
I'm wondering if Pakistan has used up its nine lives.
Is this book available in pdf format?

Books and materials thread. You know that thread has actual books in it right? Like there are PDF in there and its not just a recommend thread. It is meant to share as much notes and knowledge as one can

View attachment 63810
Has anyone read this book?

<sigh>
I have been planning to buy this for so long, but there is always an emergency that drains my pockets. Soon.....

Yeah its a good book. Got a deal a while back at about 500 PKR.. It basically covers in great length what were the civilians doing when the 1965 war was ongoing. Very detailed in that regard

 

[Joe Shearer]

View attachment 63810
Has anyone read this book?

Now after reading your post, I looked up my own records.

I had ordered it - in 2020! - and it was not delivered. On complaining to Amazon, they announced a renewal of the order, and then, a week later, a cancellation, on the grounds that it was no longer in stock, and my money would be refunded instead.

There have been two other such instances with Amazon, so now everything is to be paid for on delivery, and if that payment is not eligible, that book remains unbought.

Sad.

 

[Fatman17]

Books and materials thread. You know that thread has actual books in it right? Like there are PDF in there and its not just a recommend thread. It is meant to share as much notes and knowledge as one can



Yeah its a good book. Got a deal a while back at about 500 PKR.. It basically covers in great length what were the civilians doing when the 1965 war was ongoing. Very detailed in that regard

Roger that.

 

[Fatman17]

Now after reading your post, I looked up my own records.

I had ordered it - in 2020! - and it was not delivered. On complaining to Amazon, they announced a renewal of the order, and then, a week later, a cancellation, on the grounds that it was no longer in stock, and my money would be refunded instead.

There have been two other such instances with Amazon, so now everything is to be paid for on delivery, and if that payment is not eligible, that book remains unbought.

Sad.

My sister was in the UK recently. She couldn't find this book either in some of the leading bookstores.

 

[Joe Shearer]

My sister was in the UK recently. She couldn't find this book either in some of the leading bookstores.

If you wish, something can be arranged.

It is available for ₹960 in India, and can be sent to Dubai to be picked up.

I have been trying in vain to get someone to carry a book from 'saiyan' to Dubai, but so far no luck. THAT book is a treasure, but it is for 'saiyan' to say what he wishes about it (he has multiple copies!).

@Saiyan0321

 

[Saiyan0321]

Now after reading your post, I looked up my own records.

I had ordered it - in 2020! - and it was not delivered. On complaining to Amazon, they announced a renewal of the order, and then, a week later, a cancellation, on the grounds that it was no longer in stock, and my money would be refunded instead.

There have been two other such instances with Amazon, so now everything is to be paid for on delivery, and if that payment is not eligible, that book remains unbought.

Sad.

I remember you telling me this story

If you wish, something can be arranged.

It is available for ₹960 in India, and can be sent to Dubai to be picked up.

I have been trying in vain to get someone to carry a book from 'saiyan' to Dubai, but so far no luck. THAT book is a treasure, but it is for 'saiyan' to say what he wishes about it (he has multiple copies!).

@Saiyan0321

There is a shortage of this book. Weird, i would have thought with the writer and the publisher, there would have been multiple copies available at all times

 

[Joe Shearer]

I remember you telling me this story

There is a shortage of this book. Weird, i would have thought with the writer and the publisher, there would have been multiple copies available at all times

What? The Farooq Bajwa book? I can help, but not this month.

Maybe February or March.

 

[Fatman17]

If you wish, something can be arranged.

It is available for ₹960 in India, and can be sent to Dubai to be picked up.

I have been trying in vain to get someone to carry a book from 'saiyan' to Dubai, but so far no luck. THAT book is a treasure, but it is for 'saiyan' to say what he wishes about it (he has multiple copies!).

@Saiyan0321

Let me check because a friend has recently moved to dubai. This is definitely possible.

 

[Saiyan0321]

Let me check because a friend has recently moved to dubai. This is definitely possible.

from kutch to tashkent: the indo-pakistan war of 1965

click.daraz.pk

Just order it from here. If not then I can buy it for you and send it to you.

 

[Nilgiri]

View attachment 63803
All 7 British Open Squash Champions in one rare photograph

Jansher Khan was one I know best, he was in Hong Kong a lot (place I grew up) winning the HK open a lot. I know the squash centre there quite well, its inside the big building next to star ferry I walked through a lot (once I got to see the amphitheatre organ up close which is one of the largest in the world).

I saw this up close and some of us lucky kids on that school trip got to press a few keys @Joe Shearer

Hong Kong Cultural Centre Organ Music Programmes - The Rieger Organ of the Hong Kong Cultural Centre

Built in 1989, the handmade pipe organ by the Austrian manufacturer Rieger Orgelbau is the most sparkling star in the magnificent Hong Kong Cultural Centre Concert Hall. With 4 manuals, 1 pedalboard, 93 stops and 8 000 pipes, this four-storey tall “King of the Instruments” is one of the largest...

www.lcsd.gov.hk

Not too far away is the kowloon cricket club, where my school team faced off in a final against our top (fellow english medium) rival school. I had a good partnership in that game with one of my best mates, a Pakistani kid.

I look back at 1990s HK with a heavy sense of nostalgia to this day.

 

[Nilgiri]

View attachment 63809
I'm wondering if Pakistan has used up its nine lives.
Is this book available in pdf format?

I dont think a 9 lives thing applies to countries the size of Pakistan, there's in the end too many people vested in it and exposed to the better ideas and success of other places, that they want to see in Pakistan too.

Now how those entrenched in keeping bad ideas make way for this group of people is all it boils down to. The pressure is certainly mounting to turn the ship around, but doesnt mean the ship itself is lost cause and out of time etc. Some countries in world have rebounded intensely from far worse predicaments (China was starting at some awful awful things during Mao tenure), it needs right set of visionary principled people to soak into enough of the power circles.

 

[Fatman17]

I dont think a 9 lives thing applies to countries the size of Pakistan, there's in the end too many people vested in it and exposed to the better ideas and success of other places, that they want to see in Pakistan too.

Now how those entrenched in keeping bad ideas make way for this group of people is all it boils down to. The pressure is certainly mounting to turn the ship around, but doesnt mean the ship itself is lost cause and out of time etc. Some countries in world have rebounded intensely from far worse predicaments (China was starting at some awful awful things during Mao tenure), it needs right set of visionary principled people to soak into enough of the power circles.

Therein lies the problem "visionary people ".
Nawaz
Bilawal
Zardari
Far from being visionary.
The mullahs? Less said the better.
Army Generals ? We know that score.
Imran Khan actually "too visionary for comfort ".
Maybe you're right about the 9 lives thing but what are the moments in our history which we may count as part of our 9 lives.
71 Debacle definitely
Hanging of ZAB?
Afghan war 1980 and the influx of refugees bringing the kalishnikov culture and drugs.?
Gen Zia arnd the islamization of the military and civilian life.
These for me are big negatives.

 

[Fatman17]

Jansher Khan was one I know best, he was in Hong Kong a lot (place I grew up) winning the HK open a lot. I know the squash centre there quite well, its inside the big building next to star ferry I walked through a lot (once I got to see the amphitheatre organ up close which is one of the largest in the world).

I saw this up close and some of us lucky kids on that school trip got to press a few keys @Joe Shearer

Hong Kong Cultural Centre Organ Music Programmes - The Rieger Organ of the Hong Kong Cultural Centre

Built in 1989, the handmade pipe organ by the Austrian manufacturer Rieger Orgelbau is the most sparkling star in the magnificent Hong Kong Cultural Centre Concert Hall. With 4 manuals, 1 pedalboard, 93 stops and 8 000 pipes, this four-storey tall “King of the Instruments” is one of the largest...

www.lcsd.gov.hk

Not too far away is the kowloon cricket club, where my school team faced off in a final against our top (fellow english medium) rival school. I had a good partnership in that game with one of my best mates, a Pakistani kid.

I look back at 1990s HK with a heavy sense of nostalgia to this day.

Wow that's awesome indeed. I love Hong Kong . Visited a few times. The evenings are fantastic. So much to do. Pubs and restaurants and friendly people.

 

[Nilgiri]

Therein lies the problem "visionary people ".
Nawaz
Bilawal
Zardari
Far from being visionary.
The mullahs? Less said the better.
Army Generals ? We know that score.
Imran Khan actually "too visionary for comfort ".
Maybe you're right about the 9 lives thing but what are the moments in our history which we may count as part of our 9 lives.
71 Debacle definitely
Hanging of ZAB?
Afghan war 1980 and the influx of refugees bringing the kalishnikov culture and drugs.?
Gen Zia arnd the islamization of the military and civilian life.
These for me are big negatives.

Yes its why I qualified it with principled.

If there are little to no principles (especially applied rather than just stated), any vision is hollow and hypocritical.

I myself am a strange hybrid (in my thinking and lived experience) of Indian, Chinese and Western.

In each of these, there are visionaries with little principle (ending up doing great harm) to compare with those that had them and grounded them (and ended up doing great good).

Take Mao....his principles were better suited to the realm of war....but not peace...and he did not know how to change. China proved too big for his vision as a result. Better principles that came after him by Xiaoping, Yaobang, Ziyang et al. (whom Mao had earlier tormented at times near inevitably due to his lack of principle) crafted a more proper vision as well.

There were still great flaws (my mom put it brutally one day as to you simply dont know who made which specific calls on Tiananmen, whatever they might say later on it).....but things did improve and play some measure in the redemption of China compared to how it otherwise would have been.

Pakistan had a unique inheritance of paranoia, demagoguery and incompetence in its early years as byproduct of what is (IMO) within the rushed and conceptually flawed partition (how this then coursed within the psyche of power unique to it).

These are all strong counter-currents to principle and have impacts and inertias that are definitely very difficult to emerge out of in any appreciable intensity. But I judge countries on its best people I know (sometimes firsthand by my good fortune).....not its worst. Their time always comes at some point.

Do you sense an innate goodness? I sense it with every country in end....in the end its all people the same as anywhere ( I sense and trust in the innate goodness of humankind)....the clay ready for great forging...needing good hands. While this is not there in enough measure, bad elements surface and entrench and the misfortune permeates on the entirety. That is true. But good competent principled people grow restless the longer this goes on, this is the early part of any redemption.

Good people also fall by the wayside in life due to any number of circumstances, doesnt mean they turn bad and are doomed to remain in misfortune. Like a kid said in one movie to homeless woman.... your heart may be broken, but it isnt gone.....if it was gone.....you wouldnt be this nice. This marked something of a turning point in the movie too, redemption arcs strike the deepest chord within us for a reason.

 

[Joe Shearer]

Yes its why I qualified it with principled.

If there are little to no principles (especially applied rather than just stated), any vision is hollow and hypocritical.

I myself am a strange hybrid (in my thinking and lived experience) of Indian, Chinese and Western.

In each of these, there are visionaries with little principle (ending up doing great harm) to compare with those that had them and grounded them (and ended up doing great good).

Take Mao....his principles were better suited to the realm of war....but not peace...and he did not know how to change. China proved too big for his vision as a result. Better principles that came after him by Xiaoping, Yaobang, Ziyang et al. (whom Mao had earlier tormented at times near inevitably due to his lack of principle) crafted a more proper vision as well.

There were still great flaws (my mom put it brutally one day as to you simply dont know who made which specific calls on Tiananmen, whatever they might say later on it).....but things did improve and play some measure in the redemption of China compared to how it otherwise would have been.

Pakistan had a unique inheritance of paranoia, demagoguery and incompetence in its early years as byproduct of what is (IMO) within the rushed and conceptually flawed partition (how this then coursed within the psyche of power unique to it).

These are all strong counter-currents to principle and have impacts and inertias that are definitely very difficult to emerge out of in any appreciable intensity. But I judge countries on its best people I know (sometimes firsthand by my good fortune).....not its worst. Their time always comes at some point.

Do you sense an innate goodness? I sense it with every country in end....in the end its all people the same as anywhere ( I sense and trust in the innate goodness of humankind)....the clay ready for great forging...needing good hands. While this is not there in enough measure, bad elements surface and entrench and the misfortune permeates on the entirety. That is true. But good competent principled people grow restless the longer this goes on, this is the early part of any redemption.

Good people also fall by the wayside in life due to any number of circumstances, doesnt mean they turn bad and are doomed to remain in misfortune. Like a kid said in one movie to homeless woman.... your heart may be broken, but it isnt gone.....if it was gone.....you wouldnt be this nice. This marked something of a turning point in the movie too, redemption arcs strike the deepest chord within us for a reason.

Not my conversation, but I agree, with some grave reservations, when I try to relate your paradigm, @Nilgiri, to our own situation in India. It is terrifying.

Unlike the situation in Pakistan, we in India are faced by a very thorough and systematic movement, served by talented managers, though their ideation might not be up to speed. What is fearful is their ability to break down every obstacle into actionable portions, and then to put teams to act on those. Every obstacle, indeed, some social features that others might not have recognised as obstacles.

Not to take the conversation from Pakistan, so please ignore this outburst of mine.

 

[Fatman17]

Not my conversation, but I agree, with some grave reservations, when I try to relate your paradigm, @Nilgiri, to our own situation in India. It is terrifying.

Unlike the situation in Pakistan, we in India are faced by a very thorough and systematic movement, served by talented managers, though their ideation might not be up to speed. What is fearful is their ability to break down every obstacle into actionable portions, and then to put teams to act on those. Every obstacle, indeed, some social features that others might not have recognised as obstacles.

Not to take the conversation from Pakistan, so please ignore this outburst of mine.

You're welcome to comment