TR Propulsion Systems

Yasar_TR

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PBS TJ100

View attachment 18344
TEI TJ300

View attachment 18345
Compressor TypeCentrifugalAxial
Outer Diameter272mm240mm
Length625mm450mm
Weight19.5kg34kg
Thrust1250 N1300 N
PBS-TJ100 has a centrifugal compressor. These type of engines are old school engines. No more used but in turboshafts and small turbojets. It is however, more efficient where single compressor stages are used. A single centrifugal compressor stage can produce 3-4 times more compression than its axial counterpart. To make up for this, axial compressors have multiple stages. (It is much harder to apply more stages to a centrifugal compressor.)
TJ-300 has axial flow compressor. Somehow our engine is almost twice as heavy. This can be attributed to using multiple axial compressor stages, whereas the PBS engine may only have a single compressor stage!
 

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Yasar_TR

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TJ-150 with similar dimensions but 1500 N thrust.
IMO, in no time TEI will get to 1500 N , who knows.
Production of TJ-300, if you listen to Prof Aksit, was the result of TEI, experimenting on an axial flow engine. They knew they would be asked to produce an axial flow turbofan engine soon. So they wanted to produce a small engine as a trial run. It happened to fit the bill for an engine for medium range anti ship missile. There is a TJ400 somewhere along the line as well!
 
A

Alpagu

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Missile engine TJ300 breaks world record
🎯 TJ300 broke a world record in its class with its 1342 newton thrust
🎯 Can work at high speeds up to 90 percent of the speed of sound
🎯 Can be used in air, land and sea systems
 

Combat-Master

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PBS TJ100 is a lot lighter despite being a larger engine. :unsure:


PBS TJ100 uses a lot less material, 1 centrifugal compressor and 1 high pressure turbine
TJ100.jpg


TEI TJ300 has 4 axial compressor stages, 3 stator vane and 1 high pressure turbine - This engine has so much more growth potential.
1618599546781.png
 
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Zafer

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PBS TJ100 uses a lot less material, 1 centrifugal compressor and 1 high pressure turbine
View attachment 18351

TEI TJ300 has 4 axial compressor stages, 3 stator vane and 1 high pressure turbine - This engine has so much more growth potential.
View attachment 18353
A centrifugal compressor doubles the air pressure; an axial compressor multiplies the pressure by 1,2 . When you have 4 compressor stages your pressure becomes 1.2^4 = 2.0736 times the initial air pressure. A four stage axial builds more pressure than a one stage centrifugal compressor.
 
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Yasar_TR

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PBS TJ100 uses a lot less material, 1 centrifugal compressor and 1 high pressure turbine
View attachment 18351

TEI TJ300 has 4 axial compressor stages, 3 stator vane and 1 high pressure turbine - This engine has so much more growth potential.
View attachment 18353
This is normal. As I explained in my previous post, TJ300 was produced as a trial for an axial flow jet engine prior to a larger turbofan, TEI knew they were going to be asked to produce for TFX.
 

Yasar_TR

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Chairman of the Board of Directors and General Manager Prof Dr Mahmut Faruk Akşit:

"Our TEI-TJ300 engine is capable enough to propel a 500 kg missile or 1,300 kg aircraft comfortably."

They could develop from this very core, a turbofan which would be more economical and give more thrust. Two of those engines could fly a high subsonic Jet UAV. After all the main object of the TJ-300 exercise was to test themselves to see how good an axial flow jet engine they could make, prior to building a turbofan.
That would also open the road for our own turbofan powered “Gezgin” cruise missile.
 

Combat-Master

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They could develop from this very core, a turbofan which would be more economical and give more thrust. Two of those engines could fly a high subsonic Jet UAV. After all the main object of the TJ-300 exercise was to test themselves to see how good an axial flow jet engine they could make, prior to building a turbofan.
That would also open the road for our own turbofan powered “Gezgin” cruise missile.

KTJ-3200 is also an axial flow jet engine with 2x the thrust output of a TJ300. UAVs with single engine definitely the most cost effective solution here.
 

Yasar_TR

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KTJ-3200 is also an axial flow jet engine with 2x the thrust output of a TJ300. UAVs with single engine definitely the most cost effective solution here.
Can you trust Kale to produce a turbofan version of that engine? It took them how many years to produce KTJ-3200? Still not in full service! Also KTJ-3200 is a throw-away engine. It’s inner parts won’t last if used as a UAV engine. We need TEI’s expertise for the UAV engine.
You are correct single more powerful engine is the economical route. But if you haven’t got it? The twin engine is a solution! (Aksungur and Akinci example)
 

Combat-Master

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Can you trust Kale to produce a turbofan version of that engine? It took them how many years to produce KTJ-3200? Still not in full service! Also KTJ-3200 is a throw-away engine. It’s inner parts won’t last if used as a UAV engine. We need TEI’s expertise for the UAV engine.
You are correct single more powerful engine is the economical route. But if you haven’t got it? The twin engine is a solution! (Aksungur and Akinci example)

KTJ-3200 is in serial production. Integration tests are being carried out on various air-breathing Turkish missiles. KALE has gained alot of experience and are developing an APU version of KTJ-3200, which indicates the engine is capable of long operation. As these engines are approved for strategic missiles, yes - I trust Kale.
 

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Can you trust Kale to produce a turbofan version of that engine? It took them how many years to produce KTJ-3200? Still not in full service! Also KTJ-3200 is a throw-away engine. It’s inner parts won’t last if used as a UAV engine. We need TEI’s expertise for the UAV engine.
You are correct single more powerful engine is the economical route. But if you haven’t got it? The twin engine is a solution! (Aksungur and Akinci example)


You forget one thing, Kale didn't have the machine like TEI. TEI did have a lot of equipments from partners(you name it) and Kale do not have. Thats why it take them so long not because they couldn't. If you compare it like that Kale is more capable then TEI.
 

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