Defence Q&A S-400 or F-35 for Turkey ? |Debate and Discussion

what

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Another embarassing and probably futile step by Hulusi Akar in Hürriyet. He proposed a Cyprus-Crete S300 kind of scenario to solve the S400 issue. The government fucked up so bad, they are now offering putting the 2bln € system somewhere else, in another place to get rid of the sanctions and access to F35.

 

Lool

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Lol
Honestly I got fed up with the contradictory news tbh
Some say no S400 others say there is an S400
Ppl got bored already
I think we should go with what Erdo said: "Everything will be decided in my next visit to Russia" lets see what happens
 

Kartal1

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Honestly I got fed up with the contradictory news tbh
Some say no S400 others say there is an S400
Ppl got bored already
I think we should go with what Erdo said: "Everything will be decided in my next visit to Russia" lets see what happens
Russians like to say "Поживём-Увидим" (Pozhivyom Uvidim) which translates into "We live, we see/Wait and see".
 

Stuka

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Pentagon and Lockheed Martin Agree to F-35 Sustainment Contracts

September 13, 2021

Supporting Readiness for the Warfighter While Reducing Costs

FORT WORTH, Texas, Sept. 13, 2021 -- The F-35 Joint Program Office awarded the Lockheed Martin (NYSE: LMT) industry team annualized contracts covering fiscal years 2021-2023 to support operations and sustainment of the global F-35 fleet, supporting mission readiness and further reducing costs.
The annual contracts fund critical sustainment activities for aircraft currently in the fleet and build enterprise capacity to support the future fleet of more than 3,000 F-35 aircraft. This includes industry sustainment experts supporting base and depot maintenance, pilot and maintainer training, and sustaining engineering for the U.S. and our allies across the globe. It also covers fleet-wide data analytics and supply chain management for part repair and replenishment to enhance overall supply availability for the fleet.
"Together with the F-35 Joint Program Office, we recognize the critical role the F-35 plays in supporting our customers’ global missions and the need to deliver this capability affordably,” said Bridget Lauderdale, Lockheed Martin vice president and general manager of the F-35 program. “These contracts represent more than a 30% reduction in cost per flying hour from the 2020 annualized contract, and exemplify the trusted partnership and commitment we share to reduce sustainment costs and increase availability for this unrivaled 5th generation weapon system.”
The FY2021-2023 contracts represent a planned next step in further reducing overall operations and support costs for the F-35 program, which are shared between government and industry. Lockheed Martin has reduced our cost per flight hour by 44% in the past five years, with a forecasted reduction of an additional 40% in the next five years. The cost savings in the FY21-23 annualized sustainment contracts support Lockheed Martin’s efforts to realize these goals. The savings will be achieved through improved cost and velocity in our supply chain, continued reliability improvements, and greater manpower efficiencies to provide product support solutions across the growing, global fleet. We remain committed to partnering with our customers and teammates to drive F-35 sustainment costs down.
The contracts also pave the way for a longer-term, Performance Based Logistics (PBL) agreement for the F-35 program. PBLs are an industry best practice, facilitating agile sustainment solutions for the fleet and incentivizing even further affordability and performance results.
The F-35 Joint Program Office, together with each U.S. service, international operators and the F-35 industry team, leads F-35 sustainment and the Global Support Solution. The 2021 annualized sustainment contract will cover industry sustainment activities through Dec. 31, 2021.

Greater Reliability and Affordability
Program data shows the F-35's reliability continues to improve as the jet is approximately twice as reliable as fourth generation fighters. It also shows maintenance labor hours needed per flight hour are well within the contractual requirement, while the global fleet is averaging around 70% mission capable rates. Lockheed Martin has significantly lowered its share of cost per flight hour over the last five years, and the broader F-35 team is working across government and industry to achieve greater affordability.
More than 690 aircraft have been delivered and are operating from 21 bases around the globe. More than 1,460 pilots and 11,025 maintainers have been trained and the F-35 fleet has surpassed 430,000 cumulative flight hours.
For additional information, visit www.f35.com.

About Lockheed Martin
Headquartered in Bethesda, Maryland, Lockheed Martin Corporation is a global security and aerospace company that employs approximately 114,000 people worldwide and is principally engaged in the research, design, development, manufacture, integration and sustainment of advanced technology systems, products and services.
 

Stuka

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Lockheed Martin Awarded $1.1 Billion for 16 F-35 Contracts with US Navy​


Lockheed Martin Aeronautics Company [of] Fort Worth, Texas is awarded a $1,099,631,252 contract,” the Defense Department said in a press release on Friday.

“This modification exercises options for the production and delivery of 16, Lot 15 F-35 Lightning II aircraft: 10 for the Air Force and six for the Marine Corps.”


> This would put the Price per F35, for LOT 15, at 68.750.000 USD
 

TheInsider

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Spook

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Even If It was real they wouldn't be telling that to the public

Transporting without public knowledge in this day and age, would be very difficult. People would comment about increased traffic in the base, satellite photos etc. That aside Russian would be the first to release statements anyways.
 

Bogeyman 

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I have a surprise for you guys

The US Congress has proposed a law for the sale of F-35s sold to Turkey to Greece.
Maybe they will arms sale Greece with our money.

(5) the United States Government should continue to deepen
strong partnerships with the Greek military, especially in
co-development and co-production opportunities with the Greek
Navy;

(7) the United States should, as appropriate, support the
sale of F-35 Joint Strike Fighters to Greece to include those
F-35 aircraft produced for but never delivered to Turkey as a
result of Turkey's exclusion from the program due to its
purchase of the Russian S-400 air defense system;
 

Anastasius

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I have a surprise for you guys

The US Congress has proposed a law for the sale of F-35s sold to Turkey to Greece.
Maybe they will arms sale Greece with our money.

(5) the United States Government should continue to deepen
strong partnerships with the Greek military, especially in
co-development and co-production opportunities with the Greek
Navy;

(7) the United States should, as appropriate, support the
sale of F-35 Joint Strike Fighters to Greece to include those
F-35 aircraft produced for but never delivered to Turkey as a
result of Turkey's exclusion from the program due to its
purchase of the Russian S-400 air defense system;
I think this is an old proposition. I heard about Turkish F-35s being sold to Greece all the way back in 2019.
 

Lool

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Lool
Even the Koreans are surprised rn

PS: Iam not saying that the aircraft is bad by any means; after all, it is still one of the most advanced jets ever made. However, it isnt as crucial to obtain and not worth the expensive price tag as some portrays it to be

 
Last edited:

Akritas

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I just see him pointing out the hypocrisy of S-300 Greece and S-400 Turkey, which he does often anyway..
Hypocricy from whom?
Turkey of course.

Did Greece buy S300?
No, was Cyprus that bought the system.

Did Turkey threat Cyprus?
Yes, Turkey threatened to bomb it as it was being offloaded from the ship delivering it.
Turkish Armed Forces, when the purchase of S-300 was announced, obtained from Israel surface-to-surface missiles, which could be used in a military operation to destroy the S-300 if they were installed on the island.
In November 1997, Turkish armed forces carried out a military exercise in occupied Cyprus, where they destroyed S-300 dummy missiles to prepare for operations against the real missiles on Republic of Cyprus.

Why didn’t NATO or USA object?
Because in 1999 it was perfectly legal for a NATO member to purchase and own Russian systems.
Again: Greece didn't buy the missiles from Russia.
Greece took the missiles in 1998 from Cyprus, under USA idea, that the Cypriot S300 be based in Crete and swapped with other military weapons acceptable to Turkey.
Greece has not aqcuired any S-300 missile system, had(and has) the Patriot system. It was Cyprus, which aquired the missiles, while Cyprus was and is still not a NATO member.

 
M

Manomed

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Hypocricy from whom?
Turkey of course.

Did Greece buy S300?
No, was Cyprus that bought the system.

Did Turkey threat Cyprus?
Yes, Turkey threatened to bomb it as it was being offloaded from the ship delivering it.
Turkish Armed Forces, when the purchase of S-300 was announced, obtained from Israel surface-to-surface missiles, which could be used in a military operation to destroy the S-300 if they were installed on the island.
In November 1997, Turkish armed forces carried out a military exercise in occupied Cyprus, where they destroyed S-300 dummy missiles to prepare for operations against the real missiles on Republic of Cyprus.

Why didn’t NATO or USA object?
Because in 1999 it was perfectly legal for a NATO member to purchase and own Russian systems.
Again: Greece didn't buy the missiles from Russia.
Greece took the missiles in 1998 from Cyprus, under USA idea, that the Cypriot S300 be based in Crete and swapped with other military weapons acceptable to Turkey.
Greece has not aqcuired any S-300 missile system, had(and has) the Patriot system. It was Cyprus, which aquired the missiles, while Cyprus was and is still not a NATO member.

go cry somewhere else bruh what are you dendias of internet? Holy shit I had enough of your bullshit
 

blackjack

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WTF is going on man the U.S. is like 2nd place behind Russia in the ICPC programming competitions where the students in that MIT university all look chinese but still cant get this to function while they are moving on to making the Su-70 an Su-75 independent of not needing pilots?
 
M

Manomed

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WTF is going on man the U.S. is like 2nd place behind Russia in the ICPC programming competitions where the students in that MIT university all look chinese but still cant get this to function while they are moving on to making the Su-70 an Su-75 independent of not needing pilots?
su-70 will end up just like su 57 russians doesn't even have good aesa radars.
 

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