Turkey’s Air Force Is Obsolete, Warns New Study

[Nutuk]

F35 is basically like the German tanks we had (that we could not even use in the east of our own country).

If strings are too many it doesn't matter how advanced the device is, you can't use it!

 

[Quasar]

F35 is basically like the German tanks we had (that we could not even use in the east of our own country).

If strings are too many it doesn't matter how advanced the device is, you can't use it!

The only sorrow I have is 10 Billion USD work share and even if we do not have F 35 it already contributed to our industry so much that we can not and should not ignore it.

 

[Nutuk]

Yeah but it was not our choice to quit F35, we just did not allow more strings (like US deciding for us to acquire S-400 or not).

 

[Anmdt]

And the person who write about it is Turkish, wher the fak do you live?

He knows a little about the technical aspect,but more on politics & strategics, so he is solely judging based on purchases and capabilities of assets. From that sole point of view he is right, if there is no new systems introduces post 2030 there will be issues.
But what he has neglected:
-modernization process with local contribution
-following trends with unmanned systems
-mid-term plan for a air superiority fighter and advanced trainer jet with a reserve design to be a light fighter.
-local components and short-mid term aims for layered AA.

 

[Ryder]

F35 is basically like the German tanks we had (that we could not even use in the east of our own country).

If strings are too many it doesn't matter how advanced the device is, you can't use it!

Whats the point in buying this shit when they dont even allow us to use it???

What kind of logic do these people have. We will sell you weapons but you cant use them they have to stay in the garage.

If you want to use them you got to get permission from us. Well bullshit!!!!

Seriously thank God that Turkiye has woken up and is going full steam ahead in building its own shit.

Who the hell wants to deal with the bullshit that Western arms companies layout not to mention the fraud arguments of human rights.

 

[BordoEnes]

There is some merit to the article but of course it doesn't show the full picture. The aforementioned countless simultaneous projects that we are undergoing should show the resolve of our country's desire to become wielders of advanced weapons and systems without any strings attached. We have no intention of lagging behind our competitors, we will however do it our own way as usual.

Despite all being said I do certainly agree we need some kind of intermediate aircraft that will fill the air superiority fighter role until our MMU comes of age. Lot of people say that we can just get Akinci air-to-air configuration but that simply does not replace dedicated manned fighter jets. I will reiterate what I said earlier, acquiring at least a squad of Eurofighters or similar aircrafts will solve practically all of our problems.

 

[Zafer]

acquiring at least a squad of Eurofighters or similar aircrafts will solve practically all of our problems

Do they come with no strings attached or do they come at all.

 

[BordoEnes]

Do they come with no strings attached or do they come at all.

Any aircraft you buy will come with strings attached period.

 

[Nutuk]

IMO we do not need foreign fighter aircraft anymore,
F16 modernization with AESA + Hurjet will do fine

Instead of wishing for foreign fighters we should concentrate on new tactics, like drones with AESA radars.

If we define the tactics right we are not lacking airpower, on the contrary we will be the leading / defining power.

Not the number of aircraft but the new tactics used overwhelm the enemy

 

[BordoEnes]

IMO we do not need foreign fighter aircraft anymore,
F16 modernization with AESA + Hurjet will do fine

Instead of wishing for foreign fighters we should concentrate on new tactics, like drones with AESA radars.

If we define the tactics right we are not lacking airpower, on the contrary we will be the leading / defining power.

Not the number of aircraft but the new tactics used overwhelm the enemy

I disagree to some extent. Whilst its true that the capabilities of our airforce largely depends in the manner we use them, the platforms in themselves have a limit to their capabilities that no amount of upgrading will fix. Our F-16's will become extremely capable but still will have many limits that only new platforms can fix. Most of you will point out Hurjet or TF-X but those are still years away to fully mature and wont be available in large quantities anytime soon. A limited acquisition of Eurofighters could completely mitigate any problems for the foreseeable decade. I am not proposing buy them in large quantities, just enough to benefit from the platform and secure our options and capabilities. Of course this doesn't mean I disagree with our own projects.

 

[Khagan1923]

Whats the point in buying this shit when they dont even allow us to use it???

What kind of logic do these people have. We will sell you weapons but you cant use them they have to stay in the garage.

If you want to use them you got to get permission from us. Well bullshit!!!!

Seriously thank God that Turkiye has woken up and is going full steam ahead in building its own shit.

Who the hell wants to deal with the bullshit that Western arms companies layout not to mention the fraud arguments of human rights.

They sold them to be used against the Russian at the time. So when Turkey started using them against their own funded proxies they got mad. This has been going on forever with other products you just never heard about it. This is why Turkey needs an independent arms industry.

From the smallest part (screw) to the biggest part (engine) every single things needs to be produced in house. Because others will always try to sabotage you. Even the things we can buy they delay it on bullshit reason, so get a product others get in 2-3 months in 9-12 months.

 

[Quasar]

They sold them to be used against the Russian at the time. So when Turkey started using them against their own funded proxies they got mad. This has been going on forever with other products you just never heard about it. This is why Turkey needs an independent arms industry.

From the smallest part (screw) to the biggest part (engine) every single things needs to be produced in house. Because others will always try to sabotage you. Even the things we can buy they delay it on bullshit reason, so get a product others get in 2-3 months in 9-12 months.

Temel Kotil was giving an example with valves for instance lets say there are two types of valves open and closed ones and lets say you are ordering an open valve from outside they are sending you a closed valve oposite of what you want/need and you have to wait for another 6 months.... kind of secret embargo so yeee we should be able to manufacture even the smallest screw

 

[Nutuk]

I disagree to some extent. Whilst its true that the capabilities of our airforce largely depends in the manner we use them, the platforms in themselves have a limit to their capabilities that no amount of upgrading will fix. Our F-16's will become extremely capable but still will have many limits that only new platforms can fix. Most of you will point out Hurjet or TF-X but those are still years away to fully mature and wont be available in large quantities anytime soon. A limited acquisition of Eurofighters could completely mitigate any problems for the foreseeable decade. I am not proposing buy them in large quantities, just enough to benefit from the platform and secure our options and capabilities. Of course this doesn't mean I disagree with our own projects.

1) If we take our air to ground capabilities, with all our drones Greeks cannot even come near let alone match our capabilities
2) Greeks will want to match us in Air to Air capabilities. There we should act wisely, instead of investing a lot in new type fighter we should invest in upgrading our F16's and acquire superior missiles like Meteor (meteor missiles at range work only well in combination with Awacs (we have 4 of them)) + we can produce unlimited Bozdogan and Gokdogan air to air missiles.

We are still at advantage, aircraft allone do not do magic


So why would we need for instance Eurofighter? What advantage would it bring? If none, it is waste of money.

 

[Nutuk]

Temel Kotil was giving an example with valves for instance lets say there are two types of valves open and closed ones and lets say you are ordering an open valve from outside they are sending you a closed valve oposite of what you want/need and you have to wait for another 6 months.... kind of secret embargo so yeee we should be able to manufacture even the smallest screw

Act smart, order a closed valve if you need an open valve

Just kidding. And waiting 6 months for a valve? What kind of valve would that be, a golden valve?

 

[Quasar]

Act smart, order a closed valve if you need an open valve

Just kidding. And waiting 6 months for a valve? What kind of valve would that be, a golden valve?

I guess he was just trying to explain what sort of crazy things are going on or what sort of things that they have to deal with to ordinary people like me on TV

 

[TheInsider]

The article is full of bullshit and has no idea what air superiority is.

 

[Glass🚬]

The article is full of bullshit and has no idea what air superiority is.

Shit talking Turkey sells good but it doesnt affect anything so let them bark.

 

[CAN_TR]

Did they really interviewed EDAM or Lockheed Martin?

This article has of course some points but overall missing a lot of different more important points in moder aerial warfare...
- 1st mistake, TuAF has a pretty respectable inventory of weapons, with growing indigenious state of the art missiles.
- Ongoing modernization process of F-16.
- Early warning radars, multi layered air defence systems, EW warfare capabilities.
- One of the most advanced available AEW&C's, aerial refueling capabilities and HavaSoj SIGINT aircrafts under development.

The only thing Turkey lost with the F-35 is the Industrial participation, besides that really glad that we didn't bought this trojan horse neitherless also not happy with S-400 pruchase.

 

[TheInsider]

It is not about shit-talking there are so many things to consider when you talk about air superiority. But the first thing to consider is how good is your superiority over the electromagnetic spectrum is. Even the AIM-120D AMRAAM performs miserably against modern DRFM jamming techniques.

People always compare this country has this amount of fighters and that amount of missiles so this country is better than the other one those comparisons are worthless. A country that has superiority over the electromagnetic spectrum is light years ahead of the country that has nothing. Turkish Armed forces deploy some serious EW capability in the field.

U.S. Navy Aims To Curb Enemy Jamming | Aviation Week Network

U.S. Navy tests new targeting technologies

aviationweek.com

Strategic depth, layered air-defense shield, firepower superiority(ballistic missiles, guided artillery rockets, cruise missiles, various guided air to ground ammo, UCAVs, kamikaze UAVs), national production of A-A missiles, and smart/guided A-G ammunitions(they will be depleted in days in a real war) all contribute to air superiority.

TurAF has thousands of JDAM equivalent in its inventory, hundreds of cruise missiles, and producing even more as we speak so it is easy for TurAF to sustain precision bombardment tempo over a long time frame and replenish the stocks via local production. The same will happen with A-A missiles starting from this year.

 

[Manomed]

Turkish Air force is a capable air force All of the block 40s and 50s are modernized to the 50+ avionics wise these are just dumb arguments