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Lool

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If France is concerned then surely we are doing something right! :D
The problem is that France wont be keeping its silent stance forever
They will have to act either sooner or later to try and curb the rising Turkish influence
 

Combat-Master

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ssa.jpg
 

Kartal1

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The problem is that France wont be keeping its silent stance forever
They will have to act either sooner or later to try and curb the rising Turkish influence
Supporting, training, arming terrorist organization on our border, hosting these terrorists in their country and doing the same with dictators in Africa is not exactly a silent stance. What else can France do without provoking a similar response? Nothing. I can assure you that Turkey is not the prey in this situation. A military response will be a catastrophe.
 

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France: We are concerned about the use of Turkish UCAVs in Ukraine​

Spokesperson of the French Ministry of Foreign Affairs said that they are worried about the use of Turkish UCAVs in Donbass and that the use of such weapons in Ukraine will harm the recovery environment.

A similar statement came from France after Russia expressed my dissatisfaction with the use of armed unmanned aerial vehicles (UCAV) produced by the Turkish company Baykar in Ukraine.

Spokesperson of the French Ministry of Foreign Affairs said that they are concerned about the use of Turkish UCAVs in the Donbass region in eastern Ukraine.

The spokesperson said that heavy weapons are being used in Ukraine and that this may harm the healing environment with the ceasefire.

The spokesperson also emphasized that such weapons are contrary to the ceasefire that came into force on 27 July 2020.

France now literally defending Russia against Ukraine. You know, ignoring that Ukraine bombed that Russian artillery position in response to separatists killing a Ukrainian soldier earlier. If Erdogan was actually a smart diplomat, he could use this to hammer France for being hypocrites and possibly even force NATO to sanction France to avoid looking like idiots but he has all the diplomatic finesse of steroid-abusing junkie with a sledgehammer.
 

Zafer

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France now literally defending Russia against Ukraine. You know, ignoring that Ukraine bombed that Russian artillery position in response to separatists killing a Ukrainian soldier earlier. If Erdogan was actually a smart diplomat, he could use this to hammer France for being hypocrites and possibly even force NATO to sanction France to avoid looking like idiots but he has all the diplomatic finesse of steroid-abusing junkie with a sledgehammer.
He does not deal with petty stuff. It is already obvious what France is doing, there is no point in pointing it out. Responses to actions come in unexpected times.
 

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France: We are concerned about the use of Turkish UCAVs in Ukraine​

Spokesperson of the French Ministry of Foreign Affairs said that they are worried about the use of Turkish UCAVs in Donbass and that the use of such weapons in Ukraine will harm the recovery environment.

A similar statement came from France after Russia expressed my dissatisfaction with the use of armed unmanned aerial vehicles (UCAV) produced by the Turkish company Baykar in Ukraine.

Spokesperson of the French Ministry of Foreign Affairs said that they are concerned about the use of Turkish UCAVs in the Donbass region in eastern Ukraine.

The spokesperson said that heavy weapons are being used in Ukraine and that this may harm the healing environment with the ceasefire.

The spokesperson also emphasized that such weapons are contrary to the ceasefire that came into force on 27 July 2020.

@GermanyDiplo condemns the Ukrainian drone strike on pro-Kremlin troops in eastern Ukraine, yesterday, claiming it would be a breach of the Minsk agreements.
Berlin and Moscow refer to the Minsk Memorandum from Sept 2014, banning "foreign drones" 30 km from the front.



It keeps getting better
 

Cypro

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@GermanyDiplo condemns the Ukrainian drone strike on pro-Kremlin troops in eastern Ukraine, yesterday, claiming it would be a breach of the Minsk agreements.
Berlin and Moscow refer to the Minsk Memorandum from Sept 2014, banning "foreign drones" 30 km from the front.



It keeps getting better
idiots and cowards.. they want status quo, no trouble and continuing to do trade with Russia while Ukraine suffers. Ukrainians will see their true friends. This is just how they acted about Karabag issue for 20 years
 

Glass🚬

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thats why no one should be surprised if the russians outright decide to annex the baltics and beyond with no repercussions

been predicting that for years now.
 

Huelague

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idiots and cowards.. they want status quo, no trouble and continuing to do trade with Russia while Ukraine suffers. Ukrainians will see their true friends. This is just how they acted about Karabag issue for 20 years
Exactly!
 

Lool

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If Erdogan was actually a smart diplomat, he could use this to hammer France for being hypocrites and possibly even force NATO to sanction France to avoid looking like idiots but he has all the diplomatic finesse of steroid-abusing junkie with a sledgehammer.
Wrong analysis dear Friend!
Lets make some things clear
First of all, no matter how much France is wrong, it will never get sanctioned... Period! The importance of France to the West is massive. France still literally controls the EU and still has forces worldwide; NATO wouldnt want to lose that for little Ukraine and above all France is one of the main advocates of the Western masterrace theory; it will never be sanctioned

Now, the fact that Erdogan is keeping silent is a great move. If it was me, i would just watch from the sidelines how Ukraine will gradually feels that its so called allies arent in fact trust-worthy allies but are just there for "human causes or whatever" and that the only allies for Ukraine is Turkey which supplied them with the drones they used in the recent operation; this will force Ukraine closer to Turkey which Turkey can use to impose its own terms for the relationship; thus, Turkey will be the sole winner in this game while keeping relations with Russia at an all-time high
 
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Anastasius

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The guy literally summarised the whole situation
Man Turkey really needs to give free access to Russia through the straights, lool
By this, Germany and France will start to actually piss themselves, lool
Germany and France won't care since the point is that they already work with Russia.

This is why I do not understand those who love to point out how the West is an unreliable ally and then say Turkey should align itself with the likes of Russia, who is an openly hostile entity.
 

Lool

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Germany and France won't care since the point is that they already work with Russia.

This is why I do not understand those who love to point out how the West is an unreliable ally and then say Turkey should align itself with the likes of Russia, who is an openly hostile entity.
Never said to openly kiss the russian leg
What I just said is to ensure that the West knows that at any given time, Turkey can ditch them
And why are you acting as if the West isnt openly hostile
At least the Russians, whether out of free will or with malice, is still providing Turkey with nuclear tech; something that the so called "not-openly hostile" entities refused to provide Turkey with
 

Anastasius

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Never said to openly kiss the russian leg
What I just said is to ensure that the West knows that at any given time, Turkey can ditch them
And why are you acting as if the West isnt openly hostile
At least the Russians, whether out of free will or with malice, is still providing Turkey with nuclear tech; something that the so called "not-openly hostile" entities refused to provide Turkey with
1) Turkey can't ditch them, that's the point. The West knows perfectly well that Turkey really, really doesn't want to have to rely fully on Russia and Turkish attempts to play this "or else" game have failed because NATO or the US specifically, doesn't care and knows Turkey is bluffing.

2) The West isn't in an open conflict with Turkey. Russia is. And unlike most Western states, Russia is Turkey's biggest geopolitical rival. Turkey can potentially smooth things over with nations like the US, Russia will always be a sore point.

3) Russia is helping Turkey to build a nuclear power plant. So is China. So is Japan. And France, believe it or not. Turkey received several bids from various companies to assist in this and there was little opposition from the West towards Turkey having nuclear power plants.
 

Lool

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1) Turkey can't ditch them, that's the point. The West knows perfectly well that Turkey really, really doesn't want to have to rely fully on Russia and Turkish attempts to play this "or else" game have failed because NATO or the US specifically, doesn't care and knows Turkey is bluffing.
Not really
If that is the case and Turkey is only "bluffing", it wouldnt have bought the S400s!
If that was the case then Erdo wouldnt have been able to use this "card" for God Damn 20 years already
And dont get me wrong, just the notion of Turkey and Russia having amicable ties is a nightmare to the EU by itself. The EU isnt stupid, they know how they treated the turks over time and they know that the turks are starting to not like them. Not only that, by they also knows that for the EU, the sole purpose of Turkey is acting as canoon fodder against the Russians (in case of an invasion) while EU citizens live in peace, sing, dance, and drink wine
Just imagine such canoon fodder acting amicably with Russia
And one more thing, just like how the West knows that Turkey really really doesnt want to depend on Russial they also know that Erdo doesnt wantto depend on the EU; something which they dont like at all
2) The West isn't in an open conflict with Turkey. Russia is. And unlike most Western states, Russia is Turkey's biggest geopolitical rival. Turkey can potentially smooth things over with nations like the US, Russia will always be a sore point.
Do you really think that it is tough for Russia to kick Turkey in the Ass in either Syria or libya? Do you really believe that a blitz of 40 Su-35s wont do the job? If so, then why is Russia trying to find a middle ground with Turkey? Because the russians know that them being friendly with the turks makes the West fqing uneasy and this makes the West more susceptible to mistakes
3) Russia is helping Turkey to build a nuclear power plant. So is China. So is Japan. And France, believe it or not. Turkey received several bids from various companies to assist in this and there was little opposition from the West towards Turkey having nuclear power plants.
Iam not talking about the nuclear power plant
Iam talking about the fact that Russia agreed to take in Turkish scientists into top Russian iniversities involved with Nuclear tech
Iam talking about the fact that Russia promised that they will involve as much Turkish scientists and engineers in operating the power plant as possible and even involve turkish contsruction companies to help build the plant so that they can gain the experience
I mean the Russians may have done just like the koreans did with the UAE, and just employ Korean scientists over there to operate the plant
Russia is giving a lot to Turkey in the long term which is something that Western nations dont like. That is why they are continuously asking for details about Turkey's nuclear program and Erdo is giving them the middle finger about it
 

Hexciter

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Armed drones in future wars: ADF needs asymmetric technology​

Australian industry is thinking about the anti-drone challenge, with companies such as EOS developing electronic countermeasures. Above, an anti-drone control centre. Source: EOS
Australian industry is thinking about the anti-drone challenge, with companies such as EOS developing electronic countermeasures. Above, an anti-drone control centre. Source: EOS

By Kym Bergmann; October 30, 2021

Eventually the technology in science-fiction movies becomes reality, and high-speed robot drones blasting away at individual humans is already happening in grey-zone and under-reported conflicts around the world.
While Australia remains preoccupied with a conflict involving China with massed conventional forces, events in Syria, Gaza, Ukraine and the Caucuses paint a different picture of what a future war might look like.
These hybrid conflicts involve a mixture of old technologies combined with an increasing use of small, relatively cheap aerial systems – including loitering munitions and hand-launched quadcopters – incorporating developments in image recognition software and artificial intelligence.
Greatest progress has been made in ground and air-ground combat, though uninhabited and robotic systems are also making great strides in the air-to-air and naval domains. Most of these developments still require a human in or on the loop – often for legal reasons – but the technology already exists to produce swarms of deadly, small, autonomous, self-configuring armed drones.
One graphic taste of a possible future for land conflict was the brief but intense war between Azerbaijan and Armenia over the disputed Nagorno-Karabakh region in late 2020. Being far from Australia and involving unpronounceable names, it received little coverage in the media, but defence planners sat up and took note. It was one of the most lopsided military conflicts in recent history, with Azerbaijan achieving a crushing victory by the application of new technologies, particularly drones equipped with stand-off missiles.
Christian Armenia and Muslim Azerbaijan have been at each other’s throats for a millennium, with neither gaining the ascendancy for long. In a myriad of previous conflicts they have fought themselves to a standstill with one side nominally finishing ahead, and then the other. Not this time.

Armenia fielded a large and heavily armed conventional force structured around hundreds of Russian Main Battle Tanks and heavy air defence systems – but this time Azerbaijan did something different. To their equally heavily armed classic military, they added loitering munitions from Israel and missile-carrying UAVs from Turkey.
As a consequence of arms embargoes on Turkey, that country has developed an impressive defence industry base, helped by input from a number of other nations, including periodically Israel.
This has led to the development of systems such as the Bayraktar TB2 drone, which can carry 150kg of smart munitions and stay aloft for more than 24 hours.
Turkey has successfully used them in small numbers against Kurds on home soil, in Syria and also in Libya.
Because of their size they are invisible to the naked eye when operating at a combat altitude of 20,000 feet and are similarly difficult to detect by radar and electro-optical systems, using a lot of carbon fibre in their construction.
Azerbaijan purchased a number – believed to be several dozen – in mid-2020 and started planning their immediate co-ordinated use against Armenian forces.
After first deploying Israeli loitering munitions to take out Armenian radar sites and missile batteries, the drones then started methodically targeting Armenian armoured vehicles, artillery, fortified positions and command and control nodes, picking them off at will. The brief tally is that in a few weeks they destroyed around 200 Armenian Main Battle Tanks with complete impunity – and gun camera footage showed enemy soldiers cowering in trenches having no idea where the rain of guided missiles was coming from while at the same time being powerless to protect themselves.
The result was that Armenia surrendered and handed Nagorno-Karabakh over to Azerbaijan, possibly ending the centuries-old dispute forever. There were a number of other factors, such as Azerbaijan using mercenaries from Syria to limit their own casualties, and more modern equipment overall – but almost all analysts agree that the critical game-changing elements were the cheap, numerous, semi-autonomous drones using target-recognition software.
If these had been deployed against the Australian Army the consequences might have been equally lopsided because the ADF has not yet made any significant investments in anti-drone systems and possesses no loitering munitions capability.

Current acquisitions such as the Boxer 8x8 and future IFVs have defensive capability against conventional threats with 30mm main guns and antitank guided missiles.
However these would have limited effectiveness against something like a high flying Bayraktar attacking from the near-vertical and even less against a quadcopter purchased from a hobby shop flying in low and fast with a 1kg shaped-charge warhead.
Australian industry is thinking about the anti-drone challenge, with companies such as EOS developing a laser and gun system and DroneShield with electronic countermeasures, but for the moment the army seems to be only politely curious about these products.
The RAAF is focused on air combat but needs to think urgently about defending bases, most of which are highly vulnerable. The RAN is investing in hugely expensive and very capable area air and missile defence systems but would be helpless against a swarm of tiny drones targeting every helicopter on the deck of an LHD.
While the conventional threat from China seems to be the main one, there are plenty of scenarios for future combat that are just as concerning, if not more so.
 

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