STM: Design phase of MilDen national submarine will be finished by 2023

[Cabatli_TR]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1311637381141983232

 

[Combat-Master]

 

[Anmdt]

 

[Oublious]

So Milden will be 3000 ton design, VLS and IDAS possiblilties...

 

[Zafer]

So Milden will be 3000 ton design, VLS and IDAS possiblilties...

If it will be 3000 tons then it will be 77.25 meters long and 7.2m wide if it will have similar aspect ratio to the Reis class..

 

[dBSPL]

One of the strategic goals of the Turkish Navy's 2033 projection is the expansion of the submarine fleet size. If you scan the media archives carefully, you can find many active and retired naval admirals who have explained or gave some hints on this issue since the last 6-8 years. Actually, the previous Commander of the Turkish Naval Forces gave important information to press about the MILDEN project schedule and also he mentioned the goal of increasing the active submarine fleet size to 18-20 ships, in 2015. Also, interval of 2028-2033 was mentioned in the same statements, for the first ship. In this direction, able to implement the MILDEN project's first launching right after the last REIS class AIP submarine (planned commissioning date for TCG SelmanReis is 2027), will create big positive factor for achieving the goal.

Our surface platforms are vital for the protection of our maritime jurisdiction areas and also our global/regional interests. However, the submarines are main striking power of the navy. By combining some these explainings end to end, we can also think about the Turkish naval doctrine from the end of 2030s to 2050s. Anyway...

We have sufficient experience in marine platforms systems engineering. As far as we understand from the explanations above, we also get qualified for design, verification and testing activities for advanced future attack submarines. There are exciting explanations. So, there are some developments in the necessary subsystems and advances in critical technologies that still do not leak into open sources.

 

[Cabatli_TR]

MİLDEN Submarines will have a length of around 75-80m, a beam of 7m, a draught of 6.5m, and a submerged displacement between 2,500-3,000 tons.

Unlike the REİS Class, MİLDEN Submarines will have at least one Reformer. Preferred for long-range missions, Reformer is preferred for large (over 2,000 tons) submarines. Both PEM Fuel Cell modules and Reformers to be used in MİLDEN submarines to be equipped with 300kW (400hp) AIP System will be designed and produced nationally, and the systems will also be developed domestically under the Submarine Propulsion System Components Development Project.

The PEM Fuel Cell modules, which will be manufactured locally by the company to be selected under the project, are intended to replace the BZM120 modules currently used in REİS Class Submarines in the following years. Unlike the Type 214 Class, which has two Siemens product BZM120 PEM Fuel Cell modules (each generates 120 kW power), Dolphin-II Submarines, as in Type 212A Submarines, have 9 (one backup, eight active) BZM34 PEM Fuel Cell modules that generate a total of 306 kW (400 hp) power.

Unlike the REİS Class, MİLDEN Class is expected to use locally produced Lithium-Ion (Li-Ion) batteries (LIB) with higher power and capacity instead of lead-acid batteries.

Unlike REİS Class submarines, which are currently under construction, and AY, PREVEZE, and GÜR Class submarines, which have a single compartment cigar-shaped hull form, MİLDEN class submarines will have a multi-compartment teardrop hull form.

The development activities of the GEZGİN National Cruise Missile are ongoing, and it is considered to be used for the first time on MİLDEN platforms. However, when the missile is ready, I expect it to be used in PREVEZE Class Submarines equipped with MÜREN CMS from the mid-2020s. ATMACA Block-II guided missile (submarine-launched Encapsulated ATMACA version) with both active RF and IIR seekers is expected to be used in both PREVEZE and REİS Class Submarines (CMS software modification is required).

Source: Ibrahim Sunnetçi

 

[Combat-Master]

Are we still expecting MILDEN to be this design, or the one STM has presented ?

 

[Bilal Khan(Quwa)]

Are we still expecting MILDEN to be this design, or the one STM has presented ?
View attachment 2637

If it's STM, it can't be the TS1700 (1,700-tons). It must be something else. I hope the Turkish Navy is asking for VLS -- would be an effective way to add land-attack without using up the torpedo bay capacity.

 

[Brave Janissary]

Are we still expecting MILDEN to be this design, or the one STM has presented ?
View attachment 2637

Naval Programs

Nice video introducing the FAC that we've shared.

defencehub.live

 

[Anmdt]

Are we still expecting MILDEN to be this design, or the one STM has presented ?
View attachment 2637

Milden is a project governed and owned by DzKK, STM can not present the conceptual design on their own, on their website freely -- at least not before than it is unveiled by DzKK.
Morelikely it will grow around this shape (given in below or image in your post, both are the same), DzKK was also considering UUV integration on MILDEN (presented in the image below).
The model was published in MILDEN workshop which took place in 2017 by participation of industry, design partners and universities and participants has presented their capabilities, or possible contributions to the project. The needs of the Navy was roughly mentioned, not in depth.
The conceptual design and proposal by industry partners will be ready by 2023, i personally expect this ship to be constructed after last ship of the Reis class. Exact plan is to have critical components built-designed locally. VLS integration wasn't considered as of now but we can be assured both Gezgin, Atmaca and other ones are being developed such that they can fit in a capsule in size of heavy torpedoes. IMO, it is flexibility to carry variety of torpedoes and launch as desired, can be reloaded for more while on the go, VLS can only be reloaded at dock while unnecessarily complicating the design.
There are no doubts the submarine will be capable of AIP, since it was particularly asked at the workshop.
DzKK has several other meetings with industrial partners and universities after the workshop in last year for evaluation of the project and resolving the needs.

 

[Zafer]

Whoever the owner of Milden project they have to make it ambitious and not lacking in anyway. Not allowed, no.

 

[Combat-Master]

Part 2

 

[Combat-Master]

part 3

 

[Cabatli_TR]

part 3

Milden is coming bro ! She will be one of the most strategic naval assets of TN when It is joined into inventory. A wide range of national missiles or torpedos will be fired from Milden and It will be more than enough to make some nations shake with fear when they are disappeared.

 

[bsruzm]

How do authorities perceive Idealab's propulsion system? Anybody knows any updates regarding Idealab's propulsion? If I am not mistaken, they attended MILDEN Workshop.

 

[Balamir]

part 3

It is very good that the design will be completed in 2023. If the construction work starts in 2023, we can see MİLDEN from 2030 in the inventory. Of course, some subsystems may not catch up. In this case, it can be supplied from foreign countries such as Germany.

 

[Brave Janissary]

My idea is we are planning 3/1 of the sub fleet is long range attack sub, and 3/2 of sub fleet type attack sub. If I 'm not wrong due fleet increase plan and east med we cant decomission any sub until 6x type-214 tn come and after that we build stm ts-1700 (Turkish version of itar free type-214) 6x sub behalf of 6 type 209 (4 1200 + 2 1400) and after that we build mildens in 2032 around behalf of 6 type 209 (1400) for a long range attack role.

So in the end we will have 6x type 214 + 6x ts-1700 and 6x Milden. For a rememberence , currently there are two diffrent aip class in west pact , one of them 2x120kw around aip module class subs (214, 212, dolphin, scorpene, s80 etc.) other ones long range aips ( shortfin barracuda, s-80 plus, type-216, dohsan canng ho, soryu etc.)

They say we can design the max 3000 tonnes sub. I think that is the key point. Just because milden 2017 concept is around 2400 tonnes but evrything changed in 5-10 years. Now we are want more. Looks like we increased to tonnage 3000 tonnes and big probaply 80 metered. İt can be have 15-20 000 km range on 10 knot like long range aip subs and 90 days submerged capability with help of idealab aip advantage. And also I'm wait a vls capability.

Actually we are seeek german doctrine and korean planning in submarine sector. Big probaply we will see dohsan cang ho like sub who have 3300 tonnes class and 83 metered.

 

[Cabatli_TR]

Most likely, MilDen will be shaped around existing concept revealed in 2017 but next generation features will be taken into consideration in active design phase.

 

[Brave Janissary]

Most likely, MilDen will be shaped on existing concept revealed in 2017 but next generation features will be taken into consideration in active design phase.

View attachment 5269

Bro that's just a sketc up , or like what we can do work.

Like first 3d works about Tf-2000;

But we are now see a tf-2000 very diffrent than him.

I dont think so this sub will be a little bigger than type-214. Just because Turkish Navy power projection and targets need a more powered sub.

İf we will make 3.-4. anadolu's and/or aircraft carrier (via Recep Tayyip Erdoğan) and 8x 166 metered Tf-2000 Heavy Destroyer/ Light Cruiser , A little better sub than type-214 or 6-8 kn aip speed sub doesnt enough for us.

So I'm waiting min 3000 max 4000 tonnes 80-90 metered min 2x 3.5mw or 1x7mw aip moduled min 10 kn with 19.000 km ranged and 3x6 vls carriable for cruise missiles or total 18-29 sub atmaca/gezgin/idas and torpedo capable submarine.

Like ;

Dosan Ahn Changho, Type-216, Shortfin Barracuda.