Live Conflict Israel-Palestine War|Regional Escalations

mehmed beg

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First you are a bosnian mate. So if you really think europeans think of you as one them them you are sadly mistaken.they will lynch you if you said that in some right wing dominater areas
That's not the matter of the opinion nor it is important what someone thinks. This is just THE FACT. To lynch me ? Well, we were the Cathars before Islam then Muslims. They are trying to lynch me for 1000 years, yet I am still here. Also it is pretty hard to lynch someone 2.01 meter tall and with my skills. So I will repeat it you. Don't try to worry about white people in regards to other white people. You aren't one. OK? That's our internal fight? No?
 

Chocopie

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I mean, sure IDF didn't video their engagements with Hamas militants.
But along with multiple eyewitness reported by credible Israeli news papers, we have compelling visual of aftermath of totally destroyed and half-destroyed homes.

And there is no way RPG or anything else that Hamas light infantry could've brought can cause that kind of damage. They clearly indicates heavy Israeli shelling. (Tanks, IFVs)
Not denying or debunking the reports or that it didn’t happen. Still I‘m not sure if there is 100% proof during this fog of war.
 

Spitfire9

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EvWri0oXMAIz2Hl
Nothing to support the assertion that US spent $200 billion on madrasas in the last 50 years. Listen, I don't get involved in discussions to win an argument for the sake of winning an argument. I find that valueless. If I cannot support a claim I make, I retract. Show me evidence and I may believe an assertion. It is not my job in a debate to disprove a claim made. It is the job of the claimant to prove the claim.
 

Ryder

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I mean, sure IDF didn't video their engagements with Hamas militants.
But along with multiple eyewitness reported by credible Israeli news papers, we have compelling visual of aftermath of totally destroyed and half-destroyed homes.

And there is no way RPG or anything else that Hamas light infantry could've brought can cause that kind of damage. They clearly indicates heavy Israeli shelling. (Tanks, IFVs)

Whats interesting is when Hamas breached the border wall.

They poured in but they also mentioned that bandits alongside criminal groups poured into Israel.

Something suspicious really. Was Hamas even allowed to attack or did Israel let its guard down or was it done on purpose?

At the end sad story is Palestinians are getting killed enmass.

Welcome to Greater Israel.

Just a matter of time before they reach Turkiye's borders start demanding that Turkish land belongs to them.

My ancestors even fought the Ottomans in the independance war to protect their homeland. The zionists can bring it.

They can go and gun down innocent Palestinians or bomb them to oblivion if they stir the wolves den they will see the Wolves jaws.
 

mehmed beg

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Killing 1.400+ Israelis (soldiers, women, elderly, children) isn‘t an „individual“ occurence, it‘s a pattern. Then taking 240 civilians as hostages is also an individual strategy?

Calling me biased but not recognizing your own partsianship is laughable at best. I don‘t claim objectivity, I‘m pro-Israel. But I’ll call a blatant lie by twitter propagandists what it is. Get used to it.
As o have said only 1 child was killed, according to Israel, ok?
Obviously, you aren't willing or not able to understand that Israeli government can be taken to the Hague, as we could have seen at least some of the prisoners were treated well , maybe some not so well , which tells me that those things aren't the policy of hamas but the decisions of some field commanders
In other words, you can't take Hamas to the Hague but the individuals. That's something pretty obvious. The genocide is the legal factor not open to your personal interpretation.
1400 you say, well Heretz listed about 960. Do you know, what they don't. By the way, official stance of Israeli government justify the future repercussions.
Just to I inform you, I took part in the similar ocvurances. So I know some rules. Those rules ain't open to the Internet opinions but to something more than that
 

Gary

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Nothing to support the assertion that US spent $200 billion on madrasas in the last 50 years. Listen, I don't get involved in discussions to win an argument for the sake of winning an argument. I find that valueless. If I cannot support a claim I make, I retract. Show me evidence and I may believe an assertion. It is not my job in a debate to disprove a claim made. It is the job of the claimant to prove the claim.
Well certainly the writer for some reason doesn't publish the exact amount of money in a form of receipt/cheque, but you get the idea.

>>The US funds "Salafi" seminaries, preachers.
>>which in turn were used to propagate Saudi state policy
>> By which btw this "policy" is almost all the time dictated by Washington. Including how Muslims should "react" to the situation in Palestine today
 

Chocopie

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As o have said only 1 child was killed, according to Israel, ok?
Obviously, you aren't willing or not able to understand that Israeli government can be taken to the Hague, as we could have seen at least some of the prisoners were treated well , maybe some not so well , which tells me that those things aren't the policy of hamas but the decisions of some field commanders
In other words, you can't take Hamas to the Hague but the individuals. That's something pretty obvious. The genocide is the legal factor not open to your personal interpretation.
1400 you say, well Heretz listed about 960. Do you know, what they don't. By the way, official stance of Israeli government justify the future repercussions.
Just to I inform you, I took part in the similar ocvurances. So I know some rules. Those rules ain't open to the Internet opinions but to something more than that
Please educate yourself. Israel like US, Russia and many other countries doesn‘t recognize the jurisdiction of the ICC/The Hague.

„Israel is not a member of the ICC and disputes its jurisdiction on the basis that Palestine is not a sovereign state capable of being a party to the Rome Statute…“

It‘s not like the aftermath of the ex-Yugoslavia Balkan Wars when the Hague punished Serbian war criminals like Milosevic, Mladic, Karadzic (Croatian and Bosnian as well).
 

mehmed beg

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Please educate yourself. Israel like US, Russia and many other countries doesn‘t recognize the jurisdiction of the ICC/The Hague.

„Israel is not a member of the ICC and disputes its jurisdiction on the basis that Palestine is not a sovereign state capable of being a party to the Rome Statute…“

It‘s not like the aftermath of the ex-Yugoslavia Balkan Wars when the Hague punished Serbian war criminals like Milosevic, Mladic, Karadzic (Croatian and Bosnian as well).
So I don't recognise Sothern Korea as independent nation, the law of my country says so , so I don't see the reason for your protests , that's if you want to protest.
Also , the Jews in ww2 weren't the state, then what's there to charge Germans?
So practically, you are saying that certain countries can't commit the crimes because, they don't see it as the crime yet when the alleged crime ( the same) is committed against them , then it is the crime???!!!
So which one is which here?
Are you out of your mind?
 

Gary

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This strategy would have worked better had Abdullah and his 400 million lookalikes started forming militias, and instead of wasting time by pouring into the street, they should have put their energy into making artillery rockets that could be fired from Jordan, Sinai, and Syria towards Israel all day and all night 24/7/365.

 

Ravager

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As o have said only 1 child was killed, according to Israel, ok?
Obviously, you aren't willing or not able to understand that Israeli government can be taken to the Hague, as we could have seen at least some of the prisoners were treated well , maybe some not so well , which tells me that those things aren't the policy of hamas but the decisions of some field commanders
In other words, you can't take Hamas to the Hague but the individuals. That's something pretty obvious. The genocide is the legal factor not open to your personal interpretation.
1400 you say, well Heretz listed about 960. Do you know, what they don't. By the way, official stance of Israeli government justify the future repercussions.
Just to I inform you, I took part in the similar ocvurances. So I know some rules. Those rules ain't open to the Internet opinions but to something more than that

Give it a rest bruh . Take a breather . It is as it is .. Some are just more hypocritical than others . As a moslem we held our self a higher standard then other . Trust me , things are changing . Soon things are going to unveiled by it self .
 

Chocopie

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So I don't recognise Sothern Korea as independent nation, the law of my country says so , so I don't see the reason for your protests , that's if you want to protest.
Also , the Jews in ww2 weren't the state, then what's there to charge Germans?
So practically, you are saying that certain countries can't commit the crimes because, they don't see it as the crime yet when the alleged crime ( the same) is committed against them , then it is the crime???!!!
So which one is which here?
Are you out of your mind?
I‘m only explaining you the reality of things. Without any hard power war crimes can‘t be punished by the ICC. German and Japanese war criminals were hanged after the allied forces fought a World War, won and punished the perpetrators.

Allied war crimes like the bombing of Dresden by „Bomber Harris“ or mass raping and massacres of the Soviet army weren‘t prosecuted. It is and was always the justice of the winners.

Stating those historic facts doesn‘t mean I condone the injustice.

PS: I don‘t give a damn how you see South Korea or me as a Korean. It has no meaning on this thread about the Hamas-Israeli conflict. And btw, Europe is a continent not a nation state. LMAO, you as European demanding to shut out posts of other nationals is pure clownery.
 

Spitfire9

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So I don't recognise Sothern Korea as independent nation, the law of my country says so , so I don't see the reason for your protests , that's if you want to protest.
Also , the Jews in ww2 weren't the state, then what's there to charge Germans?
So practically, you are saying that certain countries can't commit the crimes because, they don't see it as the crime yet when the alleged crime ( the same) is committed against them , then it is the crime???!!!
So which one is which here?
Are you out of your mind?
What is a war crime is defined by the UN. Possibly by the ICC as well. The International Criminal Court can try people accused of war crimes. Not all countries recognise the jurisdiction of the ICC, hence Putin cannot visit countries recognising the jurisdiction of the ICC (eg South Africa) since they have a duty to arrest him. He is accused of unlawful deportation of population (including kidnapping Ukrainian children). Soldiers accused of committing war crimes in Ukraine will not be tried by the ICC unless they are arrested in a country recognising the ICC.

UN definition of war crimes etc:
 
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Ryder

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ICC is a fcking joke.

Only people being on trial are African warlords.

Felicien Kabuga for decades was living in Paris most likely under the watchful eye of the French intelligence when his use by date passed the French quickly tossed him into the icc.

Putin pummeled the fck out of Chechnya, Syria and Georgia but the icc never issued an arrest warrant.

Give me a break. If people believe these useless organisations will be fair.
 

mehmed beg

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I‘m only explaining you the reality of things. Without any hard power war crimes can‘t be punished by the ICC. German and Japanese war criminals were hanged after the allied forces fought a World War, won and punished the perpetrators.

Allied war crimes like the bombing of Dresden by „Bomber Harris“ or mass raping and massacres of the Soviet army weren‘t prosecuted. It is and was always the justice of the winners.

Stating those historic facts doesn‘t mean I condone the injustice.

PS: I don‘t give a damn how you see South Korea or me as a Korean. It has no meaning on this thread about the Hamas-Israeli conflict. And btw, Europe is a continent not a nation state. LMAO, you as European demanding to shut out posts of other nationals is pure clownery.
By interpreting my post the way you like it and imagining the meaning is very good way to win debate. It works every single way.
To make example. When I said to an Indian that he as Indian shouldn't worry about the Europeans it was the answer on his protest why I am in Europe. Paradoxal? Yet , as he is islamipob why he doesn't say to the millions of his fellow Hindus to leave Islamic countries or as he isn't European or Americans , what gives him the right to tell me where I should live?
Even the Zionism is purely a racial and national concept and he doesn't belong to that , Zionism is not threat to him but it is a threat to the Europeans so what we have here?
Just the basic hate, I don't care if someone likes me or not but this type I can only spit on it. He , himself can't define himself, only his resentment can define him.
As of your opinion, basically what you have said in your previous post , is when Israeli commit the massacre, we should understand it as they don't recognise it as such but if for example a Palestinian is in my country and he is wanted for , let's say spreading Hamas propaganda then we should understand the Jews and extradite him?
Can a normal human being even contemplate such a thing? Regardless of the place or situation.
Basically, you are of the opinion that the Palestinians are runaway slaves or human animals? That opinion is on the lines of Natanyahu , he said so?
And that's according to the Jewish teaching. So , I have to respect the Jewish teaching but not mine, out of their wishes or beliefs? So ,I will take myself on the level of human animal or the slave also????
Are you normal? Can you understand what are you writing?
Also I gave your country as an example, I didn't say more then that, did I?
What's wrong with you? Or , you are like that Indian, questioning my decisions and opinions, from the none existent platform?
Oh , you are just observer ? You have the right to like or not to like someone, but when the hate comes from the purely personal feelings and resentment then sorry but you will get an answer
 

mehmed beg

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What is a war crime is defined by the UN. Possibly by the ICC as well. The International Criminal Court can try people accused of war crimes. Not all countries recognise the jurisdiction of the ICC, hence Putin cannot visit countries recognising the jurisdiction of the ICC (eg South Africa) since they have a duty to arrest him. He is accused of unlawful deportation of population (kidnapping Ukrainian children). Soldiers accused of committing war crimes in Ukraine will not be tried by the ICC unless they are arrested in a country recognising the ICC.

UN definition of war crimes etc:
I know that and what there are the whole range of things that Israeli government did that and not just them. Wether they recognise it or not then it is other matter but at least it would be fair then not to call Hamas deeds crimes then. In the reality, whatever happened, firstly it can be questioned and that's even according to Israeli statements, secondly at no point Hamas leadership made its policy nor it called for the extramination or wholesale ethnic cleansing. Israelis did that and there is no ambiguity about that.
 

Chocopie

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By interpreting my post the way you like it and imagining the meaning is very good way to win debate. It works every single way.
To make example. When I said to an Indian that he as Indian shouldn't worry about the Europeans it was the answer on his protest why I am in Europe. Paradoxal? Yet , as he is islamipob why he doesn't say to the millions of his fellow Hindus to leave Islamic countries or as he isn't European or Americans , what gives him the right to tell me where I should live?
Even the Zionism is purely a racial and national concept and he doesn't belong to that , Zionism is not threat to him but it is a threat to the Europeans so what we have here?
Just the basic hate, I don't care if someone likes me or not but this type I can only spit on it. He , himself can't define himself, only his resentment can define him.
As of your opinion, basically what you have said in your previous post , is when Israeli commit the massacre, we should understand it as they don't recognise it as such but if for example a Palestinian is in my country and he is wanted for , let's say spreading Hamas propaganda then we should understand the Jews and extradite him?
Can a normal human being even contemplate such a thing? Regardless of the place or situation.
Basically, you are of the opinion that the Palestinians are runaway slaves or human animals? That opinion is on the lines of Natanyahu , he said so?
And that's according to the Jewish teaching. So , I have to respect the Jewish teaching but not mine, out of their wishes or beliefs? So ,I will take myself on the level of human animal or the slave also????
Are you normal? Can you understand what are you writing?
Also I gave your country as an example, I didn't say more then that, did I?
What's wrong with you? Or , you are like that Indian, questioning my decisions and opinions, from the none existent platform?
Oh , you are just observer ? You have the right to like or not to like someone, but when the hate comes from the purely personal feelings and resentment then sorry but you will get an answer
You were questioning my right to post on this thread as a Korean. I have any right to post here my opinion regardless of my nationality, dude.

And please enhance your reading comprehension before making up bold accusations based on your deficient interpretation of my writings. And the rest of your diatribe isn‘t understandable to me. Dunno how you communicate properly in English while being a resident in UK, I understand only 65% of your scribblings.
 

mehmed beg

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You were questioning my right to post on this thread as a Korean. I have any right to post here my opinion regardless of my nationality, dude.

And please enhance your reading comprehension before making up bold accusations based on your deficient interpretation of my writings. And the rest of your diatribe isn‘t understandable to me. Dunno how you communicate properly in English while being a resident in UK, I understand only 65% of your scribblings.
You can interpret as you like. I have no plans to chase my own tail.
 

mehmed beg

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Give it a rest bruh . Take a breather . It is as it is .. Some are just more hypocritical than others . As a moslem we held our self a higher standard then other . Trust me , things are changing . Soon things are going to unveiled by it self .
No I won't give it a break. Someone wants to play so let's play.
I like Spitfire guy , I really do but , let's see some stuff here
A few days ago , he accused Turks of Armenian Genocide? No?
At the court of Mudros , all Turkish officers were aquited of such thing, mind you an Armenian was in the charge of the archives and had the full access.
Swedish, Danish and Dutch governments refused the offer of Republic of Turkey for the arbitration etc etc. By the way 1.5 Armenian victims were claimed yet in the census of 1901 or 02 , there were 1.1 million Armenians. The census was signed of by an Armenian. The Genocide is the legal matter, no,
So where is anything tangible on which basis Turkish Government can be accused of the Genocide and how it can be recognised? Killing 89k Muslims in Van is ok? Then New York Times a few days later, was bragging about that?
So the situation is pretty similar now?
Yet , I am supposed to say , Yes daddy? Bizzare.
Millions of Muslims were killed and it was documented, and i don't have any intentions to debate that fact , in usssr by the jew criminal gangs and that's OK. Yet , someone can come here and claim 1400 deaths and 40 babies and rave parties , though Israeli themselves denied that to the certain extent????!!!
I am in no habit that someone fools me like I am 18 years old boy. No Sir
 

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Weeks into the war, how much closer is Israel to its goal?​

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Israeli soldiers operate amid the ongoing ground invasion against Palestinian Islamist group Hamas in the northern Gaza Strip, on 8 November 2023
IMAGE SOURCE,REUTERS
By Jonathan Beale
Defence correspondent, BBC News

It's nearly two weeks since Israel launched its ground offensive into Gaza and more than a month since it began intensive air strikes against Hamas, all in response to the brutal attacks in Israel in which more than 1,400 people were killed.
Israel's stated military objective from the outset has been to destroy Hamas, militarily and politically. How much closer is it to achieving that goal, and is it achievable?

As far as Israel is concerned, these are still early days - it has repeatedly said that this operation will be long and difficult. One senior Israel Defense Forces (IDF) official who spoke to the BBC used the analogy of a boxing match: "This is just round four of 15."
No-one in Israel is saying exactly how long the war will last. Some point to the fact that it took nine months for Western-backed Iraqi forces to retake the city of Mosul from the Islamic State (IS)group in 2017. Israel may want to carry on fighting for several more months, though it may not control the timetable, as international pressure for pauses in the fighting or even a ceasefire are growing.

Military losses​

So far, Israel says it has carried out more than 14,000 strikes and killed dozens of high-value targets, including senior Hamas commanders. Each of those strikes will have involved multiple weapons. Yaakov Katz, a military expert and former editor of the Jerusalem Post newspaper, says Israel has already fired more than 23,000 munitions.

As a comparison, at the height of the battle for Mosul, Western allies dropped around 500 bombs a week on IS targets.

More than 10,800 people in Gaza have been killed since the start of the war, according to the Hamas-run health ministry, including more than 4,400 children.

The military says its ground forces have successfully divided the Gaza Strip between north and south, and that its troops have surrounded Gaza City. It claims they are now "deep in the heart of the city", though that is still far from claiming control. Hamas has denied that Israeli forces have made any significant gains or pushed deep into Gaza City.

This initial phase of Israel's ground offensive appears to be going according to plan with its aim of isolating Hamas, and the cost to Hamas is likely to have been high. Estimates at the start of the war suggested that the group had between 30,000-40,000 fighters.

One senior Israeli defence source told the BBC that about 10% of that total - 4,000 fighters - have been killed. Such estimates are impossible to verify and should be treated with caution, but the sheer scale of Israel's bombing campaign will have already degraded Hamas's ability to fight.
Maps of Gaza City and a timeline of how Israeli forces surrounded the city over four weeks

In contrast, Israeli military losses appear to have been relatively low. Israel says 34 of its soldiers have been killed since ground operations began. Yossi Kuperwasser, an Israeli intelligence and security expert, says the military is conducting its ground operations "more carefully and cautiously" to avoid heavy casualties among its troops.

It's still not clear how much of Hamas remains in the north, how many fighters may still be hiding in tunnels, or how many might have melted into the local population who have fled south.

The tunnels still present a significant challenge to Israel. Its forces are trying to blow up what tunnels it finds, rather than engage in fighting underground.

Urban warfare challenges​

More obvious is Israel's significant advantage in terms of intelligence and military capabilities. It can intercept communications and even turn off Gaza's mobile phone and internet networks. It has complete air superiority with Israeli jets and drones able to monitor every movement on the ground, but not below the surface.

One senior Israeli defence source told the BBC that they were still identifying more than 100 new targets each day, although that list is likely to diminish the longer this war goes on. The longer it lasts, the more it will have to rely on troops on the ground to identify and eliminate resistance.
A fireball erupts in the Gaza Strip on 9 November 2023
IMAGE SOURCE,GETTY IMAGES
Image caption,
The Gaza Strip has suffered an intense bombing campaign
Justin Crump, a former British Army officer who now runs Sibylline, a risk intelligence company, says Israel appears to be making reasonable progress given the density of the terrain, but "they're now going to encounter the more heavily defended urban areas of the city".

Israeli troops are better equipped and well-trained, but urban warfare can still prove difficult for the most advanced militaries.

So far, close-quarters fighting on the ground appears to have been limited, and is certainly nothing on the scale of the urban warfare that's been taking place between Russia and Ukraine in cities like Bakhmut. Much of the videos released by the IDF show that it is instead relying on tanks and armour.

Neither has Israel committed all its forces. Some estimate that it may have as few as 30,000 troops inside Gaza so far. That's a relatively small proportion of Israel's total - 160,000 active military personnel plus 360,000 reservists.

Justin Crump says the question is how many of its infantry is it willing to commit to clearing every building and the warren of Hamas tunnels?

Israel could instead chose to target Hamas strongholds. He believes Israel will try to avoid block-by-block fighting, not least because it could lead to very heavy casualties. It would also certainly jeopardise the lives of more than 200 hostages.

A post-invasion plan​

Which raises the question as to whether Israel's stated war aim - destroying Hamas - is really achievable. Even senior Israeli officials recognise that destroying an ideology with bombs and bullets is impossible.

Some of the group's leadership isn't even in Gaza. Mr Katz says that if elements of Hamas can survive this war, then they could still claim "because we're still here, we've actually won".

For that reason, Mr Crump believes Israel's war aims could shift from destroying Hamas to punishing it, to make sure it there is no repeat of the 7 October attacks.

Israel is also under increasing pressure to explain what happens next, especially from the US.

One Israeli defence source said Winston Churchill wasn't thinking about a Marshall plan to rebuild Germany, when he helped launched the allies invasion on D-Day in the Second World War.

But wars are rarely won without a plan post-invasion - something that's been completely absent in Israel's military operation so far.

 

Ravager

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No I won't give it a break. Someone wants to play so let's play.
I like Spitfire guy , I really do but , let's see some stuff here
A few days ago , he accused Turks of Armenian Genocide? No?
At the court of Mudros , all Turkish officers were aquited of such thing, mind you an Armenian was in the charge of the archives and had the full access.
Swedish, Danish and Dutch governments refused the offer of Republic of Turkey for the arbitration etc etc. By the way 1.5 Armenian victims were claimed yet in the census of 1901 or 02 , there were 1.1 million Armenians. The census was signed of by an Armenian. The Genocide is the legal matter, no,
So where is anything tangible on which basis Turkish Government can be accused of the Genocide and how it can be recognised? Killing 89k Muslims in Van is ok? Then New York Times a few days later, was bragging about that?
So the situation is pretty similar now?
Yet , I am supposed to say , Yes daddy? Bizzare.
Millions of Muslims were killed and it was documented, and i don't have any intentions to debate that fact , in usssr by the jew criminal gangs and that's OK. Yet , someone can come here and claim 1400 deaths and 40 babies and rave parties , though Israeli themselves denied that to the certain extent????!!!
I am in no habit that someone fools me like I am 18 years old boy. No Sir

Liked or not ... There is some truth in his wording . History write by the victors . Everything else were nothing but a beautified lullaby to ease the downtrodden and soon to be forgotten masses . Rule based order of do as i say never as i do ....

What they do not count is ...wheel of life always turning . All of these words gymnastics are nothing but a hypocritical sophistry and mentalistic copings .
Just take a note and framed in our conscience . When the time are ripes . We will throw it back all of these BS straight at their faces . Be patience ...
Everythings will fall in it's place ...eventually .



Btw , who were the one that said before that Ukraines were going to be bailed indefinitely ?? After some vacation my memory are not as good as it used to be... 🙏🙏
 

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