40 New Destroyers: How the Chinese Navy Keeps Growing

TR_123456

Experienced member
Staff member
Administrator
Messages
5,155
Reactions
12,874
Nation of residence
Nethelands
Nation of origin
Turkey
1602777900973.png


Their plan calls for doubling the amount of modern destroyers within five years.

China has taken another step toward doubling its fleet of destroyers from twenty up to forty within the next five years by adding two new Type 052 guided missile destroyers, bringing this year’s total up to four.



Within the span of just this year, the Chinese have also added two amphibious assault ships and now four destroyers to the fleet, sustaining an alarming shipbuilding pace which continues to catch the eye of the Pentagon.

The second newest destroyer, the Tangshan, is a Type 052 guided missile destroy reported to be the latest variant with a larger helicopter flight deck and larger “anti-stealth” radar, according to a report in the Chinese government-backed Global Times Newspaper.

In January of this year, the Chinese commissioned the Nanchang, a new, Zumwalt-like Type 055 stealthy destroyer.



What might all of this mean for China, beyond of course an increase in the ability to project power and wage war on the open seas? Most of this, it seems, would hinge upon the extent to which its sensors, weapons and networks were in any way comparable to U.S. destroyers.

Ultimately it is the technology that matters most. The merging of long-range sensors, precision-guided weapons, laser weapons and electronic warfare systems with a hardened, multi-domain network and integrated ship defenses will prove to be much more significant that sheer numbers of ships. Imagine if U.S. destroyers could have longer range weapons, more sensitive radar, better maneuvering cruise missiles and an ability to detect enemies from beyond the horizon before they are themselves seen. If the U.S. Navy could do that, then it seems they could achieve military overmatch with fewer numbers of actual ships.

China’s Navy is already larger in size than the U.S. Navy, a circumstance which continues to inspire the growing chorus of U.S. lawmakers and military leaders calling for a 500 ship Navy. The U.S. currently operates more than sixty-six Arleigh Burke class DDG 51 Destroyers and plans to add many more upgraded Flight III variants.

Navy Flight III Destroyers have a host of defining new technologies not included in current ships such as more on-board power to accommodate laser weapons, new engines, improved electronics, fast-upgradeable software and a much more powerful radar. The Flight III Destroyers will be able to see and destroy a much wider range of enemy targets at farther distances. For example, they will be armed with Maritime Tomahawk missiles: new variants of the famous cruise missile able to maneuver in flight and destroy moving targets at sea. Should the U.S. Navy operate weapons with this kind of capability, coupled with long-range, high-fidelity surveillance, it could destroy large numbers of Chinese destroyers from ranges as far as 900 nautical miles.

A new software and hardware enabled ship-based radar and fire control system, called Aegis Baseline 10, will drive a new technical ability for the ship to combine air-warfare and ballistic missile defense into a single system. For instance, the AN/SPY-6 radar, previously called Air and Missile Defense Radar, is engineered to simultaneously locate and discriminate multiple tracks.

 

xizhimen

Experienced member
Messages
7,391
Reactions
384
Nation of residence
China
Nation of origin
China
China is the world biggest ship builder and US is not even in top 5, with this solid industrial base, China easily outbuilds US.

China’s navy shipbuilders are ‘outbuilding everybody’​

 

Ryder

Experienced member
Messages
10,925
Reactions
7 18,876
Nation of residence
Australia
Nation of origin
Turkey
China is the world biggest ship builder and US is not even in top 5, with this solid industrial base, China easily outbuilds US.

China’s navy shipbuilders are ‘outbuilding everybody’​


Outbuild means nothing when the USA has the quality and the experience of a strong navy.

When it comes to aircraft carriers we all know the USA is much more superior.
 

xizhimen

Experienced member
Messages
7,391
Reactions
384
Nation of residence
China
Nation of origin
China
Outbuild means nothing when the USA has the quality and the experience of a strong navy.

When it comes to aircraft carriers we all know the USA is much more superior.
Yes, it still takes time, China does it one step a time, quantity and then quality. like China did for her economy and manufaturing.
 

Anmdt

Experienced member
Naval Specialist
Professional
Messages
5,535
Solutions
2
Reactions
119 25,121
Nation of residence
Turkey
Nation of origin
Turkey
China is the world biggest ship builder and US is not even in top 5, with this solid industrial base, China easily outbuilds US.

China’s navy shipbuilders are ‘outbuilding everybody’​

In military shipyards US is definitely in top 5 , or even at the top. It has been decades since they let go of heavy industries, and focused on niche products in their shipyards.
Even at some point they have closed marine engineering faculties, merged with mechanical engineering and in 2000s they have experienced shortage of engineers thus re-opened some.
 
Last edited:

xizhimen

Experienced member
Messages
7,391
Reactions
384
Nation of residence
China
Nation of origin
China
In military shipyards US is definitely in top 5 , or even at the top. It has been decades since they let go of heavy industries, and focused on niche products in their shipyards.
In military industry US still tops the world, but they let go of supporting industries and that makes them vulnerably dependent on foreign imports. China now makes and consumes over 60% of the world total steel and has a much more comprehensive industrial base than US, this makes China less dependent on supplies from others.
 

Madokafc

Experienced member
Think Tank Analyst
DefenceHub Diplomat
Messages
5,915
Reactions
4 10,056
Nation of residence
Indonesia
Nation of origin
Indonesia
66 active very heavily armed Arleigh Burke class , 22 Ticonderoga class, three Zummwalt class and in building 22 FREMM likes Frigates

Not to mention their Naval reserve units and inactive maintenance unit still hold more than dozen of ex Oliver Hazard Perry class and some Destroyer.
 

Madokafc

Experienced member
Think Tank Analyst
DefenceHub Diplomat
Messages
5,915
Reactions
4 10,056
Nation of residence
Indonesia
Nation of origin
Indonesia
In military industry US still tops the world, but they let go of supporting industries and that makes them vulnerably dependent on foreign imports. China now makes and consumes over 60% of the world total steel and has a much more comprehensive industrial base than US, this makes China less dependent on supplies from others.

Lol, not for Turbojet engines and turbin marine engines.
 

Anmdt

Experienced member
Naval Specialist
Professional
Messages
5,535
Solutions
2
Reactions
119 25,121
Nation of residence
Turkey
Nation of origin
Turkey
In military industry US still tops the world, but they let go of supporting industries and that makes them vulnerably dependent on foreign imports. China now makes and consumes over 60% of the world total steel and has a much more comprehensive industrial base than US, this makes China less dependent on supplies from others.
Their navy supports them so far, they make sure of making enough orders to keep it alive, at the same shipyards also again works on other niche products not only military vessels or submarines.
It is valid for steel as well, they don't care on common steel it is counted as heavy industries, they focus on critical alloys to supply their defense industry.
 

Gary

Experienced member
Messages
8,361
Reactions
22 12,853
Nation of residence
Indonesia
Nation of origin
Indonesia
66 active very heavily armed Arleigh Burke class , 22 Ticonderoga class, three Zummwalt class and in building 22 FREMM likes Frigates

Not to mention their Naval reserve units and inactive maintenance unit still hold more than dozen of ex Oliver Hazard Perry class and some Destroyer.
The Ticos are going to be retired
 

xizhimen

Experienced member
Messages
7,391
Reactions
384
Nation of residence
China
Nation of origin
China
China is the world's biggest shipbuilder, and its ability to rapidly produce new warships would be a 'huge advantage' in a long fight with the US, experts say

Sept. 9 2020
  • A new Department of Defense report on China's military power said that China "has the largest navy in the world" and is "the top ship-producing nation in the world by tonnage."
  • Experts said that "their shipbuilding capacity is a huge advantage for them in a protracted conflict with the United States," which lacks the same ability to quickly build new ships.
  • With the ability to turn out ships faster than any other country, China could build up its force or rapidly replace its naval losses in a conflict.

China has an edge over the US in shipbuilding, and it could give the country an advantage in a protracted conflict in which both sides see heavy losses at sea, experts told Insider.

"China has already achieved parity with — or even exceeded — the United States in several military modernization areas," the Pentagon reported recently, identifying shipbuilding as one area where China has an advantage.

"The [People's Republic of China] has the largest navy in the world, with an overall battle force of approximately 350 ships and submarines including over 130 major surface combatants," the Pentagon assessed in its latest China Military Power report.

The Pentagon also reported that "China is the top ship-producing nation in the world by tonnage," adding that the country is currently striving to increase "its shipbuilding capacity and capability for all naval classes."


And, as Andrew Erickson, a professor of strategy at the US Naval War College, noted in his analysis of the report, "quality is riding shotgun with quantity" as China builds new, more modern warships.

Among the surface combatants China is building are cruisers, destroyers, and corvettes, which the Department of Defense says "will significantly upgrade the PLAN's air defense, anti-ship, and antisubmarine capabilities."

China is also continuing to build support ships, amphibious warfare vessels, and aircraft carriers for expeditionary operations and power projection.

Modern warfare is complicated, with many different factors contributing to a conflict's outcome, but with the ability to produce ships faster than any other country, China could build up its force or rapidly replace its naval losses in a conflict, much as the US was able to do during World War II.


The US does not have that same shipbuilding capacity today, in part, because the US focuses on building more advanced assets at a handful of specialized shipyards, but also because the US is not that same industrial power.

Although the US Navy — with a battle force of 293 ships — is the most powerful navy in the world, military leaders have expressed concerns about America's decreased ability to rapidly build new ships.

Gen. David Berger, the commandant of the Marine Corps, assessed recently that "replacing ships lost in combat will be problematic, inasmuch as our industrial base has shrunk, while peer adversaries have expanded their shipbuilding capacity."

"In an extended conflict, the United States will be on the losing end of a production race—reversing the advantage we had in World War II when we last fought a peer competitor," Berger wrote in a draft report on operational concepts obtained by Breaking Defense.

'A huge advantage'
China's ability to quickly build ships stems from its efforts to build a modern navy. The US, on the other hand, has the advantage of already fielding a modern navy that deploys around the world.


"China can produce ships very fast. There is absolutely no doubt about that," Matthew Funaiole, a senior fellow with the China Power Project at the Center for Strategic and International Studies, told Insider, calling China's shipbuilding capacity"impressive."

But, he explained, "China is in the process of developing its first real, modern navy, so it has a lot of catching up to do, whereas the US already has a modern navy."

While the Chinese People's Liberation Army Navy has more vessels than the US Navy, it has not yet achieved parity. But the less advanced nature of its force and its shipbuilding capacity give it an edge, to a certain extent, in a protracted conflict.

In a conflict, the US Navy would have better pieces on the board, but it is unlikely to receive many new pieces during the course of the fight. The same is likely not true for China, meaning that a loss is felt potentially more heavily by the US.


"Their shipbuilding capacity is a huge advantage for them in a protracted conflict with the United States," Bryan Clark, a former US Navy officer and defense expert at the Hudson Institute, told Insider.

"They have multiple shipyards building every class of ship, which is not really the case in the US Navy," he said. "It gives them some extra capacity if they need to do a buildup or ramp-up of the navy or rebuild the navy in a conflict where they lose a lot of ships."

One large question mark when looking at China's naval ambitions is maintenance capacity, the ability to repair ships damaged in combat.

"Their maintenance capacity is not as significant as their shipbuilding capacity," Clark said. "Because their fleet is relatively new, they have not had to generate the kind of repair capacity that the US Navy has."


As China continues to expand the world's largest navy, how the country will maintain that expanded force is a problem it will have to address.

"There's so much cost to maintaining vessels," Funaiole said. "Building them is a big cost upfront, but keeping them battle ready, keeping them in good standing order, that costs a lot of money, and it becomes more expensive over time."

Erickson at the Naval War College, explained in his analysis that "China's maintenance capacity has not been tested in volume yet, but seems competent so far."

"Whether China can continue to implement its maintenance plan effectively when midlife ship deadlines trigger massive increases in capacity requirements over the next few years remains to be seen," he noted.


The US has long been a leading naval power, but the US Navy has its fair share of troubling maintenance issues. For example, a recent Government Accountability Office report said that between fiscal years 2015 and 2019, 75 percent of planned maintenance for the service's aircraft carriers and submarines was completed late.

The US and China "are more evenly matched when it comes to ship maintenance capacity," Clark said.

Of course, there is more to war than shipbuilding. When talking about a protracted conflict where both sides are taking losses, many other factors come into play that could make the shipbuilding capacity of each state less relevant.

"What kind of prolonged conflict in which the US is sustaining naval losses doesn't escalate into other types of conflict? What is the US response if it lost [an aircraft] carrier or something like that?" Funaiole asked.

"It is an unpleasant thing to think about," he said, "but I think we'd be getting into territory where US shipbuilding capacity is probably not the biggest concern at that point."

 

Madokafc

Experienced member
Think Tank Analyst
DefenceHub Diplomat
Messages
5,915
Reactions
4 10,056
Nation of residence
Indonesia
Nation of origin
Indonesia
The third and second largest Shipbuilder countries actually close US allies in which they had major military base there.
 

xizhimen

Experienced member
Messages
7,391
Reactions
384
Nation of residence
China
Nation of origin
China
2019 Surface vessel launch of navy by countries (Metric Tons)
vBoloXz.jpg



China Gross tonnage of ships launched 2019
Aa52moM.jpg
 

Nilgiri

Experienced member
Moderator
Aviation Specialist
Messages
9,814
Reactions
120 19,917
Nation of residence
Canada
Nation of origin
India
Outbuild means nothing when the USA has the quality and the experience of a strong navy.

When it comes to aircraft carriers we all know the USA is much more superior.

Lot of anonymous keyboard warriors don't even know the first thing about a perisher course for example.

They don't understand that men, institutions and experience dictate a huge deal past the hardware numbers and glossy brochures.
 

Ryder

Experienced member
Messages
10,925
Reactions
7 18,876
Nation of residence
Australia
Nation of origin
Turkey
Lot of anonymous keyboard warriors don't even know the first thing about a perisher course for example.

They don't understand that men, institutions and experience dictate a huge deal past the hardware numbers and glossy brochures.

Usa literally reached what it is today due to 50 to 70 years. China is just coming into this game new does not mean they will overtake the USA overnight.
 

Madokafc

Experienced member
Think Tank Analyst
DefenceHub Diplomat
Messages
5,915
Reactions
4 10,056
Nation of residence
Indonesia
Nation of origin
Indonesia
US close allies still churn out Destroyer, Frigates and Corvettes every year, and US itself still maintained core industrial engineering edge over their competitor and allies at significant margin. It just they don't focused and maintain at tier II industry doesn't means they can't build them. During WW II US can outpace the allies and Axis signicantly by building new production facilities at large scale in the shortest Times. With automation and large number of skilled and unskilled imigran willing to work and living in US anytime (including many from China itself), there is no problem for US to outpace China military industry output if necessary.
 

Follow us on social media

Top Bottom