TR Air-Force TF-X KAAN Fighter Jet

[Sanchez]

Wind tunnel miniature.

Looks like the vertical stabs moved to the sides?

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1982016931826905507

 

[Khagan1923]

Wind tunnel miniature.

Looks like the vertical stabs moved to the sides?

View attachment 77896

View attachment 77897

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1982016931826905507

Looks like it, if we just could finally get a glimpse of PT1. Hope we get some pictures in the coming weeks.

 

[Lool]

Wind tunnel miniature.

Looks like the vertical stabs moved to the sides?

View attachment 77896

View attachment 77897

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1982016931826905507

It seems that KAAN will become the Turkish F-22 raptor at this rate
Not bad at all

 

[begturan]

We are not going to have 40 Kaan by 2030, even in the best case scenario and trying to use Akıncı for a2a combat would be like trying to use bicycle to fight a tank. And Hürjet is trainer first, we don't even know if its light attack version will be ready by then; not that it would matter, it will always be inferior to proper fighters whether 4th gen or 5th.

A common statement from TAI executives and Defense Industry officials is that the first phase targets 20 KAAN (block 10) aircraft, often referred to as 2028 delivery.

This alone guarantees 20. The same sources also mention production ramp-ups ("2 aircraft per month in 2029" or a rapid increase between 2029 and 2030) and TAI's plans to transition to mass production; if this pace is maintained, an additional 20 aircraft (40 total) are possible between 2028 and 2030.

Furthermore, external orders (such as the Indonesian 48-unit agreement) could impact the production schedule. Therefore, 20–40 aircraft is a reasonable short-term range.

TAI exec claims 20 Turkish KAAN fighters to be delivered in 2028 - Breaking Defense

Temel Kotil, TAI's general manager, claimed that the domestically-produced Turkish jet will outperform the F-35 Joint Strike Fighter.

breakingdefense.com

We seem to be underestimating the Akıncı. After all, this aircraft can stay airborne 24 hours a day, can carry sufficient air-to-air munitions under its fuselage, and has an EW pod and AESA radar. The first aircraft to spot it on radar fires the first shot, and the first aircraft to fire usually shoots down the enemy aircraft.

As for the Hürjets, yes, they are planned as trainers, but in times of urgent need or when we want to sufficiently saturate the air force, we can convert them to a light attack version as a reserve force. Technically, the Hürjet is not much different from the T50.

As Iskander noted, even aircraft from World War II were called into service in the Ukrainia/Russia war. Saturation is a very important parameter in wartime. With proper planning, where air forces act in coordination, each aircraft becomes a force multiplier. The more technology is a deterrent, the more numbers are a deterrent.

 

[Zafer]

A common statement from TAI executives and Defense Industry officials is that the first phase targets 20 KAAN (block 10) aircraft, often referred to as 2028 delivery.

This alone guarantees 20. The same sources also mention production ramp-ups ("2 aircraft per month in 2029" or a rapid increase between 2029 and 2030) and TAI's plans to transition to mass production; if this pace is maintained, an additional 20 aircraft (40 total) are possible between 2028 and 2030.

Furthermore, external orders (such as the Indonesian 48-unit agreement) could impact the production schedule. Therefore, 20–40 aircraft is a reasonable short-term range.

TAI exec claims 20 Turkish KAAN fighters to be delivered in 2028 - Breaking Defense

Temel Kotil, TAI's general manager, claimed that the domestically-produced Turkish jet will outperform the F-35 Joint Strike Fighter.

breakingdefense.com

We seem to be underestimating the Akıncı. After all, this aircraft can stay airborne 24 hours a day, can carry sufficient air-to-air munitions under its fuselage, and has an EW pod and AESA radar. The first aircraft to spot it on radar fires the first shot, and the first aircraft to fire usually shoots down the enemy aircraft.

As for the Hürjets, yes, they are planned as trainers, but in times of urgent need or when we want to sufficiently saturate the air force, we can convert them to a light attack version as a reserve force. Technically, the Hürjet is not much different from the T50.

As Iskander noted, even aircraft from World War II were called into service in the Ukrainia/Russia war. Saturation is a very important parameter in wartime. With proper planning, where air forces act in coordination, each aircraft becomes a force multiplier. The more technology is a deterrent, the more numbers are a deterrent.

Isn't a Hürjet LCA already planned for 2027, yes it is. Based on this we even offered our Hürjet LCA to Malaysia against the T50 but we were still in development so we lost. If the Malaysians knew that we would progress so rapidly they would have probably chosen Hürjet instead. We had even started to acclimatize ourselves to the palm oil payment that was part of the tender requirements.

 

[Lool]

A common statement from TAI executives and Defense Industry officials is that the first phase targets 20 KAAN (block 10) aircraft, often referred to as 2028 delivery.

This alone guarantees 20. The same sources also mention production ramp-ups ("2 aircraft per month in 2029" or a rapid increase between 2029 and 2030) and TAI's plans to transition to mass production; if this pace is maintained, an additional 20 aircraft (40 total) are possible between 2028 and 2030.

Furthermore, external orders (such as the Indonesian 48-unit agreement) could impact the production schedule. Therefore, 20–40 aircraft is a reasonable short-term range.

TAI exec claims 20 Turkish KAAN fighters to be delivered in 2028 - Breaking Defense

Temel Kotil, TAI's general manager, claimed that the domestically-produced Turkish jet will outperform the F-35 Joint Strike Fighter.

breakingdefense.com

Bro, the most recent statements from TAI indicated that KAAN first serial production fighters wont be available except on 2032
Here is the most recent time schedule

🔺️2026- firing of the TEI-TF 10000 and second & third KAAN prototypes running on foreign engines
🔺️2027- fourth and fifth (possibly) KAAN prototype and firing of TEI-TF35000
🔺️2029- delivery of the first domestic TEI TF-35000 to be incorporated into KAAN for testing
🔺️2029 till 2032- testing of the domestic engines on KAAN
🔺️2032- if everything goes smoothly, first KAAN fighters with domestic engines to be supplied to the TAF

The US clearly refused to either give the Turks the rights for developing serial production engines for KAAN or even selling engines made in the US thx to greek and jewish lobbies

Last month, TAI officials clearly said that KAAN will only fly with a domestic engine and that only the prototypes will fly with foreign engines

Thus, I still cant understand how will 20 KAANs will be delivered on 2028, which is 3 years from now, when there is only one prototype available till date. Just look how long the KF-21 test took the koreans till date and yet it still hasnt entered serial production and this is while considering the fact that they have 4-5 prototypes already

 

[begturan]

Bro, the most recent statements from TAI indicated that KAAN first serial production fighters wont be available except on 2032
Here is the most recent time schedule

🔺️2026- firing of the TEI-TF 10000 and second & third KAAN prototypes running on foreign engines
🔺️2027- fourth and fifth (possibly) KAAN prototype and firing of TEI-TF35000
🔺️2029- delivery of the first domestic TEI TF-35000 to be incorporated into KAAN for testing
🔺️2029 till 2032- testing of the domestic engines on KAAN
🔺️2032- if everything goes smoothly, first KAAN fighters with domestic engines to be supplied to the TAF

The US clearly refused to either give the Turks the rights for developing serial production engines for KAAN or even selling engines made in the US thx to greek and jewish lobbies

Last month, TAI officials clearly said that KAAN will only fly with a domestic engine and that only the prototypes will fly with foreign engines

I missed that part, thanks for the info. I was thinking that once the F404 engines were approved, the F110 engines would probably be sold as well. So, the project has been rescheduled without the F110 engines. Everything depends on the success of the TF35000, then.

 

[Zafer]

I missed that part, thanks for the info. I was thinking that once the F404 engines were approved, the F110 engines would probably be sold as well. So, the project has been rescheduled without the F110 engines. Everything depends on the success of the TF35000, then.

F110 engines won't make Kaan a top stealth fighter so they will probably be sold.

 

[Brokengineer]

EF deal reduced some pressure on the KAAN project in terms of f110 engine acquisition. KAAN's frames will be tested on f110 engines currently available, then there will ve tf35000 switch for serial production hopefully. TF35000 is massive milestone in both Turkish Defense and Engine development history. So it will be better a little late than never.

 

[Radko]

EF deal reduced some pressure on the KAAN project in terms of f110 engine acquisition. KAAN's frames will be tested on f110 engines currently available, then there will ve tf35000 switch for serial production hopefully. TF35000 is massive milestone in both Turkish Defense and Engine development history. So it will be better a little late than never.

How does it reduce the pressure? Kaan and EF are not at the same level of capability. Urgency of Kaan remains the same as before

 

[Ripley]

How does it reduce the pressure? Kaan and EF are not at the same level of capability. Urgency of Kaan remains the same as before

Urgency of Kaan is obviously unquestionable but also there’s a bit of truth in what he says. Acquisition of EFs will provide some room to TurAF to breathe in by gaining some capabilities which it lacks and lagging behind other air forces in the region.
This in return will remove some pressure off the TurAF but Kaan is and will always stay the priority of Turkish defense industry.

 

[Angry Turk !!!]

Urgency of Kaan is obviously unquestionable but also there’s a bit of truth in what he says. Acquisition of EFs will provide some room to TurAF to breathe in by gaining some capabilities which it lacks and lagging behind other air forces in the region.
This in return will remove some pressure off the TurAF but Kaan is and will always stay the priority of Turkish defense industry.

T4 EFs + Meteors is a solid stopgap and I'm happy with it.

I don't care about the price because having those planes is more important right now. But from now on, everything should be invested into KAAN and other major projects, full force.

 

[mehmed beg]

I think that it will take at least 2 to 3 years to train the pilots and develop the tactics in order to fully tap in potential of KAAN. Also, at least a squadron to squadron and half is necessary. All of that plus still testing of the various things at the same time.
I don't think that Turkiye has had any other options but to buy EFs, it is just too expensive. I don't know whether will be any money left for the air tankers though.

 

[Zafer]

Typhoon can fill some gap in the Air Force's capabilities but it will not take any pressure off of the Kaan development.

 

[mehmed beg]

I forgot to add , by let's say 2030 , how many flying hours will be left in many F 16 frames and the engines? So EFs will take a lot of pressure from KAAN frames and will take the function of F4s. So I think that the option for extra 20 frames will be excised , I just hope that EFs will have TVC and upgraded engines at that time. Those things would make EFs the ultimate generation 4++ planes. That is all good, apart from the price

 

[cr33pt3d]

Secretly hoping the EF deal includes some assistance from RR for the TF35K engine. would keep the timeline for Kaan live.

 

[TheInsider]

Eurofighter is not just an interim solution, as many suggested. It will replace F-4s. F-35s were supposed to replace F-4s and form a high-low mix with Kaan; now Eurofighters will do that. The second-hand part of the Eurofighter deal is an interim solution.

By the mid 2030s, Kaan will be an elite air superiority fighter. Using them as bomb trucks with external weapon stations is extremely expensive; F-16s will be there to maintain numerical superiority and can be deployed against technologically inferior enemies as a cost-effective solution. Eurofighters will be twin engine bomb/missile trucks and interceptors (similar to F-15ex) so Eurofighter deal is more than a simple stop gap solution. Airforce wants to have 3 squadrons of Eurofighters eventually.

 

[IC3M@N FX]

I have been considering various scenarios over the last few days. Turkey will receive 44 Eurofighters – around 24 of them from Qatar and Oman between 2026 and 2027/28, and the remaining 20 new Eurofighters from 2030 onwards.

There are currently 12 new F-110 engines available for six TAI KAAN prototypes. I think it is very likely that the US will continue to block larger deliveries of F-110 engines due to the geopolitical situation and, above all, because of Greece, Israel, etc. With a bit of luck, it may be possible to secure engines for four to six more aircraft – but probably not many more than that.

A conceivable interim solution would be to cannibalise part of the older F-16 fleet (Block 30/40). TEI could overhaul these old engines and replace worn parts, then use them temporarily in the TAI KAAN. This would allow the engines to be used in the aircraft for four to five years, until the TF-35000 engines are ready for series production in around 2033/34.

This would allow around 30 TAI KAANs (6 from the prototype batch + 24 TAI KAANs with overhauled F-16 engines from 48 older F-16s, which would be cannibalised) to be produced by 2030. Together with 44 Eurofighters and around +-200 modernised F-16 Özgür IIs, Turkey's air combat capability would be relatively solidly secured until 2032, as drones of various classes would be added as multipliers – this would significantly narrow the gap with Greece and Israel.
If more Eurofighters are added by 2032, more older F-16s could be cannibalised and more TAI KAANs built with general overhauled F-110 engines.
From 2033/34 onwards, only TAI KAAN with TF-35000 engines will be used, and the existing TAI KAAN fleet will be completely converted to TF-35000 as soon as the F-110 engines reach the end of their service life.
I would use more than half of the 48 cannibalised aircraft as spare parts donors for the existing F-16 fleet, and I would conduct a study on the remaining 10 aircraft to see if the TF-35000 could be integrated into the F-16 to provide the F-16 fleet with a possible Özgür III upgrade, with TEI TF 35000 (throttled down to 30,000 lbf).

 

[Yasar_TR]

I have been considering various scenarios over the last few days. Turkey will receive 44 Eurofighters – around 24 of them from Qatar and Oman between 2026 and 2027/28, and the remaining 20 new Eurofighters from 2030 onwards.

There are currently 12 new F-110 engines available for six TAI KAAN prototypes. I think it is very likely that the US will continue to block larger deliveries of F-110 engines due to the geopolitical situation and, above all, because of Greece, Israel, etc. With a bit of luck, it may be possible to secure engines for four to six more aircraft – but probably not many more than that.

A conceivable interim solution would be to cannibalise part of the older F-16 fleet (Block 30/40). TEI could overhaul these old engines and replace worn parts, then use them temporarily in the TAI KAAN. This would allow the engines to be used in the aircraft for four to five years, until the TF-35000 engines are ready for series production in around 2033/34.

This would allow around 30 TAI KAANs (6 from the prototype batch + 24 TAI KAANs with overhauled F-16 engines from 48 older F-16s, which would be cannibalised) to be produced by 2030. Together with 44 Eurofighters and around +-200 modernised F-16 Özgür IIs, Turkey's air combat capability would be relatively solidly secured until 2032, as drones of various classes would be added as multipliers – this would significantly narrow the gap with Greece and Israel.
If more Eurofighters are added by 2032, more older F-16s could be cannibalised and more TAI KAANs built with general overhauled F-110 engines.
From 2033/34 onwards, only TAI KAAN with TF-35000 engines will be used, and the existing TAI KAAN fleet will be completely converted to TF-35000 as soon as the F-110 engines reach the end of their service life.
I would use more than half of the 48 cannibalised aircraft as spare parts donors for the existing F-16 fleet, and I would conduct a study on the remaining 10 aircraft to see if the TF-35000 could be integrated into the F-16 to provide the F-16 fleet with a possible Özgür III upgrade, with TEI TF 35000 (throttled down to 30,000 lbf).

All your hypotheses are based on cannibalising F110 engines of F16 fighters.

Our F16s are single engine planes and use F110GE129C engine.
KAAN uses a pair of twin engine certified F110GE129E engines.

It is not just the FADEC program that is different; but the engine mounting interface is different than a single engine version. Different bearing support structures may have to be used to compensate for different flow patterns that may be created by twin engine layout. These engines will have to be “certified for twin engine use”.

Air intake harmonisation is different too. This refers to “the engineering and control processes that ensure each engine in a multi-engine aircraft receives a consistent, smooth, and optimal flow of air, regardless of the aircraft's speed, altitude, or flight manoeuvres. This is particularly critical for high-performance and supersonic aircraft.”

Then there is the legality issue. These planes are still owned by US. You can’t take their engines to use them on another aircraft without their consent.

In short :

You can’t just take an engine from 2 F16s and fit them on KAAN.