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TR UAV/UCAV Programs | Anka - series | Kızılelma | TB - series

Mis_TR_Like

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Anka-2 aka Aksungur is being upgraded. According to Demiroglu’s last statements the new version will have a 1250 kg payload and 60 hours flight endurance.

I wish they also made it clear how high these platforms would be able to fly at, with 1250kg payload and 60 hours flight endurance.

An empty plane or one with minimum payload, can stay in air for 60 hours if it is under 20000ft altitude. But can it do that with 1250kg load and at 40000ft altitude?

Do we have a solution to 358s and the array of other missiles/munitions that have been plucking MALE UAVs out of the sky?

Yes sure, the whole point of MALE UAVs is their cheap and expendable, but rag tag terror groups now have the capability to counter them.

I know there's been some electronic countermeasures. I think larger UAVs like Aksungur should be fitted with a turret that launches ATOM. This all depends on price and weight, but these heavier drones need more protection, TB2s could probably do with softkill only.

The countermeasure turret also opens up a new avenue for the concept of an offensive turret for CAS.
 

boredaf

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Do we have a solution to 358s and the array of other missiles/munitions that have been plucking MALE UAVs out of the sky?
Yes, range. Mam-L or other short range munitions shouldn't be used, at all, unless we are absolutely sure there are no anti-air of any kind. Use Eren, Tolun, UAV-230 or Roketsan's new mini cruise missile and keep the drone itself in safe airspace.

I think larger UAVs like Aksungur should be fitted with a turret that launches ATOM.
You can't just slap on a turret, you need sensors for detection of the incoming missile/drone, a targeting solution that can track it and then a turret that is omnidirectional so that it can actually shoot at the necessary direction. On top of all that, you need the extra energy generation for everything you put on the drone. Basically eating into what little payload capacity they have.
 

Mis_TR_Like

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Yes, range. Mam-L or other short range munitions shouldn't be used, at all, unless we are absolutely sure there are no anti-air of any kind. Use Eren, Tolun, UAV-230 or Roketsan's new mini cruise missile and keep the drone itself in safe airspace.
The problem with that is launchers for 358 are small and can be hidden in caves and small buildings. We're not talking about truck mounted systems anymore. If rag tag militias can down dozens of drones an actual military would have tons more distributed across their forces. Standoff weapons are great, but you can't fight a whole war with them. What made the Azerbaijan-Armenia war so one sided was not only the strategy and tactics that Azerbaijan used, but also the fact that they had their drones flying over the Armenian military 24/7, picking apart their forces with MAM-Ls with impunity. That combined with the ground assault was simply unstoppable. If you're relying on standoff weapons then not only is that more costly, but more importantly, you're enemies have the luxury to regroup and resupply, you don't have true control of the skies over their heads.

You can't just slap on a turret, you need sensors for detection of the incoming missile/drone, a targeting solution that can track it and then a turret that is omnidirectional so that it can actually shoot at the necessary direction. On top of all that, you need the extra energy generation for everything you put on the drone. Basically eating into what little payload capacity they have.
Valid points. DIRCM systems would be similarly difficult to add to MALE UAVs.

Perhaps SPPOD is all that's needed, but not too sure how good flares would be against modern IR missiles/munitions.
 

Şok Tedavisi

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The one thing TSK is lacking is stealth platforms in the inventory.

Anka 3 and Kızılelma are almost ready, I think it would be best if both companies focus on these products and introduce inventory ready variants as soon as possible.

Baykar should double down on air to air and TUSAŞ should double down on air to ground and both should produce a few dozen of each. Of course there are probably hurdles still, but this is a priority.

We haven't heard much about Anka 3s air to air capabilities, but Kızılelma technically could be a very real threat to even F35s. A tailless drone with air to air capability will completely change the dynamics of the region, but one step at a time.
KE is not getting close anywhere to shooting down F35, It's not even stealth and without good engine supply they are not going to mass produce it.
 

Yasar_TR

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KE is not getting close anywhere to shooting down F35, It's not even stealth and without good engine supply they are not going to mass produce it.
Bro, as it is, KE probably is as stealthy as the Kaan today.
Without RAM paint application and non stealthy engines, both can not be put against any fully fledged stealthy plane like F35.

But that doesn’t mean that they will be like that all the time. KE is designed as a low observable plane. It has IWBs to allow it to stay LO when not in delivery mode.
Yes the engine it has at the moment probably lets it down big time both from low observability point and from power delivery point. But with a TF10000 power plant, it should come back to its own and be competent enough for most battle situations.

So! Come on TEI ! Get your finger out and provide the KE and Anka-3 with the necessary engines that will make them show what they are meant to do..
 
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Şok Tedavisi

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Bro, as it is, KE is probably is as stealthy as the Kaan today.
Without RAM paint application and non stealthy engines, both can not be put against any fully fledged stealthy plane like F35.

But that doesn’t mean that they will be like that all the time. KE is designed as a low observable plane. It has IWBs to allow it to stay LO when not in delivery mode.
Yes the engine it has at the moment probably lets it down big time both from low observability point and from power delivery point. But with a TF10000 power plant, it should come back to its own and be competent enough for most battle situations.

So! Come on TEI ! Get your finger out and provide the KE and Anka-3 with the necessary engines that will make them show what they are meant to do.
Still there is no way KE is going to win a BVR engagement against F35, maybe against 4th gen fighters but there is no way, If that was the case we could put aesa radar onto everything and they would go "taraya taraya".

I have my hopes high for the Anka 3 mark my word It will be more succesful than KE, I believe in Tusas quality.
 

dBSPL

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Sadly both payloads seem to surpass the limits, especially for the hunter which requires a long endurance.

Typically for work-ability we should divide them in three: Carrier platform (sonobuoys), A relay + ESM Node, A SAR platform and lastly the killer platform. The killer should also be agile and flow low&slow near the surface (which suits the TB3 but may as well require additional sensors) to launch the torpedo. Honestly too much of distribution that yields to inefficiency and elevated number of deck operations, which takes us to a new platform. We need a ship based drone with higher payload. Also note that, a few sonobuoys are not sufficient. There should be at least a few dozens laid on the field.

Moreover in doctrinal approach a LHD or AC shouldn't be occupied with ASW operations, it is the logic dictating it. It could support the destroyers, frigates in ASW operations nonetheless and be a relay node for MIMO integration of sonobuoys with ASW equipped ships.

Also, This the higher payload-land based TB3 version which Navy intends to couple with manned MPAs as forward nodes in laying sonobuoys, relaying the sonobuoy comms and SAR scanning within the hot zones.
Yes, when I did a more careful calculation, I noticed a discrepancy. 280 kg is the TB3's total payload capacity, not what's left after the EO camera, sonobuoy pods, MAD, and SAR are already loaded. Once you add those up (roughly 250-260 kg by my own numbers), there is realistically 20-30 kg left, not enough for a proper ESM suite plus AIS receiver. So yes, the Hunter config as I wrote it does not fit inside a single TB3, full stop. That is a math error on my part.

Given that, the three-way (or four-way) split you propose is basically correct, and I do not think it undermines the concept, it corrects it. Where I would push back is on the conclusion that this distribution automatically means the concept is inefficient enough to require a new, higher-payload ship-based platform. TB3 is already deck-qualified, already in the inventory, and already cheap relative to a clean-sheet naval UCAV program. A wing of four TB3s, each carrying one dedicated fit (sonobuoy layer, ESM/relay node, SAR, killer with ORKA), costs less airframe-development risk than waiting for a bigger platform, even if it means more deck cycles. The deck-ops penalty is real, but it is a tempo problem, not a feasibility problem, and TCG Anadolu's flight deck was sized with multiple simultaneous TB3 operations in mind from the start. Or, more accurately, TB3 itself was developed specifically around TCG Anadolu's operating constraints.

On sonobuoy count, agreed without reservation. Two 4-cell pods on one airframe was never meant to represent a complete field. The realistic employment model is cumulative: TB3's endurance lets it lay a partial pattern, return, rearm, and go back out, or hand off to a second airframe already airborne, building the field over several sorties rather than one. A few dozen buoys on station is the right order of magnitude, and that number only comes from stacking sorties, not from a single aircraft's pod count.

On doctrine, I think we actually agree more than the disagreement suggests. I was not arguing that TCG Anadolu should own an organic ASW kill chain, and if my post read that way, that is on the phrasing. The role I see for a TB3 ASW wing is closer to what you are describing: a forward sensor and relay layer, laying and monitoring a distributed sonobuoy field, feeding that picture back via MIMO-style integration to ASW-equipped frigates and destroyers, who retain the weapon-release decision. The ORKA-armed "killer" variant is the one part of this that does put a kill capability on the UCAV itself, and that is worth separating out as a distinct, more contentious piece of the concept rather than folding it into the sensor/relay argument. A carrier air wing doing search, classification, and cueing is a very different claim from a carrier air wing doing prosecution.

The land-based, higher-payload TB3 variant you mention is worth pulling into this too. If that version is meant to work alongside manned MPAs as forward nodes for buoy-laying, relay, and SAR in contested zones, it suggests Baykar and the Navy are already thinking in the distributed-node direction rather than a single do-everything airframe, which lines up with the correction above better than my original post did.

What I was really trying to show with the original post, math error aside, is that TB3 has genuine potential to play a highly effective role in the underwater tactical picture of the TCG Anadolu task group, not as a standalone ASW kill chain, but as the forward sensing and relay layer that makes the surface combatants' ASW picture sharper and faster than it would be without it. That is the part of the argument I still stand behind.
 

Yasar_TR

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It is interesting that Baykar, on their KE site clearly state :

TAKING OFF AND LANDING ON SHORT-RUNWAY VESSELS
Bayraktar KIZILELMA’s capability to operate on short-runway ships, such as Türkiye’s TCG Anadolu, provides a strategic advantage in overseas missions and in the defense of the Blue Homeland.


Yet to date they have not openly tested any of these capabilities of KE neither on TCG Anadolu nor on land. However they keep placing KE on TCG Anadolu in defence fairs, like in the latest teknofest 2026.

1787413287113.jpeg




If they can pull a rabbit out of a hat like they did with TB3, it would be invaluable to the assault and defence capability of the TCG Anadolu.

All I can say right now is : put your money where your mouth is and show it to us that KE can take off and land on TCG Anadolu.
instead of advertising it wrongly on this amphibious assault platform.

In his defence, though, Mr Bayraktar had earlier said that TCG Anadolu needed cable arrester to land a plane like KE.
It may also need a very powerful engine like tf10000 to take off.
 

dBSPL

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It is interesting that Baykar, on their KE site clearly state :

TAKING OFF AND LANDING ON SHORT-RUNWAY VESSELS
Bayraktar KIZILELMA’s capability to operate on short-runway ships, such as Türkiye’s TCG Anadolu, provides a strategic advantage in overseas missions and in the defense of the Blue Homeland.


Yet to date they have not openly tested any of these capabilities of KE neither on TCG Anadolu nor on land. However they keep placing KE on TCG Anadolu in defence fairs, like in the latest teknofest 2026.

View attachment 82509



If they can pull a rabbit out of a hat like they did with TB3, it would be invaluable to the assault and defence capability of the TCG Anadolu.

All I can say right now is : put your money where your mouth is and show it to us that KE can take off and land on TCG Anadolu.
instead of advertising it wrongly on this amphibious assault platform.

In his defence, though, Mr Bayraktar had earlier said that TCG Anadolu needed cable arrester to land a plane like KE.
It may also need a very powerful engine like tf10000 to take off.
Selçuk Bayraktar explained the situation as follows: "It's possible for KIZILELMA to take off from TCG ANADOLU. Its landing gear allows for landing, but a modification – the addition of cable system – is needed on the ship. Currently, Bayraktar TB3s are landing/taking off from this ship. Our Navy is currently building a slightly larger ship. That ship will have cables. Our Navy has planned accordingly and preferred this. KIZILELMA will land/take off from that ship."

Without getting into how a multi-ton aircraft with an average approach speed of 130-140 knots will be stopped on the LHD runway, or what sortie effectiveness it might have, the reason Baykar insists on this capability on its website might be because, unlike the Turkiye, the Italians have the potential to test it?

But as far as I know, we won't see a variant with a full naval configuration, including the tailhook, before Kızılelma-D, right?
 

Anmdt

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It is interesting that Baykar, on their KE site clearly state :

TAKING OFF AND LANDING ON SHORT-RUNWAY VESSELS
Bayraktar KIZILELMA’s capability to operate on short-runway ships, such as Türkiye’s TCG Anadolu, provides a strategic advantage in overseas missions and in the defense of the Blue Homeland.


Yet to date they have not openly tested any of these capabilities of KE neither on TCG Anadolu nor on land. However they keep placing KE on TCG Anadolu in defence fairs, like in the latest teknofest 2026.

View attachment 82509



If they can pull a rabbit out of a hat like they did with TB3, it would be invaluable to the assault and defence capability of the TCG Anadolu.

All I can say right now is : put your money where your mouth is and show it to us that KE can take off and land on TCG Anadolu.
instead of advertising it wrongly on this amphibious assault platform.

In his defence, though, Mr Bayraktar had earlier said that TCG Anadolu needed cable arrester to land a plane like KE.
It may also need a very powerful engine like tf10000 to take off.
TCG anadolu requires extensive modifications to let KE land and take off with a decent, or acceptable payload / fuel.
The extend of the modification isn't simple as adding arrest wires as Selcuk has stated, it requires extension of the flight deck, moving rear elevator to the side and extending the width of flight deck, effectively remaking the whole ship - which we don't have sufficient know how go force through.
 

Fatman17

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On 2 September 2026, two LGK-84 kits, one LGK-82 and one GÖZDE weapon achieved four reported direct hits at Konya Karapınar, including an engagement against a target moving approximately 50 kilometres per hour.

Military officials from more than 15 countries observed the event, transforming each impact from a technical result into strategic signalling aimed at governments evaluating affordable precision-strike capacity, fleet interoperability and sovereign munitions access.
 

Fuzuli NL

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Bayraktar AKINCI struck an aerial target with its SUNGUR missile.​

The Bayraktar AKINCI Attack Unmanned Aerial Vehicle (UAV) successfully hit a high-speed target UAV with pinpoint accuracy during a firing test conducted with the SUNGUR Air Defense Missile.
Firdevs Bulut Kartal
September 16, 2026 • Updated : September 16, 2026


ANKARA
According to a statement from Baykar, the Bayraktar AKINCI TİHA, developed domestically and originally by the company, continues to improve its air combat capabilities. In a test conducted within this scope, the SUNGUR system, developed by ROKETSAN, hit the target aircraft with pinpoint accuracy.
As part of the test activity, the AKINCI, which took off from the Çorlu Flight Training and Test Center in Tekirdağ, proceeded to the test area over the Black Sea. In the test conducted off the coast of Sinop, a target unmanned aerial vehicle flying in the sky was hit with pinpoint accuracy by a SUNGUR munition fired from the AKINCI. Following the successful completion of the firing test, the AKINCI returned to Çorlu following its planned route.
Having previously conducted air-to-air engagements with the KEMANKEŞ 1 AI-based mini cruise missile, the AKINCI also successfully hit its target with the EREN High-Speed Multi-Purpose Loitering Munition developed by ROKETSAN. By also using the SUNGUR Air Defense Missile, AKINCI expanded its capability to use different classes of domestically produced munitions against air targets, demonstrating its diverse range of munitions in air combat.

Layered operational force​

To date, within the scope of the development and ammunition integration activities of the national TİHA (Unmanned Combat Aircraft), the MAM-L, MAM-L TV, MAM-T, MAM-T IIR/TV, MAM-C, TOLUN ammunition family, TEBER-81, TEBER-82, LAÇİN, LGK-81, LGK-82, HGK-82, GÖKÇE Guidance Kit, GÖZDE Guidance Kit, KGK-82-SİHA, İHA-300 Supersonic Missile, İHA-230 Supersonic Missile, İHA-122 Supersonic Missile with TV seeker and laser seeker head, ÇAKIR Cruise Missile, and EREN High-Speed Multi-Purpose Loitering Munition have been successfully integrated. Thanks to this variety of ammunition with different range, guidance, and warhead options, AKINCI has gained a layered operational and attack capability, capable of performing missions against different target types, ranging from close to long range.
Baykar, which has carried out all its projects entirely with its own resources from the beginning, continued to be the world's largest exporter in the unmanned aerial vehicle (UAV) segment in 2025. Maintaining its leadership in the global UAV market for the last 3 years, Baykar renewed its own record with an export volume of 2.2 billion dollars in 2025. Having generated 90% of its revenue from exports in recent years, Baykar has become the driving force behind Türkiye's high-technology exports.
Baykar has signed export agreements with 36 countries for the Bayraktar TB2 UAV and with 16 countries for the AKINCI TİHA, bringing the total number of countries reached to 39.

 

Strong AI

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From this older interview, we know that a bigger AKINCI with TP-1400 will be built.


Is Selcuk saying that Baykar will convert TS-1400 into TP-1400?
Can a bigger AKINCI be integrated into Steel Dome and launch SIPER missiles?
Would it have enough capacity to launch Tayfun ALBM?
 

Pokemonte13

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From this older interview, we know that a bigger AKINCI with TP-1400 will be built.


Is Selcuk saying that Baykar will convert TS-1400 into TP-1400?
Can a bigger AKINCI be integrated into Steel Dome and launch SIPER missiles?
Would it have enough capacity to launch Tayfun ALBM?
there is currently no turbo prop version Of ts1400 not even in development i think
 

Pokemonte13

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Also what would be the point akinci with the PT 6 engines is powerful enough for ew, aew and has a payload above 1500kg with TP 1400 it would be similar to eurodrone (to expensive). I wich they would make a TB 4 with one PT 6 with payload capacity of 500kg+ rather than super akinci
 
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