TR Casual Discussion Çay Bahçesi

[Asena_great]

Ottomans, Seljuks and the Muslim Mongols also engaged in Islamic imperialism.

LOL

i don't see Arabs Persians and Greek putting Turkish name on their children and celebrating Turkish festivals

ottomans or seljuks didn't change the language festival and culture of the people they conquered nor did they change the religion of the conquered people. Greeks are best example after 400 years speak in Greek and follow Christianity all the way to modern era. Arabs Persians are other example that we didn't force them to adopt our language, put Turkish name on their children, celebrate our festival or follow our religion. they all keep their culture all the way to modern era

so tell me why greeks bulgars romanians serbs and others are still keeping their culture and religion ???

well on the other hand lets compere French, British and Arab imperialist who force their language , culture (behavior and name changing of children ) and festivals on the people they conquered. well i don't see differences between them. ofc despite this being clear as a day that we never force our language and culture on other people you always WILL say we are same with the French, British and Arab imperialist. your willingness to blackened our name for the sake of your religion shows you are Muslim first and maybe a turk second when it comes us vs them you will always sell us out

 

[Ryder]

i don't see Arabs Persians and Greek putting Turkish name on their children and celebrating Turkish festivals

ottomans or seljuks didn't change the language festival and culture of the people they conquered nor did they change the religion of the conquered people. Greeks are best example after 400 years speak in Greek and follow Christianity all the way to modern era. Arabs Persians are other example that we didn't force them to adopt our language, put Turkish name on their children, celebrate our festival or follow our religion. they all keep their culture all the way to modern era

so tell me why greeks bulgars romanians serbs and others are still keeping their culture and religion ???

well on the other hand lets compere French, British and Arab imperialist who force their language , culture (behavior and name changing of children ) and festivals on the people they conquered. well i don't see differences between them. ofc despite this being clear as a day that we never force our language and culture on other people you always WILL say we are same with the French, British and Arab imperialist. your willingness to blackened our name for the sake of your religion shows you are Muslim first and maybe a turk second when it comes us vs them you will always sell us out

Bro if you realised this but Turkish surnames tend to be pretty common in Syria, Iraq, Palestine and North Africa.

Basha, Tamer, Baybars, Osmani and various others.

I dont see Arabs even crying or complaining about it by the way.

Chagatai Khanate played a pretty big role in Islamising Central Asia. Even more than the Seljuks and Karakanids.

Islamisation of Central Asia was largely undertaken by Persian missionaries then the Turks and Turkified Mongols like the Chagatai Khanate gradually spread the faith in the entire region.

Arabs largely never saw the Turks become Muslim as they were already long gone from the region.

You'd be surprised at how many Greek peoples actually became Muslim in particular in Syria and Egypt. They speak Arabic while some speak Greek.

It takes centuries for people to be assmiliated into a new culture and even a religion. It does not take overnight.

 

[Afif]

Yeah, and this guy has no idea how Islam came to Bengal. Turkic warriors came carrying swords not roses.

There are some folks in my country who constantly cry about how true bengali culture was being erased, bla bla.

Any societies that becomes Muslim does not see Islam as the extension of ethnic Arab culture. Rather, it is a universal spiritual guidance equal for everybody. Non Arab Muslims are inherents of Islam as much as the Arab Muslims. Trying to manufacture an artificial conflict here between one's ethnic identity and Muslim identity won't work.

If Islam was to ensure Arab superiority, then prophet would have establish a caste or class system. Instead he explicitly made it clear in his most significant sermon-

"All mankind is from Adam and Eve, an Arab has no superiority over a non-Arab nor a non-Arab has any superiority over an Arab; also a White has no superiority over a Black nor a Black has any superiority over a White except by piety"

The Last Sermon Of Prophet Muhammad(SAW)

 

[Ryder]

Yeah, and this guy has no idea how Islam came to Bengal. Turkic warriors came carrying swords not roses.

There are some folks in my country who constantly cry about how true bengali culture was being erased, bla bla.

Any societies that becomes Muslim does not see Islam as the extension of ethnic Arab culture. Rather, it is a universal spiritual guidance equal for everybody. Non Arab Muslims are inherents of Islam as much as the Arab Muslims. Trying to manufacture an artificial conflict here between one's ethnic identity and Muslim identity won't work.

If was Islam was to ensure Arab superiority, then prophet would have establish a caste or class system. Instead he explicitly made it clear in his most significant sermon-

"All mankind is from Adam and Eve, an Arab has no superiority over a non-Arab nor a non-Arab has any superiority over an Arab; also a White has no superiority over a Black nor a Black has any superiority over a White except by piety"

Begum is a common name in Bangladesh for girls.

 

[Afif]

Begum is a common name in Bangladesh for girls.

Yes, both my grandma's last names are Begum. I hate Turkic imperialism!

 

[Ryder]

Yes, both my grandma's last names are Begum. I hate Turkic imperialism!

You qualify as an Honorary Turkic.

You must awaken your Turkic blood!!

 

[Afif]

You qualify as an Honorary Turkic.

You must awaken your Turkic blood!!

Really good song. Does Bayrak mean flag in Turkish? What does Bayraktar means then?

 

[Ryder]

Really good song. Does Bayrak mean flag in Turkish? What does Bayraktar means then?

Bayrak means flag while Bayraktar means Flag bearer.

 

[uçuyorum]

Really good song. Does Bayrak mean flag in Turkish? What does Bayraktar means then?

Bayraktar means standard bearer

 

[Anastasius]

i don't see Arabs Persians and Greek putting Turkish name on their children and celebrating Turkish festivals

A ton of Greeks have surnames ending -oglu. Just saying.

 

[Ryder]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1347005444322156545

Happy Jan 6 everybody time to repost this lmaooo

 

[Asena_great]

Bro if you realised this but Turkish surnames tend to be pretty common in Syria, Iraq, Palestine and North Africa.

we have first name such ali osman mohammed zeynep hatice fatma etc i dont see use mete bumin istemi Attila aydin ayla maral sanaz etc...

Chagatai Khanate played a pretty big role in Islamising Central Asia. Even more than the Seljuks and Karakanids.

off topic and irrelevant i gave you example Syria Egypt and Iraq where Arab imperialist completely change the culture of native people from names of children to festival to religen you said we did the same and i gave you another example of Greek Bulgaria Serbia and Romania even Arabia and Persia that we didn't did it to the people that we conquer and yet still you are insist that we are same as bad as they are so here we are now dont do off topic

Arabs largely never saw the Turks become Muslim as they were already long gone from the region.

completely nonsense as they attack khazar turks, turk shahi and khorasan turks. your sentence not just wrong but Untrue

You'd be surprised at how many Greek peoples actually became Muslim in particular in Syria and Egypt. They speak Arabic while some speak Greek.

they never became Turk did they ?? are you that desperate to make such ridiculous comparison. even today if you go alone to the US or German in time you beome american or german we are not talking about that agian i gave you the example of Syria Egypt and Iraq were the native's culture completely erased you said we did the same and i ask why greece bulgaria serbia romania are not turkic then ??

Yeah, and this guy has no idea how Islam came to Bengal. Turkic warriors came carrying swords not roses.

yeah do you know who were those turkic muslim warriors ?? the mamluks of india turkic slave soilders they were enslaved by arabs as child forced into islam trained as mamluks then unleashed on other nations or turkic people to force them into islam in this case it was Bengali people.

memluks were exactly the same as british indian colonial troops for arabs. british indian colonial troops brutally crush any Indian up rasing aginst british masters they fought in Indonesia against Japanese for British benefits they fought Germans in north Africa and Europe instead of staying at home so their British masters could be safe. memluks were exactly the same whether it was memluks of Egypt or memluks of India they were used by their colonials masters

Yeah, and this guy has no idea how Islam came to Bengal. Turkic warriors came carrying swords not roses.

thank you for helping my point (and scouring a goal against your own team ) next time when @Ryder brought up the myth ok peaceful conversion i will reminded him how Islam came to Bengal

Yes, both my grandma's last names are Begum.

Begum is a common name in Bangladesh for girls.

begum is name originated in Persian so its indo-European its normal to be present in Bengal

I hate Turkic imperialism!

do the right thing and remove it i have no objection what do i object is why you get triggered when im trying to do the same for my people

A ton of Greeks have surnames ending -oglu. Just saying.

and im yet to see wide spread turkic first names

 

[Asena_great]

@Ryder now we have gone off topic enough

that is Islamic imperialism and if we dont resist this the same fate of Syrians Iraqis and Egyptians await us. give arabc name for our kids follow Arabic customs and behaviors celebrate Arabic festivals such ramzan bayrami or kurban bayrami instead of Nardoqan, Kosaqan, Paktaqan, Paynaqan and Sayaqan

we must protect our culture

the post above was my post about Islamic imperialism you reacted by

Ottomans, Seljuks and the Muslim Mongols also engaged in Islamic imperialism.

LOL

calling as as same aka as bad as they are which i answered why greek bulgaria serbia etc... kept their language and culture while Syria Egypt and Iraq under Arab imperialism didn't in which you answered by off topics

and thats conclude our discussion here i have a project to attend to

 

[Ryder]

we have first name such ali osman mohammed zeynep hatice fatma etc i dont see use mete bumin istemi Attila aydin ayla maral sanaz etc...

off topic and irrelevant i gave you example Syria Egypt and Iraq where Arab imperialist completely change the culture of native people from names of children to festival to religen you said we did the same and i gave you another example of Greek Bulgaria Serbia and Romania even Arabia and Persia that we didn't did it to the people that we conquer and yet still you are insist that we are same as bad as they are so here we are now dont do off topic

completely nonsense as they attack khazar turks, turk shahi and khorasan turks. your sentence not just wrong but Untrue

they never became Turk did they ?? are you that desperate to make such ridiculous comparison. even today if you go alone to the US or German in time you beome american or german we are not talking about that agian i gave you the example of Syria Egypt and Iraq were the native's culture completely erased you said we did the same and i ask why greece bulgaria serbia romania are not turkic then ??


yeah do you know who were those turkic muslim warriors ?? the mamluks of india turkic slave soilders they were enslaved by arabs as child forced into islam trained as mamluks then unleashed on other nations or turkic people to force them into islam in this case it was Bengali people.

memluks were exactly the same as british indian colonial troops for arabs. british indian colonial troops brutally crush any Indian up rasing aginst british masters they fought in Indonesia against Japanese for British benefits they fought Germans in north Africa and Europe instead of staying at home so their British masters could be safe. memluks were exactly the same whether it was memluks of Egypt or memluks of India they were used by their colonials masters



thank you for helping my point (and scouring a goal against your own team ) next time when @Ryder brought up the myth ok peaceful conversion i will reminded him how Islam came to Bengal



begum is name originated in Persian so its indo-European its normal to be present in Bengal


do the right thing and remove it i have no objection what do i object is why you get triggered when im trying to do the same for my people

and im yet to see wide spread turkic first names

Mamluks and Ghulams were brought as a counter balance to numerous noble families who had claims to the throne.

Slave soldiers were only loyal to the sultan not to anybody else.

Since you mentioned the Mamluks dont forget that Baybars was enslaved by the Tengrist Mongols and sold to the Arabs in egypt were he rose the ranks.

Ottomans copied the Ghulams and made the devshirme and the jannisaries.

Mainly formed from christian families as a counter balance to the Turkish/Ic noble families who might rebel against the Osmanli dynasty.

Turks and Arabs nad numerous wars and battles. But the Arabs themselves did not see the Turks become Muslim enmass.

Islam mainly spread due to the efforts of the Abbassid Caliphate who sent Muslim missionaries to various parts of Eurasia to become Muslim.

Due to this the Turkic Volga Bulgarians became Muslim. Ummayads were more interested in conquest and taxing the locals peoples rather than spreading Islam.

Ummayads even tried their best not to make Berbers become Muslim as they believed their tax money would be cut.

Stop looking at history with a black and white lense.

 

[Ryder]

@Ryder now we have gone off topic enough

the post above was my post about Islamic imperialism you reacted by

calling as as same aka as bad as they are which i answered why greek bulgaria serbia etc... kept their language and culture while Syria Egypt and Iraq under Arab imperialism didn't in which you answered by off topics

and thats conclude our discussion here i have a project to attend to

Ottomans ruled pretty simple.

Pay taxes and we wont touch you or your culture.

Arabs easily Arabised the Middle East because Middle Easterners in general are pretty much related which made conversion of the ancient Middle East to a largely Arab one.

But most Syrians, Palestinians and Iraqis are descended from the natives people who lived there but also Arab conquerors.

They only speak Arabic. But its retarded to even suggest the Arab world is one monolithic entity.

When North Africans, Levants and the Gulf are all different from each other.

There are more Turkish words in Syrian Arabic and Lebanese Arabic than the Arabic spoken by Saudis.

Most Arabs even agree that being Arab is no longer racial but mainly cultural and speaking the language.

Sudanese qualify as Afro-Arabs. While Somalia is considered an Arab state because it joined the Arab league. They are not Arabs as most Somalis dont even speak Arabic.

 

[Afif]

thank you for helping my point (and scouring a goal against your own team ) next time when @Ryder brought up the myth ok peaceful conversion i will reminded him how Islam came to Bengal

No, that is not about that. You said -

i don't see Arabs Persians and Greek putting Turkish name on their children and celebrating Turkish festivals

ottomans or seljuks didn't change the language festival and culture of the people they conquered nor did they change the religion of the conquered people.

You are denying that Ottoman and seljuks Turks did not change the culture of conquered people and religions. Which I don't think is correct.
But other than that, I am giving you a concrete exmaple, that Turkic warriors came and conquered the land and change the culture of conquered people.

And what I meant by-

Turkic warriors came carrying swords not roses.

Is that Islam largely came in this region with military conquest not with missionaries. But that does not necessarily mean Islam was forced on the indeginous people.
There is a very important distinction here.

yeah do you know who were those turkic muslim warriors ?? the mamluks of india turkic slave soilders they were enslaved by arabs as child forced into islam trained as mamluks then unleashed on other nations or turkic people to force them into islam in this case it was Bengali people.

memluks were exactly the same as british indian colonial troops for arabs. british indian colonial troops brutally crush any Indian up rasing aginst british masters they fought in Indonesia against Japanese for British benefits they fought Germans in north Africa and Europe instead of staying at home so their British masters could be safe. memluks were exactly the same whether it was memluks of Egypt or memluks of India they were used by their colonials masters

If you are compalinig about mamluks then what are you going to say about the ottoman jennisaries?

But that is besides the point, Arab didn't unleashed the mamluks in this region. Malkuk was already running their own empire in the subcontinent.

And that is precisely the point, Foremer subjects quickly rose to the highest point of power in the Islamic context. Same is with Mamluks of Egypt and Mamluks of Subcontinent. Becuase, by and large it was uniquely fair system for its time.

But no Indian rose to the highest rank of British Army. Nor any of them became the rulers of Empire.

If islam was designed to ensure Arab Superiority, in early arab empires non Arabs wouldn't have become Generals and Rulers within the system so easily. Not to mention, Arab Muslims remembers Mamluks as heros, not some inherently inferior people.

 

[Afif]

Ottomans ruled pretty simple.

Pay taxes and we wont touch you or your culture.

Arabs easily Arabised the Middle East because Middle Easterners in general are pretty much related which made conversion of the ancient Middle East to a largely Arab one.

But most Syrians, Palestinians and Iraqis are descended from the natives people who lived there but also Arab conquerors.

They only speak Arabic. But its retarded to even suggest the Arab world is one monolithic entity.

When North Africans, Levants and the Gulf are all different from each other.

There are more Turkish words in Syrian Arabic and Lebanese Arabic than the Arabic spoken by Saudis.

Most Arabs even agree that being Arab is no longer racial but mainly cultural and speaking the language.

Sudanese qualify as Afro-Arabs. While Somalia is considered an Arab state because it joined the Arab league. They are not Arabs as most Somalis dont even speak Arabic.

Remember, it took alsmot three centuries for Egypt to become Muslim majority after the Islamic conquest. If Arabs wanted to forcefully convert them they could have done much earlier.

 

[Kaan Azman]

https://open.spotify.com/intl-tr/track/14Y05tWgK0pIGlccWdIHsj?si=73bcfea0b9e64fb6 wanted to drop a good Chechen song here, played by Timur Mutsurayev, a former Chechen fighter

 

[B_A]

we have first name such ali osman mohammed zeynep hatice fatma etc i dont see use mete bumin istemi Attila aydin ayla maral sanaz etc...

Actually many osman mohammed zeynep hatice was not Turkish origin.

They were Eastern European or other ethnic groups who became Ottoman Turks later.They converted to religion and therefore took Arabic names.Similar to how the Vikings changed their names to Christian names

 

[YeşilVatan]

Actually many osman mohammed zeynep hatice was not Turkish origin.

They were Eastern European or other ethnic groups who became Ottoman Turks later.They converted to religion and therefore took Arabic names.Similar to how the Vikings changed their names to Christian names

That's true to an extent until about 17th century. The Turkish names from 16th century Ottoman tax records are very Turkic. By 19th century what you say just wasn't the case.