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Van Kravchenko

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For the F15 hype :
Show began at 01.00

F15 surely hard to kill 🤣, the second after when she flew with only one wing left

I think the F15 pilot didnt know well or to panic to counter the missile. This can be see when the pilot deploying flare instead of chaff. And please someone corret me, does it posible to do evading manouver from the missile ? And I must admit that missile is highly accurate.

No confirmation, from Saudi aothor.
 

Indos

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This is explanation from Arab member in PDF

Shafts..Flares

The circles show the shafts and the square is for the missile explosion

1639192122549.png


The F-15 escaped.. check near top left..

 

Gary

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Losses in combat are unavoidable, that's why volume matters also. The fact that high end Saudi jets managed to got struct by militias like Houthis could give you an idea what comes when an air force operate in an A2/AD contested airspace.

I'd rather have the air force with 3 squadrons worth of second hand F-16s than a squadron of brand new ones.
 

Parry Brima

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I'd rather have the air force with 3 squadrons worth of second hand F-16s than a squadron of brand new ones.

We got 28 F-16s from the desert for less than $800 mil before. With $1.1 bil warchest we could probably get 40+ now. In the end we'll have 70 of them. Not bad.
 

Indos

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FPXAllen

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I think the F15 pilot didnt know well or to panic to counter the missile. This can be see when the pilot deploying flare instead of chaff. And please someone corret me, does it posible to do evading manouver from the missile ? And I must admit that missile is highly accurate.

No confirmation, from Saudi aothor.
The way most, if not all, missiles work in real life is not like in the movies where a missile will always pursue its target, even closely follows whatever crazy maneuver the pilot takes to try to evade it.

While indeed there are missiles designed to perform high-G maneuver, but one must remember that any abrupt maneuvering will cost it a lot of energy. This will cause a missile to quickly lose its speed especially in the post-booster phase when it only relies on the kinetic energy to reach its target. Of course, with the advent of air-breathing ramjet engines in some missiles this can be minimized although the principle of maneuver vs. energy still holds true.

In the case of missile evasion maneuver, as long as the fighter pilot can see where the missile is coming from a far enough distance, they can try to turn to get out of the missile targeting/flight envelope. Being slower than a missile, a fighter's advantage is that it can almost always turns tighter, thus forcing the missile to lose its energy faster or to overshoot its target. Of course, the timing is important here because if the pilot turns too early, then the missile can still follow suit to adjust its lead without losing much energy. On the other hand, if the pilot turns too late, their ride will still be inside the missile blast radius when it explodes.

So yes, it's possible for a fighter to evade missiles given that its pilot can see the threat when it was still far enough. However, it takes a highly skilled pilot to be able to pull such evasive maneuvers so the more trained ones will have a better chance to do so.

As for the Saudi's F-15 in the video, we can see that the plane was still flying straight although it has released chaffs and flares several times. This was likely an error in its pilot's judgement, probably because he only relied on the RWR or because he was unable to see the missile until it was too close to avoid. This speaks a lot about the lack of training as well as a mistake in deployment tactics because if he wasn't flying alone and if his flight was monitored by an AEW plane, he will likely be able to see the threat from afar.

The fact that the plane was still able to fly is more about his luck than anything.
 
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NEKO

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We got 28 F-16s from the desert for less than $800 mil before. With $1.1 bil warchest we could probably get 40+ now. In the end we'll have 70 of them. Not bad.
I thought you are against any LM products, especially the one from The Boneyard.
 

Parry Brima

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I thought you are against any LM products, especially the one from The Boneyard.

I'm only against F-16. Not just from the boneyard, but the brand new Vipers as well.

But if we only got $1.1 bil to spend for fighter then how on earth could we afford the shinny Rafale, Eagle 2, or Eurofighters (my preference). It would be stupid to spend that much on new fighters as we need numbers now. Just spend all of them on the boneyard fighters.

We can dream whatever we want but the fact is that the budget that has already been approved by MoF now is only $1.1 bil. Otherwise we'd have signed official Rafale deal (not just LoI) a long time ago.

(Disclaimer : I'm totally not against LM's F-35 ;) )
 
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Gary

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Not only we're short of airframe, with the limited budget we have, we're not likely to have our hands on what really matters, the weapons.

I don't think we have money for adequate amounts of AAM, AShM, ASM, smart bombs. Especially with the high priced Europeans price tag.

Anyone who has read Corporal Frisk simulation on a hypothetical air warfare using CMANO, would be aware just how much missile and bombs will be expanded in a single battle.

Yet here we are, trying to secure jets beyond our means in a middle of a pandemic.

🤡🤡
 

Umigami

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Second hand jet (especially F16): politically uninteresting.

Remember what happen with Austrian Typhoon?

he need this for 2024.
 

Indos

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Only F-16. Not just from the boneyard, but the brand new Vipers as well.

But if we only got $1.1 bil to spend for fighter then how on earth could we afford the shinny Rafale, Eagle 2, or Eurofighters (my preference). It would be stupid to spend that much on new fighters as we need numbers now.

We can dream whatever we want but the fact is that the budget that has already been approved by MoF now is only $1.1 bil. Otherwise we'd have signed official Rafale deal (not just LoI) a long time ago.

(Disclaimer : I'm totally not against LM's F-35 ;) )

Well according to Max Defense, USA can only allow Philippine to get cheap second hand F 16 if Pinoy buy new F 16 V, so it should be in combined. Indonesia will not have difficulty to do that with 1.1 billion USD foreign loan approval from FM already
 

Indos

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Not only we're short of airframe, with the limited budget we have, we're not likely to have our hands on what really matters, the weapons.

I don't think we have money for adequate amounts of AAM, AShM, ASM, smart bombs. Especially with the high priced Europeans price tag.

Anyone who has read Corporal Frisk simulation on a hypothetical air warfare using CMANO, would be aware just how much missile and bombs will be expanded in a single battle.

Yet here we are, trying to secure jets beyond our means in a middle of a pandemic.

🤡🤡

This make General Andika told that to Jokowi directly in front of the media during Armed Force day. This then suggest General Andika prefers more budget for ammunitions while new big tickets weapon like fighter, frigates, etc acquisition should be done in realistic mode.
 

Umigami

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So the realistic plan is buy mix new-second Vipers and FA 50, then pray hard hoping KF21 will be as good as what Korean said?
 

Gary

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This make General Andika told that to Jokowi directly in front of the media during Armed Force day. This then suggest General Andika prefers more budget for ammunitions while new big tickets weapon like fighter, frigates, etc acquisition should be done in realistic mode.
Andhika only mention the Mistral missile stock (72 remains iirc), but yeah this applies to the entirety of the armed forces. We're short on munitions, from the lowest rifle round to missiles.

I mean we only bought 36 AIM-9X, TF was that ??
 

Parry Brima

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So it looks like Secretary Blinken loves to hear the music from the place/countries he's about to visit.

From Indonesia, he chose Chrisye, Slank, Payung Teduh, and Barry Likumahuwa.



I don't mean any disrespect towards those musicians/artists, but it feels like missed opportunities not recommending him to listen to our own dangdut koplo.
 

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