Indonesia Indonesian Air Force, Tentara Nasional Indonesia-Angkatan Udara (TNI-AU)

[AlphaMike]

retire sukhoi, induct frenchie

Hawks are the bigger lemon

 

[joedhie2k]

my guess, wowo wont retire anything.. he needs number for flypass and parade
must looks strong for the election

 

[AlphaMike]

Kemenhan, No love for more FA-50 ?

 

[wahyu845]

Jokowi's government policy is not to buy used airplanes? That's why the government doesn't buy used Rafales or used F 16s, is it possible now to buy used Mirages from midle east ?

 

[naively_thuled_once6101]

It started from US decline us to get F-35 lol. Then all kind of aircrafts started to popping up until this shame Mirage 2000.

But what is F-35 if logistically we still considered as less good than countries that already would got it this decade

 

[R4duga]

coming soon on tni au depohar.

 

[wahyu845]

coming soon on tni au depohar.
View attachment 45486

Be careful in the end those fighter became Hanggar Queen

 

[naively_thuled_once6101]

Be careful in the end those fighter became Hanggar Queen

What you expect from procurement with poor planning compared to Japan, SK, Taiwan, Singapore, PRC. Put just Asian countries here.

 

[wahyu845]

It started from US decline us to get F-35 lol. Then all kind of aircrafts started to popping up until this shame Mirage 2000.

But what is F-35 if logistically we still considered as less good than countries that already would got it this decade

but as a comparison of thailand which has the same ability as we get F 35

 

[naively_thuled_once6101]

but as a comparison of thailand which has the same ability as we get F 35

Still no new information about that right? I don’t think US would give Thailand F-35 if they still not fully used democracy again after the coup by today’s PM. If US give the non democratic countries the same as the countries with democracy, what the difference between them arming Russia and China.

Last decades, ya they were arming non democratic at least they were Anti-Soviet or communist as a whole, but now is not battle between that anymore, the value here is democracy and non-democratic value. Citizens of Panem deserves better than unilateral Hunger Games every years from the people that they couldn’t even change except with violence.

 

[Jagdflieger]

Indonesia needs an effective and encompassing realistic Air-force - not a sorry "meaningless" Show-force.

If the USA is willing to supply Block50+ then get a force totaling 100+ F-16's - other wise get a 140 J-10's + training from Pakistan
Indonesia needs numbers and realistic maintenance and upgrade possibilities to actually learn as to what an Air-force is about.
Then after 2035 at least it would know what to look for and as to how an Air-force serves Indonesia's defense interests best.

 

[Lordimperator]

It started from US decline us to get F-35 lol. Then all kind of aircrafts started to popping up until this shame Mirage 2000.

But what is F-35 if logistically we still considered as less good than countries that already would got it this decade

RTAF has the higher chance in F35 procurements

What you expect from procurement with poor planning compared to Japan, SK, Taiwan, Singapore, PRC. Put just Asian countries here.

Welp, lack of visionaries and long term military investment doesnt get you more vote, only bombastic ones could be Campaign for the political and decision maker.

 

[FPXAllen]

I don’t think US would give Thailand F-35 if they still not fully used democracy again after the coup by today’s PM.

Friendly reminder: Don't bet on it.

Indonesia needs an effective and encompassing realistic Air-force - not a sorry "meaningless" Show-force.

We've always been 'tambal sulam' and 'ngeteng' post-1965. But to look from another perspective, the first time we bought combat aircraft and other military hardwares in (relatively) large numbers in the early 60s, we were still paying the debts incurred by that until well into the mid-1990s.

I feel that we're in a similar position (well, kind of) to Germany in regards to military spending post WW2 until after Russia invaded Ukraine. There are still traces of "not wanting to disturb our neighbors" mentality or justification when it comes to the issue of raising defense budget.

Would love to see this country raising its peacetime defense budget to at least 1.5%-2% of GDP within my lifetime.

 

[Umigami]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1541413248310087680

 

[Umigami]

 

[Jagdflieger]

Friendly reminder: Don't bet on it.

We've always been 'tambal sulam' and 'ngeteng' post-1965. But to look from another perspective, the first time we bought combat aircraft and other military hardwares in (relatively) large numbers in the early 60s, we were still paying the debts incurred by that until well into the mid-1990s.

I feel that we're in a similar position (well, kind of) to Germany in regards to military spending post WW2 until after Russia invaded Ukraine. There are still traces of "not wanting to disturb our neighbors" mentality or justification when it comes to the issue of raising defense budget.

Would love to see this country raising its peacetime defense budget to at least 1.5%-2% of GDP within my lifetime.

No one can or would deny Indonesia's right towards an effective defense. - The problem isn't just the defense budget, but the way it is spend.
Germany had around 1000F-104 and around 400 idiotic Fiat-G91
In the 80's Replaced by around 250 F-4's, 400 Tornado and 250 less idiotic Alpha jets.
Replaced by around 140 Eurofighter's (initially supposed to be 350) , 75 Tornado's - now to be replaced by around 30 F-35's.
(Please don't ask as to how many are actually capable to fly combat missions)

That the numbers are going down is happening in every country - huge costs for new aircraft, and smaller or stagnant budgets.
But as you can see - there were never more then 2-3 fighter-aircraft types around. - and this is what (as you know) makes an air-force effective/worthwhile.

Indonesia since the 80's - Hawk 109, 200, 209, OV-10 Bronco, T-50's, A-4's, F-5's, F-16, Suhkoi 27, Suhkoi 30, Rafale and now maybe plus Mirage 2000 - never mind the Tucano's - did I forget any? - basically 11 aircraft, all in insufficient numbers to secure 12 million square kilometers of territory.

 

[naively_thuled_once6101]

Friendly reminder: Don't bet on it.

I’ll take it but still explain my view about it anyway.

Would be political suicide if US (Congress especially) let them have F-35 in current conditions, except they are really needed to have the F-35 to advance US interest in the region, like they are the country that has the same interest with US to tackle whatever in the region.

US gain nothing or even lose their credibility of defending democracy if they just recklessly let current Thai government with its high possibility of rigging the elections with F-35 without excusable reason.

 

[ArvaYale]

Welp, at least everyone here knows they cannot defend the Mirage idea, or even completely disagree with it, and therefore also agree that the procurement policy regarding this is stupid. So they subconsciously agree that SMI is proven to be stupid in terms of her commitment to "supporting" defense-related programs indeed because otherwise, they should have defended "her" policy, which they didn't.

Then blame "historical precedent" for such an awful procurement policy to avoid blaming SMI, when it clearly wouldn't be a thing without her acc. Such a letdown when Wowo already laid out the plan for fighter jets which was quite nice but then modified in favor of idiotic "alternatives" approved by a dumber minister.

Anyway, we should stick to the original Rafale + F-15 + KF-21, with the planned optimal number of airframes, I think you guys agree with me on this.

 

[Umigami]

Rafale + F-15 + KF-21, with the planned optimal number of airframes, I think you guys agree with me on this.

Ideally. If possible.

 

[FPXAllen]

Since I was likely either one, or one of few, who was mentioned in this - especially due to my last few posts containing historical contexts (which were never intended to point finger on anyone, btw):

Then blame "historical precedent" for such an awful procurement policy to avoid blaming SMI

I just have to put this here:

Spoiler

Who hurt you mate?

Most, if not all of us here feel frustrated by this matter, but everyone has their own way to express their frustration especially since they've been all too familiar with 'betrayed expectations' in TNI's procurement projects even long before the current finmin or whatever.

So why the need to disparage anyone who chooses not to express their frustration the same way you do?