Indonesia Indonesian Navy, Tentara Nasional Indonesia-Angkatan Laut (TNI-AL)

[Madokafc]

its more like the request from current admin hoping things would finished before the next presidential election (you know how stuff work here) , its either fincantieri may postponed or reassigned their cruise ship division and shipyard for building naval ship first , if it was really the current admin request to have atleast 4 hull before 2024 , seeing how japanese launched two ship simultaneously near the end of 2020- first quarter of 2021 while the first steel cutting happened in q3 2019 , MHI still have possibility to bag the contract with that kind of requirement .

Mogami class can be built at the same time in two or more Japanese Shipyard (MHI, Mitsui and other) as they (the Japanese Shipyard) are not shy away to share building order with their rival as long as they can get the order done at the requested time. People who got know their business ethic would know how they are working

 

[Parry Brima]

Bruh...

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1376603815252652035

we are challenging the first four to be delivered by 2024 are you kidding me??!!! let's put some Chinese levels shipbuilding here.....let's say fincantieri bagged the contract and they accept the challenge if we want it by 2024 so this year for contract's signing is a MUST

The average production time for FREMM is about 4 years (from the laid down to the comissioning). So we need at least until 2025.

All of Italian FREMM have been produced in Riva Trigoso Genova shipyard. I think they have the capacity to build 3-4 ships in paralel. The only remaining FREMM to be built there are the 2 for Italian navy. The last FREMM for Egyptian navy is undergoing sea trials from mid-Feb and will be delivered in the upcoming weeks.

Fincantieri have 3 shipyards for military vessels. Apart from the one at Riva Trigoso they also have other two at Muggiano La Spezia and Castellammare di Stabia Napoli.

Muggiano shipyard seems dedicated to build max 3000 tons ship while Castellammare shipyard is able to build 30,000 tons LHD ship.

If the Italian navy are willing to let us take their 2 FREMMs that are undergoing production at Riva Trigoso, and Fincantieri can maximize the capacity at Riva Trigoso and add Castellammare to build 1-2 more then I think it's still possible to receive all 4 FREMMS in 2025.

 

[Mandala]

Maybe AH meant first of four. Lol.

 

[R4duga]

Maybe AH meant first of four. Lol.

perhaps

 

[NEKO]

Maybe AH meant first of four. Lol.

perhaps

 

[Anmdt]

The average production time for FREMM is about 4 years (from the laid down to the comissioning). So we need at least until 2025.

All of Italian FREMM have been produced in Riva Trigoso Genova shipyard. I think they have the capacity to build 3-4 ships in paralel. The only remaining FREMM to be built there are the 2 for Italian navy. The last FREMM for Egyptian navy is undergoing sea trials from mid-Feb and will be delivered in the upcoming weeks.

Fincantieri have 3 shipyards for military vessels. Apart from the one at Riva Trigoso they also have other two at Muggiano La Spezia and Castellammare di Stabia Napoli.

Muggiano shipyard seems dedicated to build max 3000 tons ship while Castellammare shipyard is able to build 30,000 tons LHD ship.

If the Italian navy are willing to let us take their 2 FREMMs that are undergoing production at Riva Trigoso, and Fincantieri can maximize the capacity at Riva Trigoso and add Castellammare to build 1-2 more then I think it's still possible to receive all 4 FREMMS in 2025.

The matter is fincantireri can build ships in parallel but ships are handled by intervals.

If you have slight idea about how many people are hired in shibbuilding industry or if you actually walked around in Fincanteri you would have a sense of why it is not practically possible to start all ships at once and deliver at once. Even if possible, 2024 is not possible since ships take more than 3 years.

There is planning for building includes allocation of steelworks flow and then remaining (piping, electronics, erection of the hull on drydock or slipway) of each will have separate teams/divisions of their own which handles ship one by one, you can not simply multiply number of personnel at once, not feasible. There will be enough interval between ships.

Japanese have some magic as @Madokafc has told even rival shipyards can build as long it serves the purpose, and ethically they know their limits. Moreover Japanese shipyards has larger capacity thanks to the commercial section.

And one more magic is :automation, another: block sizes, one more: tolerances. Japanese are at top on these.

 

[Van Kravchenko]

To be note, US$ 450 million per ship of this vessel carry

Remaining big obstacle now is whether they can put MBDA missiles on it or not?

Or they will just push Navy to adapt new system...

To be noticed, this 450 millon dollar ship at firstplace delivered as FFBNW configurations.

Only electronics suite were installed, maingun, CIWS, Missile, etc. Is yet installed.

Japan manufacturer itself state that this 30ffm frigate can be tailored at customer will.

 

[Mandala]

TERMA OPENS OFFICES IN INDONESIA​

2021-03-29:

Terma has established itself in Indonesia with the opening of PT Terma Technologies Indonesia. The expansion emphasizes the company’s focus on the country, where it will pursue business opportunities within the aerospace, defense and security sector.
​

Singapore, 29 March 2021- The new office represents the third expansion in the Asia-Pacific region after the establishment of Terma Singapore in 2007 and Terma India in New Delhi in 2012. Terma Indonesia joins the Terma Asia Pacific cluster, with direct report to Singapore, which remains the regional headquarters.

Terma’s business activities are established in Jakarta and supported by a Program & Service Office in Surabaya. The Surabaya office will include a workshop, and will ensure project management, support & services, engineering and maintenance tasks for Terma’s customers.

“Throughout the past decade, Terma’s operations in Asia-Pacific have grown significantly and Indonesia has played a key role in our regional development”, says Jes Munk Hansen, CEO & President of Terma. “Building and leveraging on our trusted relations in Indonesia has placed Terma in a strong position for growth and is a catalyst for us to make further investments into the country” he adds.

Terma’s high-tech solutions are operated on all theaters of operations (air, land and sea) by Indonesian customers including the Coast Guards (BAKAMLA), the Sea and Coast Guard (KPLP), the Directorate General of Sea Transportation (DGST), the Indonesian Navy (TNI-AL), the Indonesian Air Force (TNI-AU) and several international airports, including Jakarta. In 2019 Terma was awarded a contract for the supply of complete C-Series Combat suite for four 60-meter Fast Attack Crafts (KCR-60). Most recently, the SCANTER radars have been selected to equip non-combatant vessels such as the Hospital Assistance Ships (BRS).

“Through our close-knit collaborations, we have developed valuable and long-lasting relationships with highly skilled Indonesian companies, paramount in ensuring the success of our programs” says Anupam Narain Mathur, VP & GM of Terma Asia Pacific “By starting local entities in Indonesia, Terma will offer even better support to the local customers while being much closer to them” he adds.

PT Terma Technologies Indonesia employs local workforce in an effort to develop sustainable presence and transfer value-added skills.

Terma opens offices in Indonesia

Terma has established itself in Indonesia with the opening of PT Terma Technologies Indonesia.

www.terma.com

 

[NEKO]

More terma product incoming.

 

[R4duga]

they could provide some ECM pod for our f-16

 

[Parry Brima]

The matter is fincantireri can build ships in parallel but ships are handled by intervals.

If you have slight idea about how many people are hired in shibbuilding industry or if you actually walked around in Fincanteri you would have a sense of why it is not practically possible to start all ships at once and deliver at once. Even if possible, 2024 is not possible since ships take more than 3 years.

There is planning for building includes allocation of steelworks flow and then remaining (piping, electronics, erection of the hull on drydock or slipway) of each will have separate teams/divisions of their own which handles ship one by one, you can not simply multiply number of personnel at once, not feasible. There will be enough interval between ships.

Japanese have some magic as @Madokafc has told even rival shipyards can build as long it serves the purpose, and ethically they know their limits. Moreover Japanese shipyards has larger capacity thanks to the commercial section.

And one more magic is :automation, another: block sizes, one more: tolerances. Japanese are at top on these.

Well, I clearly stated that the average production time for FREMM is about 4 years, not 3 years. I understand that the interval will make the parallel production becomes separated in timeline.

Anyway, Fincantieri is arguably the largest shipbuilders in Europe. Apart from the 3 shipyards that I stated which seem to be dedicated for military vessels, they also have at least 4 other shipyards in Italy for commercial ships; Monfalcone, Marghera, Ancona, and Sestri Ponente. These 4 shipyards are capable to build huge commercial > 50,000 tons ships. Quick search shows me that there seems to be zero backlog in these shipyards.

Don't you think they can mobilize all of their shipyards (at least they have 6 shipyards with > 6000 tons capacity including Riva Trigoso that's been building FREMM) for customers dire needs? I know we probably have to pay more

 

[Anmdt]

Well, I clearly stated that the average production time for FREMM is about 4 years, not 3 years. I understand that the interval will make the parallel production becomes separated in timeline.

Anyway, Fincantieri is arguably the largest shipbuilders in Europe. Apart from the 3 shipyards that I stated which seem to be dedicated for military vessels, they also have at least 4 other shipyards in Italy for commercial ships; Monfalcone, Marghera, Ancona, and Sestri Ponente. These 4 shipyards are capable to build huge commercial > 50,000 tons ships. Quick search shows me that there seems to be zero backlog in these shipyards.

Don't you think they can mobilize all of their shipyards (at least they have 6 shipyards with > 6000 tons capacity including Riva Trigoso that's been building FREMM) for customers dire needs? I know we probably have to pay more

Mobilizing all shipyards just for Indonesia's 4 military ships, i mean their commercial shipyards are already booked from years now, as well as their military shipyards.

Then you are also aware some of the shipyard is focusing on yachts which has much higher revenue than military ship,
While another two specializes in cruise ships which is currently booked probably one for maintenance another for build.
While another focuses on overhauls and maintenance of military ships.

They also seem to diverge military production and commercial production. It may not be not easy to transfer personnel between of these unless they have been already doing that (if i know those shipyards are separated for long time,by distance too)

The FREMM building shipyard have 3 spots for new building. So by intervals of 6 months they can easily build one hull and clear the spot for the new one. In my opinion it is a very good production rate for a single shipyard, a new ship can be delivered in each 6-8 months.

Maybe Indonesia's shouldn't have been late, so that we wouldn't have to think whether paying more could provoke Fincantieri to convert commercial shipyards to military one just to keep up with a tight schedule.

Probably Alman has referred to, that first ship will be delivered in Q4 2024-Q1 2025, remaining will come by 6-8 months intervals.

 

[Jaka45]

Bruh...

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1376603815252652035

we are challenging the first four to be delivered by 2024 are you kidding me??!!! let's put some Chinese levels shipbuilding here.....let's say fincantieri bagged the contract and they accept the challenge if we want it by 2024 so this year for contract's signing is a MUST

Lmao give up on your dream and die.

What alman mean is that we give fincantieri such an impossible task so they will fail to meet our demand.

Basically we just saving face here. Dan emg dasarnya gk punya uang wkwk

 

[Madokafc]

Lmao give up on your dream and die.

What alman mean is that we give fincantieri such an impossible task so they will fail to meet our demand.

Basically we just saving face here. Dan emg dasarnya gk punya uang wkwk

The one who got a very very long track record to give us soft loan on long term basis very generously as long as we got commitment to paid them and using their very own solution is Japan.

 

[JATOSINT]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1376878303701737482

 

[Parry Brima]

The one who got a very very long track record to give us soft loan on long term basis very generously as long as we got commitment to paid them and using their very own solution is Japan.

I don't understand why people keep mentioning Japan in regards to FREMM. We want 16 140m frigates. The first 2 will be Ivers. The next 8 will be 30FFM. So there's still 6 slots to be filled. This is where FREMM competes against Arrowhead and Sigma. Probably that's why the offer from Fincantieri is for 6 ships. It's not competing against 30FFM, unless we plan to buy not just 8, but 14 30FFMs.

 

[Madokafc]

I don't understand why people keep mentioning Japan in regards to FREMM. We want 16 140m frigates. The first 2 will be Ivers. The next 8 will be 30FFM. So there's still 6 slots to be filled. This is where FREMM competes against Arrowhead and Sigma. Probably that's why the offer from Fincantieri is for 6 ships. It's not competing against 30FFM, unless we plan to buy not just 8, but 14 30FFMs.

First the budget is only around 3 Billion US Dollar lah for the next Frigates program in which Fremm and 30FFM actually competed against each other

Second, there is no other tender for major surface warships except for this one at least until 2024. Except for some OPV class.

Third in this term we can only get eight FFM or Eight Babcock Arrowhead or six Fremm or Six advance Sigma class, the choice is on Joko Widodo himself actually and i bet he is prefer the one who can offer lucrative counter trade deal along with Investment promises as Japanese had offered their Investment Fund to fund our newly established SWF.

 

[Parry Brima]

First the budget is only around 3 Billion US Dollar lah for the next Frigates program in which Fremm and 30FFM actually competed against each other

Second, there is no other tender for major surface warships except for this one at least until 2024. Except for some OPV class.

Third in this term we can only get eight FFM or Eight Babcock Arrowhead or six Fremm or Six advance Sigma class, the choice is on Joko Widodo himself actually and i bet he is prefer the one who can offer lucrative counter trade deal along with Investment promises as Japanese had offered their Investment Fund to fund our newly established SWF.

From the potential total of $40 bil PLN until 2024 we only allocate $3 bil for 140m frigates?

 

[whatintarnation]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1376878303701737482

the spaniards are back

this time however not for spices lol

 

[Madokafc]

From the potential total of $40 bil PLN until 2024 we only allocate $3 bil for 140m frigates?

Who said that? The approved budget would not cross 22 Billion US Dollar bill by 2024. In which around Four to six Billion US Dollar for fighter programme, 1,1 Billion US Dollar for fighter programme from MEF2, three Billion US Dollar for Frigates, around six Billion US Dollar for Submarine deal, there is another MERAD/LORAD GBAD, armed UAV. There is also MRTT and several important stuff like helicopters and MPA Aircraft. There is also post for interim program like Frigates, fighter and Submarine.