Japan could become partner nation on UK-led future fighter effort, says program director

xizhimen

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I believe Japan will go ahead with their own program, unless Tempest give many benefits to Japan aerospace industry.
It takes decades to build a complete, independent defence industry, India hasn't even make it happen till now even with heavy investment.
 

Gary

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LoL , Japan and no money , Chinese make good jokes but this in best .

Dude , British can make it but not Japan ??
Let some members be like that. Maybe he forgets where does the first AESA radar was born.


Japan has what it needs to succeed with the FX. A robust and capable electronic industry. The main issue will be the engine, which I believe the Brits could give a helping hand.
 

Gary

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It's not that Japan doesn't have the money, its more that Japan has been building copies of American aircraft and doesn't have the design and development industry to do its own program.

Doesn't mean they can't, when the F-2 fighter came along, Japan is in intense rivalry with the US. And politics came into play here.

They could've pursue their own indigenous design, but politics said otherwise.

In early 1987, the United States, through Caspar Weinberger and other administration officials, began formally pressuring Japan to execute the project as a U.S.–Japan bilateral joint development.[7][5] The timing of this lobbying coincided with the height of "Japan bashing" in the United States: the Toshiba-Kongsberg scandal, in which Toshiba was found to have sold propeller milling machinery to the Soviet Union in violation of COCOM sanctions, became public in May 1987. Japan's negotiating stance changed amid the risk of deterioration in U.S.–Japan relations

 

Gary

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Not anymore, the economy keeps shrinking, along with many industries.
yeah this come from a country who has not contribute anything new to the innovation in military appliance of civilian electronic technology. (y)

you're using this thread to boast about China's economy which has nothing to do with Japan's ability to develop its fighter jets.
Consider how the UK despite losing it's superpower status in the 50s and kept leading the dev on military technology, your suggestion is null.

how's your engine program btw ???

================

so anyway, as this article suggest the cooperation will be focused on electronics and engine.

 
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xizhimen

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yeah this come from a country who has not contribute anything new to the innovation in military appliance of civilian technology. (y)

you're using this thread to boast about China's economy which has nothing to do with Japan's ability to develop its fighter jets.
Consider how the UK despite losing it's superpower status in the 50s and kept leading the dev on military technology, your suggestion is null.

how's your engine program btw ???

================

so anyway, as this article suggest the cooperation will be focused on electronics and engine.

Chinese engines? breakthroughs everyday and now are installed in J-20 and Y-20. China contributes nothing? actually now China has more science papers quoted than anyone else, so are the patents applied and granted. I was talking about Japan doesn't have funds and resources to do this job alone, it's a fact. a next generation plane is not only involved in aircraft building, it requires a complete , whole defence and other industries backing, which Japan and it never has.
 

Gary

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China contributes nothing? actually now China has more science papers quoted than anyone else, so are the patents applied and granted. I was talking about Japan doesn't have funds and resources to do this job alone, it's a fact. a next generation plane is not only involved in aircraft building, it requires a complete , whole defence and other industries backing, which Japan and it never has.

I said
who has not contribute anything new to the innovation in military appliance of civilian electronic technology

China is merely a follower when it comes to military electronics (which is btw taken from already known civilian uses of such) and your China is in no position to criticize Japan. China merely knows how to manufacture --for example-- AESA radar doesn't meant China out innovate other countries, you're merely catching up with countries that have already operate it, such as Japan.

that is nothing new, maybe new for you, but for others not so much.


Chinese engines? breakthroughs everyday and now are installed in J-20 and Y-20.
again what is the MTBO of your Chinese engine ????
 

xizhimen

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China is merely a follower when it comes to military electronics (which is btw taken from already known civilian uses of such)
Ok, if you say so, but we wonder why the west is so worries if your statement is true?
 

xizhimen

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your China is in no position to criticize Japan.
I m just saying Japan can't do it alone with its current economy and technology, you can argue against it, it's perfectly fine, we'll see who's going to be right in the end.
 

Gary

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Ok, if you say so, but we wonder why the west is so worries if your statement is true?
when the MiG-25 came out, it was met within western analyst with alarm.


then Viktor Belenko decided to defect to Japan, flying his MiG-25 towards Hakodate, Japan

guess what comes next??

NATO obtained a better understanding of the MiG-25's capabilities on 6 September 1976, when a Soviet Air Defence Forces pilot, Lt. Viktor Belenko, defected, landing his MiG-25P at Hakodate Airport in Japan
  • Belenko's particular aircraft was brand new, representing the latest Soviet technology.
  • The aircraft was assembled quickly and was essentially built around its massive Tumansky R-15(B) turbojets.
  • Welding was done by hand. Rivets with non-flush heads were used in areas that would not cause adverse aerodynamic drag.[35]
  • The aircraft was built of a nickel-steel alloy and not titanium, as was assumed (although some titanium was used in heat-critical areas). The steel construction contributed to the craft's high 29,000 kg (64,000 lb) unarmed weight.
  • Maximum acceleration (g-load) rating was just 2.2 g (21.6 m/s2) with full fuel tanks, with an absolute limit of 4.5 g (44.1 m/s2). One MiG-25 withstood an inadvertent 11.5 g (112.8 m/s2) pull during low-altitude dogfight training, but the resulting deformation damaged the airframe beyond repair.[36]
  • Combat radius was 299 kilometres (186 mi), and maximum range on internal fuel (at subsonic speeds) was only 1,197 kilometres (744 mi) at low altitude, less than 1,000 m (3,300 ft).[13]
  • The airspeed indicator was redlined at Mach 2.8, with typical intercept speeds near Mach 2.5 in order to extend the service life of the engines.[29] A MiG-25 was tracked flying over the Sinai Peninsula at Mach 3.2 in the early 1970s, but the flight led to the engines being damaged beyond repair.[35]
  • The majority of the on-board avionics were based on vacuum-tube technology, more specifically nuvistors, not solid-state electronics. Although they represented aging technology, vacuum tubes were more tolerant of temperature extremes, thereby removing the need for environmental controls in the avionics bays. With the use of vacuum tubes, the MiG-25P's original Smerch-A (Tornado, NATO reporting name "Foxfire") radar had enormous power – about 600 kilowatts. As with most Soviet aircraft, the MiG-25 was designed to be as robust as possible. The use of vacuum tubes also made the aircraft's systems resistant to an electromagnetic pulse, for example, after a nuclear blast. They were also presumably used to provide radiation hardening for the avionics

None of the western fears about the Foxbat are true, in fact it was later known to be a primitive aircraft compared to existing teen series jets.

moral of the story: Being serious on its foe is what western analyst do. In fact that's how it's done.
 

Gary

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I m not an expert in this sector,
then how do you come up with this conclusion

am sure you have a wealth of experience in this sector to back this up, no ???

1.PNG
 

xizhimen

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then how do you come up with this conclusion

am sure you have a wealth of experience in this sector to back this up, no ???

View attachment 31311
It dosen't require a jet engine expert to see Japan doesn't have a complete independent defence industry to make a next generation jet. we'll see.
 

xizhimen

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What US and the west is trying to do is contain and slow down China, so they can keep enjoying unrivaled world dominance and white supremacy, nothing more. China is just a boogeyman they created to scare non white fools cause China is the only country that will bring their centuries old western white global domination to an end.
China only cares about her own development, as long as others don't try to interrupt our development, China has no major problems with anyone. the whole world is just our market in our eyes.
 

Nilgiri

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that's not what I asked, I want numbers of MTBO.

It's a recurring theme with this lot in general.

High on the blah, high on the inflated padded stats (pass it around kumbaya copy-paste numbers stronk) high on the time for spreading it....but low on the quality, low on the actual info.

In fact its a recurring joke among people in the know to find a whole group of science papers from China that all count individually in the stats ("technically" separate paper)...but all are basically saying the exact same thing.

You account for all of that and its more or less par for the course from PRC.
 

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