TR Land Vehicle Programs

[AzeriTank]

Reducing visibility is a secondary concern in modern peer-to-peer conflicts. T-72s are doubling their silhouettes with the addition of top slat armor, in Ukraine. RCWS provides the crucial capability to return fire while under attack, equips small units with excellent optics, and, more importantly, adds thermal imaging. Increases firing range. In Syria, Kirpis were precisely engaging YPG targets from over 2 kilometers away. Adding a RCWS to basic vehicle maybe quadruples the combat effectiveness of that vehicle.

See the RCWS firing under immense fire from Russians.
https://www.reddit.com/r/CombatFootage/comments/16qezwh

plus, with noise detection system or sniper detection system, it can automatically suppress the coming fire, which before nobody knew where the fire coming from, but that way RCWS will turn to that direction immediately.

 

[Saithan]

i wish they were using hybrid, as its super important these days to hide from thermal cameras.

It may be, but since Land Forces are moving as slow as a snails pace then it's better that we get old conventional stuff than wait a milennium for hybrid vehicles.

Let's see if TSK has the urgency enough to order Hybrid Firtina from MKE and not just a couple, but enough to replace all existing old ones.

 

[boredaf]

It may be, but since Land Forces are moving as slow as a snails pace then it's better that we get old conventional stuff than wait a milennium for hybrid vehicles.

Let's see if TSK has the urgency enough to order Hybrid Firtina from MKE and not just a couple, but enough to replace all existing old ones.

I would settle for TSK to finally pick a new IFV, not even talking about the deliveries or anything, just for them to pick *something*.

 

[AzeriTank]

It may be, but since Land Forces are moving as slow as a snails pace then it's better that we get old conventional stuff than wait a milennium for hybrid vehicles.

Let's see if TSK has the urgency enough to order Hybrid Firtina from MKE and not just a couple, but enough to replace all existing old ones.

I would settle for TSK to finally pick a new IFV, not even talking about the deliveries or anything, just for them to pick *something*.

i only want them to choose hybrid engine IFV or other land products as Thermal signature is a huge disadvantage in todays war. Aselsan is almost there to produce it. they are able to produce it for 20-25 ton class vehicles now, with new E-Firtina, i can go up to 40 ton, which is totally fine i believe. they also work on 6x6 and 8x8 vehicles.

 

[Strong AI]

2 Pars IV 6x6 SOV APCs of the special forces command was present in today's joint Turkish Russian patrol in northern Syria. Special Forces Command uses 12 Pars SOVs for these kinds of missions.

The PARS IV 6x6 Special Operation’s (S-Ops) Vehicle is designed to meet the tactical and operational requirements of military and internal security forces whose mission is “special”.

The vehicle has been specifically designed to carry special operations units to their mission objectives where multiple threats can be in place and provide fire support to the special operation teams in the field. All team members enjoy a high level of electro-optic situational awareness. The vehicle special design provides the driver and personnel located in the front section of the vehicle with maximum direct view situational awareness, of over 180°. The new generation electronic infrastructure provides 360° situational awareness for all team members. Owing to these features, the vehicle can easily be operated under armour at all times keeping hatches closed.

The vehicle is equipped with new generation mission equipment that ensures combat effectiveness, safer route planning, command/control and rapid targeting.

 

[Umigami]

Kaplan MT (Harimau medium tank) did some firing exercise in Borneo jungle.

 

[Umigami]

Kaplan MT (Harimau medium tank) did some firing exercise in Borneo jungle.

More video

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1832967025964314675

 

[Sanchez]

Over the years, we have talked about foreign turrets on AFVs costing a lot and basically being at least half of a unit's cost without figures to back it up.

Here's one.

"The price of the CMI Cockerill® 3105 turret system is as much as 63% of the price of the entire FNSS Kaplan MT/Harimau medium tank."

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1833890931314991435

No wonder all Turkish makers try to build their own turrets now except for small cases like 105 and 120mm.

 

[boredaf]

Over the years, we have talked about foreign turrets on AFVs costing a lot and basically being at least half of a unit's cost without figures to back it up.

Here's one.

"The price of the CMI Cockerill® 3105 turret system is as much as 63% of the price of the entire FNSS Kaplan MT/Harimau medium tank."

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1833890931314991435

No wonder all Turkish makers try to build their own turrets now except for small cases like 105 and 120mm.

I wonder if Kaplan can use Roketsan's 105 mm MZK turret?

 

[somegoodusername]

I wonder if Kaplan can use Roketsan's 105 mm MZK turret?

Open source info says, Cockerill 3105 turrent weights around 4000 kg while MZK turret weights around 13000 kg. So, no.

 

[boredaf]

Open source info says, Cockerill 3105 turrent weights around 4000 kg while MZK turret weights around 13000 kg. So, no.

Fucking hell, I wasn't expecting *that* much difference.

 

[Radonsider]

Fucking hell, I wasn't expecting *that* much difference.

Well cockerill can be penetrated by even AP 12.7 while MZK offers protection against 120/125mm apfsds'

 

[Sanchez]

Well cockerill can be penetrated by even AP 12.7 while MZK offers protection against 120/125mm apfsds'

Hence the difference between a tank turret and an oversized ifv turret. Cockerill products are so average that it hurts. It's a tough job being market leader in average products.

 

[Radonsider]

Hence the difference between a tank turret and an oversized ifv turret. Cockerill products are so average that it hurts. It's a tough job being market leader in average products.

Also it looks bad with that ugly shape and funny name

 

[somegoodusername]

Well cockerill can be penetrated by even AP 12.7 while MZK offers protection against 120/125mm apfsds'

They can have up to STANAG-5 level of protection. Which can protect against 25 mm APDS-T rounds.

 

[Radonsider]

They can have up to STANAG-5 level of protection. Which can protect against 25 mm APDS-T rounds.

From certain areas, yea. But the even the turret face is far from being an uniform one on cockerill

 

[TheInsider]

Open source info says, Cockerill 3105 turrent weights around 4000 kg while MZK turret weights around 13000 kg. So, no.

That is mostly a naked turret with ballistic aluminum armor. Turret with addon armor weighs north of 7000kg depending on the armor and modifications.

 

[TheInsider]

They can have up to STANAG-5 level of protection. Which can protect against 25 mm APDS-T rounds.

No, it is "up to" the STANAG-5 level of protection, and at that level, the turret weighs close to 8000kg still a lot lighter than MZK(MZK provides STANAG level 6 protection though). The base turret(welded armor aluminum) will probably only provide protection against 7.62x51mm AP rounds.

https://www.roketsan.com.tr/uploads/docs/kataloglar/ENG/1674211734_bkm-eng.pdf

John Cockerill Unveils Boxer 8x8 Armored Vehicle with Cockerill 3105 Turret - MilitaryLeak.COM

John Cockerill, formerly Cockerill Maintenance & Ingénierie (CMI) unveils the latest version of 8x8 wheeled fire support vehicle (FSV) based on a Boxer

militaryleak.com

 

[Radonsider]

No, it is "up to" the STANAG-5 level of protection, and at that level, the turret weighs close to 8000kg still a lot lighter than MZK(MZK provides STANAG level 6 protection though). The base turret(welded armor aluminum) will probably only provide protection against 7.62x51mm AP rounds.

https://www.roketsan.com.tr/uploads/docs/kataloglar/ENG/1674211734_bkm-eng.pdf

John Cockerill Unveils Boxer 8x8 Armored Vehicle with Cockerill 3105 Turret - MilitaryLeak.COM

John Cockerill, formerly Cockerill Maintenance & Ingénierie (CMI) unveils the latest version of 8x8 wheeled fire support vehicle (FSV) based on a Boxer

militaryleak.com

MZK's addon armour has STANAG lvl6 rating. Base MZK without addon has armour inserts like any other MBT turret

 

[Saithan]

But why aren't we making something of Cockerills level and trying to reach the same quality. As long as the quality is the same we can work on better products by adhering to higher quality standards.

I know it's not easy, but I hope at least there are dedicated R&D for that. Kaplan MT is imo bloody awesome.