TR Military Operations in Northern Iraq

[Isbara]

If all the equipment is useless in that weather then what can soldiers do? Like if cameras can't see, can they see? If it is an undefensible position then that's the wrong position, plan should be made accordingly and resources should be allocated accordingly. Regardless of the conditions, being caught by surprise is not acceptable. We see all the base protection systems in idefs, why weren't those there? And for instance if our manpower in region is not enough then we should then send a larger force to establish security.

MWR radars, SWIR cameras etc...
There're solutions.

 

[uçuyorum]

MWR radars, SWIR cameras etc...
There're solutions.

Milimeter radars etc. Other types of radars, traps, tripwires, fences..

 

[Avanti]

Martyrs are part of fighting unfortunately. We knew ground operation in these conditions in North Iraq will be very hard but necessary.

If there were unnecessary risks or other mistakes will come out with time

 

[uçuyorum]

Martyrs are part of fighting unfortunately. We knew ground operation in these conditions in North Iraq will be very hard but necessary.

If there were unnecessary risks or other mistakes will come out with time

It should be our absolute priority to ensure that this doesn't happen again. Whatever means that may require.

 

[Tuncay]

It should be our absolute priority to ensure that this doesn't happen again. Whatever means that may require.

We know that will not happen , tommorow we will forget this attack like we forgot the last one . The same base that was ambushed 20 days ago and suffered casualties was the base attacked yesterday, a whole 20 days was still not enough to learn from our mistakes and fortify the place. The cold truth is nobody cares about the soldiers till they lose their life , and that is 1-2 tweets on twitter and some insincere announcments from politicans to be forgotten tommorow.

 

[Kartal1]

If all the equipment is useless in that weather then what can soldiers do? Like if cameras can't see, can they see? If it is an undefensible position then that's the wrong position, plan should be made accordingly and resources should be allocated accordingly. Regardless of the conditions, being caught by surprise is not acceptable. We see all the base protection systems in idefs, why weren't those there? And for instance if our manpower in region is not enough then we should then send a larger force to establish security.

In order to establish the security system of the outpost you need to start early in the spring or early summer. The deployment at Matin and Tatasara happened late.

Also there is another thing. Last winter we were pushed to retreat from Matin and the eastern part of Seri where we gave 1 martyr in the attack before the major attack on Matin. For now Seri is stable, but just for now...

It was said many times by analyzers and myself included that you can not expect a different result when you employ the same means. There was a reason why our forces were commanded to retreat last winter. Alright, you want to change concepts by keeping them there in the winter, but why you send them there in the autumn or early winter when absolutely no effective work can be done on the positions including ensuring even the basic needs of the soldiers like cover from the elements and heating? The long standing positions in the area are there because the logistics were ensured to a grade and appropriate security system was established due to experience (terrorist attacks), analysis and time for work to be done on them.

I am leaving this below the text so it is more visible:

YOU CAN NOT EXPECT DIFFERENT RESULTS WHILE YOU DO THE SAME THING OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AGAIN

This is valid for everything TSK does in the north of Iraq. A dumb organization like PKK manages to adapt, but TSK can not. I can not accept this. EDOK must work 24/7, doing academic researches on these issues, sending representatives in the operation areas if needed and find a solution to this tunnel problem. If it was not for the tunnels, we would've reached Basrah by now...

 

[Scott Summers]

Only solution is to annex Northern Iraq completely, like Israel did with the Golan Heights and Morocco with West Sahara.

Annex it and buid settlements, towns, infrastructure, introduce the Turkish Lira and put armed colonists there like in the West Bank. Than you have 100% control and eyes.

And you can start to turn all those mountains and their caves in highways and autobahns.

 

[CAN_TR]

It seems decision makers in TSK will never learn from mistakes or wrong attempts and come up with new strategies nor will those who made these mistakes ever will be taken into account.

Our soldiers are operating in very lightly defended outposts in the middle of PKK hotspots, Zap probably has the highest terrorist presence and then not taking countermeasures when weather conditions are in favour of the terrorists is resulting in such casualities. These operations started to late, nothing was done in the summer months, the defences are pathetic what they decided now is sitting the winter out (not fully prepared btw.).

 

[Slayer]

Doing the same and expecting a different result is the definition of idiocy.
Turks can be hardheaded and stubborn but damn it. Gordun surekli sehit veriyorsun o bolgede o zaman baska seyler yap.

 

[mehmed beg]

Any of those scumbags dead?

 

[UkroTurk]

I doNot to want to sound like terrorist organization propaganda, but previously the PKK could block highways and check IDs within the borders of Turkey. These are now over, thanks to these cross-border operations. In terms of security, currently Hakkari is not different from other Anatolian cities. Unfortunately, there is a scourge of terrorism and we are suffering martyrs. However, the benefits of these operations cannot be ignored. Military service is difficult. Even in Anatolia, we even have soldiers who freeze to death and become martyrs.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1745918668448440711

Retired General Osman Pamukoğlu: “I am against establishing bases across the border, we have nothing to do with land.

We are looking for the terrorist. We enter, destroy it in 3-4 days and leave.

I entered and exited Iraq 21 times. Why? I don't need to stay there.

There is only one formula in unconventional warfare: Search-find-destroy.

Just like an eagle pursuing its prey, you will soar and take it in an instant. You won't settle there.

The USA suffered 56 thousand deaths by raiding its bases in Vietnam.

Base means you are fixed, you are being watched, you are being followed.

If you have a base, you will be attacked when you are weak.”

 

[MhhJA]

I don't think anybody denies the success of the operations in northern Iraq and the benefits it brought to our territory and that operations have to continue. Our problem is how we suffered that many casualties in so short time with the attacks being very similar.

 

[Sanchez]

I doNot to want to sound like terrorist organization propaganda, but previously the PKK could block highways and check IDs within the borders of Turkey. These are now over, thanks to these cross-border operations. In terms of security, currently Hakkari is not different from other Anatolian cities. Unfortunately, there is a scourge of terrorism and we are suffering martyrs. However, the benefits of these operations cannot be ignored. Military service is difficult. Even in Anatolia, we even have soldiers who freeze to death and become martyrs.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1745918668448440711

Retired General Osman Pamukoğlu: “I am against establishing bases across the border, we have nothing to do with land.

We are looking for the terrorist. We enter, destroy it in 3-4 days and leave.

I entered and exited Iraq 21 times. Why? I don't need to stay there.

There is only one formula in unconventional warfare: Search-find-destroy.

Just like an eagle pursuing its prey, you will soar and take it in an instant. You won't settle there.

The USA suffered 56 thousand deaths by raiding its bases in Vietnam.

Base means you are fixed, you are being watched, you are being followed.

If you have a base, you will be attacked when you are weak.”

Much changed since 90s and most of of the retired generals either cannot see it or doesn't want to accept it. PKK employ hundreds of kilometers of tunnels inside mountains now. You can't enter, kill and exit from those places. You can't control what goes in and comes out of tunnels unless you're there. If you can't control tunnel entrances, those in the tunnels make their way into Turkey.

 

[what]

If we look at the facts, i.e. attacks in Turkey, our losses, civilians losses etc its is undeniable that those operations in Iraq and FOB in Iraq were very successful.

The question is what has been recently going wrong in the leadership.

 

[CAN_TR]

Retired General Osman Pamukoğlu: “I am against establishing bases across the border, we have nothing to do with land.

We are looking for the terrorist. We enter, destroy it in 3-4 days and leave.

I entered and exited Iraq 21 times. Why? I don't need to stay there.

There is only one formula in unconventional warfare: Search-find-destroy.

Just like an eagle pursuing its prey, you will soar and take it in an instant. You won't settle there.

The USA suffered 56 thousand deaths by raiding its bases in Vietnam.

Base means you are fixed, you are being watched, you are being followed.

If you have a base, you will be attacked when you are weak.”

PKK also changed it's doctrine back in the days they didn't had such tunnel/cave systems they retreated to Kandil before winter came.

Now they have permanent presence in the mountains and the only way to clean them is to move into the tunnels which are build in way where you can't move straight, easy to defend for the terrorists and they even carved additional rooms extra to minimize the impact of explosions. They usually are always build close to villages which provides them with supplies... long story short they can stay in the tunnels for months.

You either have to move inside clean sections and then destroy it with explosives or you have a huge ass bomb that's so powerful that kills anyone inside.

 

[uçuyorum]

PKK also changed it's doctrine back in the days they didn't had such tunnel/cave systems they retreated to Kandil before winter came.

Now they have permanent presence in the mountains and the only way to clean them is to move into the tunnels which are build in way where you can't move straight, easy to defend for the terrorists and they even carved additional rooms extra to minimize the impact of explosions. They usually are always build close to villages which provides them with supplies... long story short they can stay in the tunnels for months.

You either have to move inside clean sections and then destroy it with explosives or you have a huge ass bomb that's so powerful that kills anyone inside.

Is US training them based on their experiences of vietnam? Oh boy

 

[BalkanTurk90]

I doNot to want to sound like terrorist organization propaganda, but previously the PKK could block highways and check IDs within the borders of Turkey. These are now over, thanks to these cross-border operations. In terms of security, currently Hakkari is not different from other Anatolian cities. Unfortunately, there is a scourge of terrorism and we are suffering martyrs. However, the benefits of these operations cannot be ignored. Military service is difficult. Even in Anatolia, we even have soldiers who freeze to death and become martyrs.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1745918668448440711

Retired General Osman Pamukoğlu: “I am against establishing bases across the border, we have nothing to do with land.

We are looking for the terrorist. We enter, destroy it in 3-4 days and leave.

I entered and exited Iraq 21 times. Why? I don't need to stay there.

There is only one formula in unconventional warfare: Search-find-destroy.

Just like an eagle pursuing its prey, you will soar and take it in an instant. You won't settle there.

The USA suffered 56 thousand deaths by raiding its bases in Vietnam.

Base means you are fixed, you are being watched, you are being followed.

If you have a base, you will be attacked when you are weak.”

No he is wrong its complete the opposite , to full control one land u need soldiers foots on that land and bases . He tell about old military bases but if Turkiye build modern bases with IR camera , Motion detection , Control weapons stations, drone supressiom etc etc , Those terrorist rats will never come too closse at that military base.

 

[Kartal1]

"in all terrain conditions and weather conditions"

So, is this a lie, or does TSK not use it?

They are in use, but they are not impossible to bypass. Also they don't work 24/7 and sometimes there can be blind spots depending on the terrain.

 

[Bozan]

Urbanisation? Really? Armenians, Greeks, Asyrians and others had all of that, it turned out for them as it did. Eventually something similar will happen to the Kurds . Not on such scale but what I am sure that the thing that they want will not happen.
This is not 40 years old , it is 150 160 years old problem. Not much in the root of thing changed.
To build a public toilet in some mountain village? That will solve the issue? Hahaha. By the way in the context of history, regular and recorded conflicts happen there for the last 5000 years. Afterall, Anatolia is nor Scandinavia where mostly nothing really happens, like forever.

Why do you think TSK are building so many roads ? It's not just for bases.

 

[mehmed beg]

Why do you think TSK are building so many roads ? It's not just for bases.

I don't think anything nor your question is related to what I wrote.
Anyway, I won't state directly what I think but few days ago , for God knows how many times, some Israeli guy yet again claimed Turkish territory . Also , he expressed the ambition that the Kurds be their tampon zone. We say in my country, what the clever one keeps in his chest, the stupid discloses.
For me war in Syria, primarily is war against Turkey. Seemingly all other " warring" parties live in the best possible enmity.
All those problems came about by creating the nations out of ethno groups. The promises were given a long ago and even if a fortune is given to certain parties it won't charge a thing.
The Armenians 1914 held 85% of all deposits in Van Banks , yet in June 1915 there were only 1500 Muslims left.
I tend to look at the habits, culture, mentality, folklor of given nations. In the Kurds, I see a lot what Armenians were and are Kurdish now ( not completely).
I see nowadays that for example that Asyrians want pretty large state ( haha since 607 BC) , Yezidis think that they are 6000 old separate entity Armenians think what always they have been thinking, . Kurds are extraordinary though. Black Sea , The Gulf, Kaspyan sea and Mediterranean sea are the borders of that ancient people, who don't even have the common language nor geography.
Well that kind of psychosis I saw in Balkans but now anywhere.
This war will last for a long, the only way to finish it is , if strong Sunni Arab entity arises and strong Sunni religious Kurds increas in numbers. Until such thing happens, the best direction for Turkey is to strengthen the relationship with people who are loyal to Turkey. Central Asia, Caucasus and Balkans.
I myself, given the opportunity, wouldn't hesitate for second to pick my stuff and go to fight in those tunnels.
I said it before, something like Tashkilat or Legion is needed.
The rest are just the enemies. They were 100 years ago , 50 years ago, now and in future.
I am well aware who are the Saudis, Iranians, Russians ,Isrealis, Americans , I am not a kid. For the compelled one is to ride bad horses. It is like that not since 1979 but somtime around 1840.
In UK , the Iraqi Kurds who are devoted are not the enemies of Turkey. For those people only is worth to build something. The res of them , F them