India Army Small Arms

[Indian gir lion]

@Ryder
We also developed a 6.8 mm rifle for the army
But army changes its requirement frequently

 

[Indian gir lion]

Excalibure rifle

 

[Indian gir lion]

Its not these rifles which are not inducted by army go to waste
India internal security forces have a strength of half a million .
Like CRPF , BSF , CIPF etc
Along with various state forces ,for their general duty along their special operations forces

 

[trishna_amrta]

He goes into the noticeable bad choices (even though Russia had capacity to go differently) in this video fairly well:

@RhythmoftheRain0601 @MisterLike @trishna_amrta @Exorcist @Hexciter et al.

Some of same issues will definitely plague the Ak-203 production series India is going for too (hence why I bring to this thread).

Regarding the video, I highly praise that guy for having a museum grade item (any AK47) in his collection

Anyway, in my experience, any tool (or gun) is only as good (or as bad) as the skill of the bipedal monkey who wield them. It doesn't matter whether it is a kitchen knife, an auto vehicle, or anything far more complex, it's always came down to the human factor.
Although, I was trained & qualified in AKM (among other platform as well), I wasn't trained and doesn't have the experience of using other rifle such as AK-74, so I'm unable to give any operational opinion of them.

If I were to play gorilla and given a choice to choose my choice of rifle between AKM any AR-15 platform, I will choose the AKM without a second thought.
Bottom line, In real world combat, nobodies care about the politic agenda, or how things will perform in some video game. What we truly care is whether our tool will work as reliable and as dependable as how we were trained for it!

 

[Nilgiri]

Made in India with lots of corruption. Really sucks i give India points for trying. Too bad it led to more of buying kalashnikovs and sigs.

Would love to see new designs from different countries. Sucks how the first domestic production got shit rep because of corruption and cost cutting. Then you have logistics.

Then again you cant go wrong with SIG stuff. Sometimes its best to just swallow your pride and go buy some awesome shit that works.

Sucks how all that money just went. I think India will no doubt make an awesome standard rifle one day.

It has, SSS defence et al (I posted a bit earlier)

Private companies have all the answers.....they just need a chance at large order + production.

 

[Nilgiri]

Regarding the video, I highly praise that guy for having a museum grade item (any AK47) in his collection

Anyway, in my experience, any tool (or gun) is only as good (or as bad) as the skill of the bipedal monkey who wield them. It doesn't matter whether it is a kitchen knife, an auto vehicle, or anything far more complex, it's always came down to the human factor.
Although, I was trained & qualified in AKM (among other platform as well), I wasn't trained and doesn't have the experience of using other rifle such as AK-74, so I'm unable to give any operational opinion of them.

If I were to play gorilla and given a choice to choose my choice of rifle between AKM any AR-15 platform, I will choose the AKM without a second thought.
Bottom line, In real world combat, nobodies care about the politic agenda, or how things will perform in some video game. What we truly care is whether our tool will work as reliable and as dependable as how we were trained for it!

AKM certainly is a venerable platform....I have no major issue with it, it did the job for its time ridiculously well at its cost.

You are correct that training on the rifle counts for so much too.

 

[Gessler]

SSS Defence's own take on the AR-15 platform:

Seen here fitted with Vortex Optics UH-1 holosight & a Tonbo Imaging EK thermal imager combo

 

[fire starter]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1531538469054472193

 

[Nilgiri]

Swedish defence firm Saab plans to manufacture Carl-Gustaf M4 weapon in India

The M4 weapon system is capable of firing a variety of ammunition, including anti armour and illumination rounds, with the maximum range being 1,500 metre

www.hindustantimes.com

Swedish defence firm Saab plans to manufacture Carl-Gustaf M4 weapon in India

The M4 weapon system is capable of firing a variety of ammunition, including anti armour and illumination rounds, with the maximum range being 1,500 metre​

The Carl-Gustaf M4 weapon. (SAAB)


Swedish defence firm Saab on Tuesday announced its plan to set up a manufacturing facility in India for the Carl-Gustaf M4 shoulder-fired weapon system under the NDA government’s ‘Make in India’ initiative to bolster indigenous defence manufacturing, a company official said.

Production at the new facility is expected to begin in 2024, even though the firm is yet to reveal the location. A new company, Saab FFV India, will make the latest rocket launchers in India for the Indian armed forces, along with components for users of the weapon system around the world, the company said.

The facility will be the firm’s first manufacturing facility for the Carl-Gustaf M4 weapon system outside Sweden. Saab is currently in talks with the army to take the proposal forward. The Carl-Gustaf weapon system has been in service with the Indian Army since 1976, and its earlier M2 and M3 variants have been licence-produced in India.

It is a natural step to set up a production facility for Carl-Gustaf M4 in India given Saab’s long and close association with the Indian Army as one of the foremost users of the system, Saab’s dynamics-business chief Gorgen Johansson said.

“We are glad to be able to contribute to the [Indian] government’s goals of developing a world class defence industry and proud to offer the Indian armed forces our Carl-Gustaf M4 made in India,” he added.

The company is looking at the 100% foreign direct investment (FDI) route to set up the new venture, but will pursue the 74% FDI option with an Indian partner if the former doesn’t work out. India allows 100% FDI in defence only on a case-by-case basis.

The Narendra Modi-led central government has taken several steps in recent years to promote self-reliance in the defence manufacturing sector, including increasing FDI from 49% to 74%, notifying three lists of 310 weapons and systems that cannot be imported, and creating a separate budget to buy locally made military hardware.


“The Carl-Gustaf is a proven weapon system which the army has used for decades. The setting up of a local manufacturing facility for the M4 variant by Saab is in line with the Make in India initiative. We need more original equipment manufacturers to set up manufacturing facilities in India. It will provide a boost to the Atmanirbhar Bharat (self-reliant India) campaign,” said military affairs expert Lieutenant General Vinod Bhatia (retd).

The M4 weapon system is capable of firing a variety of ammunition, including anti armour and illumination rounds, with the maximum range being 1,500 metre.

Saab will partner with Indian suppliers, and the systems manufactured in the facility will fully meet the requirements of the Make in India initiative, company officials said. Saab FFV India will deploy complex technologies, including the latest sighting technology and advanced manufacturing techniques, for the Carl-Gustaf M4 weapon.

The Swedish firm said it will continue its partnership with Munitions India Limited and Advanced Weapons and Equipment India Limited, two of the seven firms carved out of the erstwhile Ordnance Factory Board, to manufacture the earlier M3 variant of the Carl-Gustaf weapon and ammunition.

 

[Hari Sud]

Swedish defence firm Saab plans to manufacture Carl-Gustaf M4 weapon in India

The M4 weapon system is capable of firing a variety of ammunition, including anti armour and illumination rounds, with the maximum range being 1,500 metre

www.hindustantimes.com

Swedish defence firm Saab plans to manufacture Carl-Gustaf M4 weapon in India

The M4 weapon system is capable of firing a variety of ammunition, including anti armour and illumination rounds, with the maximum range being 1,500 metre​

The Carl-Gustaf M4 weapon. (SAAB)


Swedish defence firm Saab on Tuesday announced its plan to set up a manufacturing facility in India for the Carl-Gustaf M4 shoulder-fired weapon system under the NDA government’s ‘Make in India’ initiative to bolster indigenous defence manufacturing, a company official said.

Production at the new facility is expected to begin in 2024, even though the firm is yet to reveal the location. A new company, Saab FFV India, will make the latest rocket launchers in India for the Indian armed forces, along with components for users of the weapon system around the world, the company said.

The facility will be the firm’s first manufacturing facility for the Carl-Gustaf M4 weapon system outside Sweden. Saab is currently in talks with the army to take the proposal forward. The Carl-Gustaf weapon system has been in service with the Indian Army since 1976, and its earlier M2 and M3 variants have been licence-produced in India.

It is a natural step to set up a production facility for Carl-Gustaf M4 in India given Saab’s long and close association with the Indian Army as one of the foremost users of the system, Saab’s dynamics-business chief Gorgen Johansson said.

“We are glad to be able to contribute to the [Indian] government’s goals of developing a world class defence industry and proud to offer the Indian armed forces our Carl-Gustaf M4 made in India,” he added.

The company is looking at the 100% foreign direct investment (FDI) route to set up the new venture, but will pursue the 74% FDI option with an Indian partner if the former doesn’t work out. India allows 100% FDI in defence only on a case-by-case basis.

The Narendra Modi-led central government has taken several steps in recent years to promote self-reliance in the defence manufacturing sector, including increasing FDI from 49% to 74%, notifying three lists of 310 weapons and systems that cannot be imported, and creating a separate budget to buy locally made military hardware.


“The Carl-Gustaf is a proven weapon system which the army has used for decades. The setting up of a local manufacturing facility for the M4 variant by Saab is in line with the Make in India initiative. We need more original equipment manufacturers to set up manufacturing facilities in India. It will provide a boost to the Atmanirbhar Bharat (self-reliant India) campaign,” said military affairs expert Lieutenant General Vinod Bhatia (retd).

The M4 weapon system is capable of firing a variety of ammunition, including anti armour and illumination rounds, with the maximum range being 1,500 metre.

Saab will partner with Indian suppliers, and the systems manufactured in the facility will fully meet the requirements of the Make in India initiative, company officials said. Saab FFV India will deploy complex technologies, including the latest sighting technology and advanced manufacturing techniques, for the Carl-Gustaf M4 weapon.

The Swedish firm said it will continue its partnership with Munitions India Limited and Advanced Weapons and Equipment India Limited, two of the seven firms carved out of the erstwhile Ordnance Factory Board, to manufacture the earlier M3 variant of the Carl-Gustaf weapon and ammunition.

It is widely used. As a squad level weapon, it packs a huge punch. It is light weight but a bit unwieldy to carry. That inconvenience is overcome by huge damage it does to the enemy.

 

[Nilgiri]

Army instead went with a buttload of AK's @Zapper @Paro et al.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1582257927456333824

 

[Zapper]

Army instead went with a buttload of AK's @Zapper @Paro et al.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1582257927456333824

The AK-203 deal has been delayed.

Ukraine crisis delays Ak-203 assault rifle deal with Russia​

https://www.thehindu.com/news/natio...lt-rifle-deal-with-russia/article65221831.ece


On the brighter side, Para SF was seen testing SSS Defence's M72 carbines

 

[Nilgiri]

The AK-203 deal has been delayed.

Ukraine crisis delays Ak-203 assault rifle deal with Russia​

https://www.thehindu.com/news/natio...lt-rifle-deal-with-russia/article65221831.ece


On the brighter side, Para SF was seen testing SSS Defence's M72 carbines

View attachment 49096

Yeah but looks like AK production starts later this year:

Production of AK-203 rifles to begin in India by year end: Russian official

Rosoboronexport is Russia's state-run defence entity that oversees various key military projects, including those in foreign countries.

indianexpress.com

This is all stuff that should have gone to SSS....they need a huge order from IA....not just a few spec ops.

 

[Zapper]

Yeah but looks like AK production starts later this year:

Production of AK-203 rifles to begin in India by year end: Russian official

Rosoboronexport is Russia's state-run defence entity that oversees various key military projects, including those in foreign countries.

indianexpress.com

This is all stuff that should have gone to SSS....they need a huge order from IA....not just a few spec ops.

It isn't uncommon for Russian officials or certain media outlets to make statements or produce articles like these. Back during MMRCA 2.0, there were tons of news articles citing IAF was favoring jets based on who paid these media houses from Gripen to F-16 to Russian offerings. The Caracal Car-816 carbine deal was also similar and they were also present in DefExpo-22 partnering with some local firm but that's unlikely to happen. The recently inducted Sig-716s were also found to have a lot of technical issues resulting in IA cancelling the follow-on orders

SSS had their weapons tested with NSG trying out their snipers while Para-SF for Carbines. It'd be a good start if they're able to sell to SOF units which'll eventually make IA to consider em for regular troops.

 

[Nilgiri]

It isn't uncommon for Russian officials or certain media outlets to make statements or produce articles like these. Back during MMRCA 2.0, there were tons of news articles citing IAF was favoring jets based on who paid these media houses from Gripen to F-16 to Russian offerings. The Caracal Car-816 carbine deal was also similar and they were also present in DefExpo-22 partnering with some local firm but that's unlikely to happen. The recently inducted Sig-716s were also found to have a lot of technical issues resulting in IA cancelling the follow-on orders

SSS had their weapons tested with NSG trying out their snipers while Para-SF for Carbines. It'd be a good start if they're able to sell to SOF units which'll eventually make IA to consider em for regular troops.

Bro, its a whole factory though and large scale commitment, its going to kick in at some point:

During the Defence Expo 2020 in Lucknow, Major General Sengar announced that the IRRPL facility in Amethi would produce ~ 75,000 AK-203 annually for 10 years.

It was announced that 670,000 AK-203 rifles will be produced for the Indian military

 

[Nilgiri]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1582963921199063041

 

[Zapper]

Bro, its a whole factory though and large scale commitment, its going to kick in at some point:

During the Defence Expo 2020 in Lucknow, Major General Sengar announced that the IRRPL facility in Amethi would produce ~ 75,000 AK-203 annually for 10 years.

It was announced that 670,000 AK-203 rifles will be produced for the Indian military

I remember seeing some pictures of the factory's exterior and it just looked like an old govt building. I doubt if they have the right equipment, fixtures etc to start production

As for someone stating back in 2020, a lot has changed. Just like the Caracal deal, wouldn't be surprised if the AK-203 deal gets cancelled except for Yogi's insistence but I really hope it does

 

[Nilgiri]

I remember seeing some pictures of the factory's exterior and it just looked like an old govt building. I doubt if they have the right equipment, fixtures etc to start production

As for someone stating back in 2020, a lot has changed. Just like the Caracal deal, wouldn't be surprised if the AK-203 deal gets cancelled except for Yogi's insistence but I really hope it does

If machinery is transferred and workers have been trained on it....seems like its a go.

Anyway year-end is not far away, lets see.

 

[Zapper]

SSS Defence wins contract to supply 5.56x45mm NATO ammunition (20,00,000 rounds) to the Nepalese Army

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1584389044305162241

 

[Nilgiri]

@Milspec , @Zapper , @Gessler , @Paro , @Rajendra Chola et al.

I wish this young man and his team (and all those like them) all the best.