India Special Forces

[hellfire2006]

@Afif

NSG - Reports to Ministry of Home Affairs and is the premier CT unit for urban ops

Not an SF unit. Only 51 SAG can lay claim to that

MARCOS - Indian Navy

Definitely, they're the best.

SG (Special Group) & SFF (Special Frontier Force) - They both are under RAW but not much is known is public domain

SFF is not tier 1. It's trained along the same lines as airborne elite infantry units.

Para SF - They have the most operational experience but have been diluted recently when corrupt and egoistic army brass decided to convert all Para airborne units into SF. Para SF along with RR (Rashtriya Rifles) undertake most CI ops in the Kashmir valley. They're the most used among all SOF units but are also the least or poorly equipped with no clear mandate as to what their responsibilities are

Except a few battalions (9,10,21,4,1, 2) rest of para SF is just glorified airborne infantry

AFSOD - Still in the works. A tri-service SOF unit being modeled on the lines of JSOC

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IAF Garuds - They're jokingly known as instagram SF since they're only good at posing. During Pathankot attack, NSG had to be deployed to counter the threat despite Garuds being permanently deployed on the base.

Deploying NSG was a political move. Not an operational decision. Besides there were only something like 20 or so Garuds in the entire Airbase. They took care of 3 of the 5 terrorists. They should get far more credit than what they got.

They're more like glorified security guards for airbases but I hope one day they learn how MARCOS are modeling themselves after the SEALS and end up being the primary CSAR unit

Garud isn't a glorified base security force. They're actively involved in CI ops. You shouldn't underestimate them.

 

[hellfire2006]

No tri service organization like Marines?

Marines is not an SF unit. They're a full fledged armed force with their own combat and combat support arms. In USA, the SOCOM is responsible for control over the tri service SFs which are the green berets , SEALS , Marine recon and Marine raiders. While the respective services have a good degree of control over these units. The operations of true tier 1 forces like Delta ( 1st SFOD) and DEVGRU( seal team six)are exclusively directed by the SOCOM which is very centralised.
India is creating the AFSOD along the same lines under HQ IDS

 

[hellfire2006]

View attachment 63572
So marcos most likely will ditch UCP for multicam.

This pic makes me so happy that I am gonna cry my eyes out
Wish Para could learn something from MARCOS and their procurement policy

 

[Zapper]

There are talks about them testing out iWI ace would have been better if it was the arad

There were reports of several guns being considered or tested like Galil, SCAR, HK-416, M4 etc but none have been procured, let alone being standardized except for the Tavors. I've seen some M4s' with the Paras though

Not an SF unit. Only 51 SAG can lay claim to that

Well 51 SAG is part of NSG and that's what GoI intends to go with during a crisis. Now with the establishment of regional hubs, we'd have to see if SCG will actively take up ops like SAG or take a backstage role like the SRG by cordoning off the area and wait for SAG which would be sorta pointless and defeats the whole purpose of regional hubs

Except a few battalions (9,10,21,4,1, 2) rest of para SF is just glorified airborne infantry

These units were the original SF prior to dilution. Paras are now probably a tad bit better than RR with their operational style always being closer to a commando rather than a true SOF unit. It would be a disgrace comparing them western SOF or even Marcos/NSG for that matter

Deploying NSG was a political move. Not an operational decision. Besides there were only something like 20 or so Garuds in the entire Airbase. They took care of 3 of the 5 terrorists. They should get far more credit than what they got.

Care to elaborate why this was a political move?

I might be wrong but I recall one killed by DSC while the others were gunned down by NSG. The Garuds only prevented terrorists from entering the hangers and destroying aircrafts. I also don't understand the point of only 20 Garuds stationed at an airbase on the frontlines when they know they're no way sufficient given the area

Garud isn't a glorified base security force. They're actively involved in CI ops. You shouldn't underestimate them.

They are yet to find their operational relevance. Secondly, look at their stance and operational tactics during training exercises which kinda look amateurish

 

[Zapper]

green berets , SEALS , Marine recon and Marine raiders

View attachment 63607

 

[Zapper]

MARCOS

 

[Zapper]

MARCOS

 

[Afif]

Pictures are cool but i was wondering if there are publicly available info on MARCOS training courses. For example, books, official documents, etc.

 

[Zapper]

Pictures are cool but i was wondering if there are publicly available info on MARCOS training courses. For example, books, official documents, etc.

I'm not aware of any books and don't see ex-MARCOS give interviews like the Paras. I got the below info from another forum

MARCOs guys use the suck up factor simialr to SEALs, mud crawls, running with logs, boats, swimming and surf torture etc to let them suck, then teach them SOPs. The goal of BUD/S is make it suck and SQTs build them up. Total would be 12 months long

2/3 weeks -Build up phase (similar to BUD/S indoc & CD Aptitude) after which the selection phases start


Phase 1 Combat Diving Phase 10 weeks - (Similar to CD training and BUD/S Dive Phase)
Phase 2 Land & Amphibious Phase 10 weeks - (Combo of BUD/S 1st and 3rd Phase)
Phase 3 Basic infantry training, Special Weapons & Tactics 10-12 weeks - ( includes 3 weeks of Static Line Parachuting in Agra & blue waters, Jungle warfare, survival course, 4 weeks counter terrorism training (mainly ship and oil rig takedown), basic driving, operating a 2 man chariot, escape and evasion), Egress and ingress from Subs

After that, those who want to do sniping, go there, MARCOs no longer do CIJW I guess, HAWS yes (prior to Kashmir deployment - part of their pre-deployment workup) and HAHO/HALO yes later on only those who want to or those who do the SDV course)

A week before their graduation, they have to not only perform well in full mission profiles (on land) but also have a water jump qualification. NSWTTC along with Navy parachuting camp being in Goa and, the Navy skydiving team is at Vizag INS Dega

 

[-=virus=-]

Except a few battalions (9,10,21,4,1, 2) rest of para SF is just glorified airborne infantry

7

 

[hellfire2006]

Well 51 SAG is part of NSG and that's what GoI intends to go with during a crisis. Now with the establishment of regional hubs, we'd have to see if SCG will actively take up ops like SAG or take a backstage role like the SRG by cordoning off the area and wait for SAG which would be sorta pointless and defeats the whole purpose of regional hubs

SCG seems to be in line with the requirements of the force. Having elements of the CAPF to enforce a cordon and the army to execute the ops. But I Don't know how effective command and control will be in a unit based purely on deputation from two different forces. Do NSG officers have disciplinary powers over their juniors from other forces ? I have personally witnessed breakdown of chain of command in units having army and civil forces in equal proportion. Not gonna get into the detail about it but the silver lining is that unless SCG officers will have disciplinary powers over their juniors we can't expect it to perform it's role smoothly.

Care to elaborate why this was a political move?

Air force and army have a lot of internal politics and rivalries. One should seriously ask the station commander why he didn't ask for support from HQ 29 inf division which had multiple Quick reaction teams under it's control to deal with similar contingencies. QRT is more than capable of dealing with such situations. An infantry battalion could have been deployed to cordon off the entire base but the air force instead took the risk of relying on inadequate numbers of Garuds and a few DSC personnel ( who lost their edge many years ago in active service).
NSG wasn't the best choice for the operation and suffered many avoidable casualties ( like the Bobby trapped grenade ) something which the NSG hadn't dealt with before but the army has and that would have certainly been reflected had the operation been handed over to QRT. Finally after 48 hours of continuous fighting when they realised that they couldn't hold the cordon effectively they asked for help from the army which deployed a company to reinforce the cordon. Just imagine that they waited for 48 hours ! The operation was a disaster by all reasonable accounts.

 

[hellfire2006]

7

7 was airborne infantry until last year.

 

[Zapper]

Vajra Prahar 2023: IA's Para SF and 1st Special Forces Group (SFG) of US SOF

Sako TRG 42 and Barett m95

 

[Zapper]

IN's MARCOs & SEALs

 

[Zapper]

 

[Marlii]

Para with quad NVGs. Boys with eagle eyes in Indian defence forum spotted this

 

[Zapper]

View attachment 63754
Para with quad NVGs. Boys with eagle eyes in Indian defence forum spotted this

They must've procured <10 nos. It almost seems like Para SF hates standardization

 

[Marlii]

They must've procured <10 nos. It almost seems like Para SF hates standardization

The pic is from a tweet from the army about equipment that is being inducted. But there are strong rumors that some noticable equipment update has been going on for some para SF units. Armasen tactical recently confirmed that. But in the end dumping the tavour rifle for some AR15 should be the first move.

 

[Marlii]

Armasen platecarrier, battlebelt and mag dump pouch

 

[Marlii]