TR Air-Force TF-X KAAN Fighter Jet

[Yasar_TR]

So,you believe this(highlighted part) is not a veto right?
I'm sure you know how Japan works,right?
Which ever project they joined finished properly?
And what's the difference between France Germany and Japan in these kinds of projects?

I had edited and added at the bottom the answer to you question in the previous post.

 

[TR_123456]

Also remember UK needs cash to carry on with the project.

Yes but what use is the money when you cant sell as many as you need to cover the costs?
It could take years before the Japanese parliament decides anything if it wants to delay or ''refuse'' sales?
What i am saying is that sales to only Western countries wont cover the projects costs and Japan cannot be trusted in such projects.

 

[UNKONNW]

China is not interested in sharing their tech they could consider selling it but that would create a lot of problems for Egypt with the US.

They might or might not.

The head of the Alexandria Naval Shipyard Company said in a meeting December 2024 that by March 2025, the first Egyptian design naval unit will be completed, but he did not mention details about it. Most likely it's going to be a Corvette.





Photos of the military academy(2023), and they are working with Egyptian universities.

 

[AlperTunga]

If FCAS fails, I see 2 projects that could interest Germany - KAAN and AMCA. AMCA looks to offer more to Germany than KAAN, I think. However, the prospect of trying to get anything done in conjunction with India may render cooperation with India a non-starter.

Germany will never join KAAN project. You need to know how they view Türkiye. They think whatever we do is inferior, so they will only buy some munition from us. Crazy even to think about it!

I wish so much that KAAN is successful but we need to realize nothing is proven yet. And even the success of Bayraktar TB2 was of short duration. We have a lot on paper and prototype but no evidence they work in real life. This is how they see it.

 

[Huelague]

Only money, nothing else and if Indiana doesn't have confidence in Russians , people who can actually design and produce the planes and and engines, then why would they risk it with the nation formerly known as Germans?
Germans can only fulfill their usual task and that's is thrown the spanners into someones else business.
Or maybe they can join with Israel, because I am hearing these days that Israel has an ambition to be independent technology from USA???

No.

 

[Huelague]

Germany will never join KAAN project. You need to know how they view Türkiye. They think whatever we do is inferior, so they will only buy some munition from us. Crazy even to think about it!

I wish so much that KAAN is successful but we need to realize nothing is proven yet. And even the success of Bayraktar TB2 was of short duration. We have a lot on paper and prototype but no evidence they work in real life. This is how they see it.

You think that Germany has “Combat Proven” systems? Until yesterday, it was not allow to sell into conflict regions or countries who are at war. Superior behavior or not, they look very closely to our defense industry and systems. They are very aware what we can and what we can not.

 

[mehmed beg]

Well as I said a couple hours ago, seemingly Indian Air Force gave a go ahead for the purchase or whatever of 114 Rafales for 30bn Euros, so if it is the case, they will add 7 or 8bn to Safran for TOT od AMCA engine.
So Germana can do d all in that case. As of British led project, Britain would never let them to join as any serious partner. It took Britain years to persuade these jokers to sell Typhoons to Turkiye and some upgrades and spares to Saudi. Who wants to spend 20 odd billions that some bum from IG Metal can bust their balls?
As of KAANs to Egypt? Who cares about that? Let them buy J35 . Saudis? Joining British led programme? Let them. What they expect to get from that? The production of few parts, maintenance etc
If Turkey manages to make proper engines, I am sure that at least some of invested money can be recouped. In any case Saudi and Egypt are true enemies of Turkiye.

 

[AlperTunga]

You think that Germany has “Combat Proven” systems? Until yesterday, it was not allow to sell into conflict regions or countries who are at war. Superior behavior or not, they look very closely to our defense industry and systems. They are very aware what we can and what we can not.

Germany is the pinnacle of engineering. If they want they can do it. French and british technology are inferior to Germany. Dont forget we are still not capable of building AIP submarines or Leo tanks. Are we capable of building a car like mercedes including its engines?

 

[Yasar_TR]

Germany is the pinnacle of engineering. If they want they can do it. French and british technology are inferior to Germany. Dont forget we are still not capable of building AIP submarines or Leo tanks. Are we capable of building a car like mercedes including its engines?

Iris-T missile systems that consist of air to air, surface to air are built by mainly German technology behind it. Namely DIEHL defence Systems.
Rheinmetal for artillery systems,
MTU /RR engines for marine use and heavy armoured vehicles,
MTU aero engines (derived from old BMW aero engines) that part produces EJ200 engines for Typhoon jets with RR help. but they are the people that first developed Blisk technology for compressor blades used first in ej200 engines,
Mbda Germany for missile systems,
Airbus Germany building Typhoon jets,
Leopard tanks,
AIP submarines,
RAM point defence systems’ missile production,
Naval ships

Are just some of the top end German military achievements. Almost all of the above are combat proven in one way or another.

But in aerospace they are behind both France and UK . However can catch up quickly if given the chance.

 

[Huelague]

Germany is the pinnacle of engineering. If they want they can do it. French and british technology are inferior to Germany. Dont forget we are still not capable of building AIP submarines or Leo tanks. Are we capable of building a car like mercedes including its engines?

Nobody denies that, but Germanys advantage was not only the technology ledge, it was the practical experience in the wars. Now, they don’t see the defense industry as a necessity. They see it as a business. Accordingly that is the quality. Listen to the ones who talk about German systems. Ukraine for one example. They are anything else than satisfied.

 

[Fuzuli NL]

Iris-T missile systems that consist of air to air, surface to air are built by mainly German technology behind it. Namely DIEHL defence Systems.
Rheinmetal for artillery systems,
MTU /RR engines for marine use and heavy armoured vehicles,
MTU aero engines (derived from old BMW aero engines) that part produces EJ200 engines for Typhoon jets with RR help. but they are the people that first developed Blisk technology for compressor blades used first in ej200 engines,
Mbda Germany for missile systems,
Airbus Germany building Typhoon jets,
Leopard tanks,
AIP submarines,
RAM point defence systems’ missile production,
Naval ships

Are just some of the top end German military achievements. Almost all of the above are combat proven in one way or another.

But in aerospace they are behind both France and UK . However can catch up quickly if given the chance.

There's no doubt about Germany's military industrial rank and achievements, however, knowing them, it will be delays after delays either deliberate or because of extensive red tape. So my opinion is to refuse even if Germany wanted in.

 

[Strong AI]

Germany is the pinnacle of engineering. If they want they can do it. French and british technology are inferior to Germany.

https://militarywatchmagazine.com/article/ukraine-stops-german-drones-performance

The Ukrainian Armed Forces suspended procurements of German HX-2 strike drones in late 2025, after their performances were found to be well below required standards. According an internal presentation prepared by the German Defence Ministry in November, aircraft had trouble even taking off, with only a quarter of them being able to launch. Even if able to get airborne, the aircraft were found to be highly vulnerable to Russian electronic warfare, leading their operators to lose connection. Artificial intelligence components intended to allow the aircraft to continue their missions when cut off were notably missing, which seriously limited autonomy. Ukraine’s procurements were financed by German government aid, raising questions regarding how funding previously intended for HX-2 procurements will now be reallocated.

The poor performance of the HX-2 led Kiev to halt orders, which were funded by the German government, according to Bloomberg. The aircraft’s predecessor HF-1 had previously also faced criticism for being expensive and ineffective, with the HX-2 having been expected to improve on its shortcomings. Single use attack drones have played a particularly central role in the ongoing Russian-Ukrainian war effort, with Russia having retained significant advantages by deploying a much wider range of aircraft and in much greater numbers, initially through heavy reliance on procurements from Iran. The Geran-2, an Iranian design produced and modernised under license, in late 2025 demonstrated a new capability to strike dynamic moving targets near the frontlines, with their dynamically seek out both stationary and moving targets inside Ukrainian territory has been pointed to by analysts as a potential game changer.

The quality of German armaments delivered to Ukraine has consistently been called into question, with a notable example being Germany’s most capable self-propelled artillery system the PzH 2000, which widespread criticism after its first high intensity combat tests. German media outlet Der Spiegel reported just a month after the first deliveries to Ukraine in 2022 that the howitzers were showing significant signs of “wear and tear,” and breaking down rapidly, forcing the Ukrainian Army to rely more on its artillery acquired from other sources, such as the much more dependable M777 howitzers provided by the United States. Only Italian artillery systems proved to be significantly less reliable than those supplied by Germany. The system’s underperformance was far from isolated, with German-supplied Leopard 2A6 main battle tanks similarly performing far more poorly than Western sources had projected, and quickly taking extreme losses.

 

[Sanchez]

Kaan as a project is not in a state to be shared with other countries for joint development. To open this up, all the development milestones and future tech for Kaan B0, B10 and B20 are already set in stone. There is no tech to be worked on from beginning for Kaan, no tech we need from someone else. Only "tech" being sough after are the F110 engines for the B10; that's it. Rest are to be Turkish. Development of some things can be distributed among other companies, but Turkey still retains the IP for whole aircraft.

If any country wants to be part of Kaan as a customer or as a building partner, agreements can be made. Joint development is not part of it; and except the engine, there's no roadblock any country can put ahead of Kaan's development or production.

 

[mehmed beg]

Maybe, once upon time Germany was technologically leading nation . I don't think that they are even close to Britain and France today.
Germany doesn't need to maintain the nuclear deterrent, no?
How complex is to design and produce M54 ICBM? To build ballistic missiles and attack missiles submarines? Satellites? Aircraft carriers? Nuclear reactors? Naval aviation airing? Etc.
Once upon time, Germans had completely different mentality. It is conquered and dismantled nation.
They had a better flying demonstrator then F117 , fantastic stealth training jet design and jump jet etc, no?
Nowadays, whatever requires the real brain, comes from Israel or USA? air defence? Etc? To invest in such stupid project like EuroDrone and then decide to buy American sea patrol drone???? Does someone honestly think that free nation would make such a move?
I don't think that PHZ self propelled howitzer is that good, at least not in practice. I don't think Puma IVF is very reliable platform. I think that German tinkering made NH90 very good helicopter.
I don't think that anything what Turkiye produces is truly inferior to the German products, let alone combat readiness.
They are basically an instrument which is used to dismantle Europe. What Europe has become, I don't truly care what happens to Europe.