TR UAV/UCAV Programs | Anka - series | Kızılelma | TB - series

Agha Sher

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Look, does it look familiar to you? İt is obvious TB-2 project was a gift from Erdoğan to them.


Rediculus. TAI has so far failed to bring it's projects to a mass manufacturing state. Anka, Anka II, Hurkus, T-625 etc., are all produced in low volume or not serial produced at all.

TAI is a R&D organization and they have a really hard time to transform into a serial production organization.

As the days pass by and the circus at TAI becomes more evident, it is clear that Baykar is the only prime Turkish aviation company. I am really worried for Hurjet and KAAN as well.
 

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Rediculus. TAI has so far failed to bring it's projects to a mass manufacturing state. Anka, Anka II, Hurkus, T-625 etc., are all produced in low volume or not serial produced at all.

TAI is a R&D organization and they have a really hard time to transform into a serial production organization.

As the days pass by and the circus at TAI becomes more evident, it is clear that Baykar is the only prime Turkish aviation company. I am really worried for Hurjet and KAAN as well.
Anka should already be 100+ going by tail numbers.
 

Agha Sher

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Anka has been painfully slow. When customers place orders for 4-6 units they need to wait 2-3 years to receive them. Aksungur mass production is even more painful.
Anka should already be 100+ going by tail numbers.
 

Yasar_TR

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This is the gist of the KE news, being discussed here. The date may be current and fresh; but the content appears to be outdated and somewhat open to argument and logically suspect.

KE has not gone beyond prototype stage yet. It needs a hell of a lot of testing before it can be in a position for mass production. Timeline wise this may have happened.
But we should know that with the engine it has performed its initial flight, it is as anaemic as KAAN with f110 engines, if not worse.
It won’t come to it’s own until it has the TF6000 or at least a 5500lbf level thrust AI322F inside that fuselage.

Baykar is definitely more proactive and responsive than TAI. They are a private concern that specialise in UAVs. They need to be turning their investment in to profit as quickly as they can. That is a big advantage.
But even they are subject to time restriction that come with aerospace engineering production.
Akinci performed first flight in early Dec2019 and first production line unit appeared in late May 2021
KE had its first flight in 2022. With Baykar’s speed of development it is due for mass production.
But as pointed out above with that weak engine, it is not clever to introduce it as a product.
Let us look at the specs given on the above news piece:

Bayraktar Kızılelma specs​

  • Türkiye’s first jet engined fighter jet.
  • (Not really a spec and as it is still not in inventory. So not correct)
  • 5 hour flight time
  • (Valid good point)
  • 1500 kg useful payload
  • (Valid point. But should be more with TF6000)
  • 0.6 mach cruise speed
  • (Doesn’t say much. Sustained top speed is also important)
  • 6000 kg MTOW
  • (Valid point. Should be more with TF6000)
  • 35000 ft operational attitude
  • (Too low for such a plane. 45-50000ft should be achievable)
  • 500 Nm operational radius
  • (LOS 150Nm achievable. BLOS with Satcom, it is OK)
  • TCG Andolu type ships STOL capability
  • (Yet to be seen. For future carrier it is feasible)
  • Otonomous take off and landing.
  • (important point)
  • Low Radar Silhouette
  • (Important point. Should be top of the list as a spec)
  • High manoeuvrability.
  • (Important for LOS flight)
  • LOS and BLOS communications capability
  • (Important spec. )
  • High Situational Awareness with AESA radar
  • (Important point - should be higher than last)
These specs seem like fairly old. A higher value max altitude like 45000+ ft and top speed of 0.95 Mach should be part of the real specs of this plane.
This is a real game changer of a plane that we will have. We should have an engine that is commensurate with such a force multiplier. Even an engine like GE-f404 wouldn’t be out of place for this aircraft; if we can get the license production of it.
This plane may well be the real defence against Rafale and V70 F16s until our KAAN is operational. We need a good engine to propel it.

1718985813127.jpeg
 
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fushkee

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I’m still thinking many things about this bird. Ram painting, titanium body, dog fight capabilities, etc.
or else it will treat like shaped Akinci UAV??
 

Kartal1

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Rediculus. TAI has so far failed to bring it's projects to a mass manufacturing state. Anka, Anka II, Hurkus, T-625 etc., are all produced in low volume or not serial produced at all.

TAI is a R&D organization and they have a really hard time to transform into a serial production organization.

As the days pass by and the circus at TAI becomes more evident, it is clear that Baykar is the only prime Turkish aviation company. I am really worried for Hurjet and KAAN as well.
A ridiculous statement...
 

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I mean first block of KE doesn't have to do everything. If it does the same stuff TB2 does but fly faster and carry higher payload, and have higher survivability, that alone is a great capability. Once you add radar with sar and a2a capabilities alongside some a2a missiles, it's gonna be a different beast, several years later.

A bit of the same goes for Anka 3, but that is meant to be much stealthier and have higher endurance, which will make it more strategic.
 

Quasar

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I guess we should accept the fact that future upgrades to Kızılelma is inevitable...hard to talk about a mature or final product... operational KIZILELMA is an entrance to uncharted territory...

concerning the near future for now ı am curious about three issues

-what sort of assets for KIZILELMA will evolve for increasing survivability i.e self protection suits

-current and future Data link capabilties... for instance lets say what connection currently exists between a peace eagle and Kızılelma

-a future air refueiling capability
 

No Name

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Has there been any news of tests of KIZILELMA's AI against human pilots, similar to what the US does to train its AI?
 

Samba

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Has there been any news of tests of KIZILELMA's AI against human pilots, similar to what the US does to train its AI?
I am not sure KE has such capability. Autonomous flight is something different and basic compared to AI piloting.
 

Zafer

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I am not sure KE has such capability. Autonomous flight is something different and basic compared to AI piloting.
Kızılelma of today is to be different from KE to come 4 years later. Every iteration will add new capabilities over the years and at some point it will probably surpass manned planes in many ways.
 

Yasar_TR

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TB3 has surpassed its own previous altitude records by achieving to fly at an altitude of 36310ft at its 55th test flight. TEI’s PD-170 engine is behind the success of this new drone.
It already has been integrated with the latest Aselflir-500 electro-optical sight and targeting system which allows it to have superior “eyesight”.

It has already shown it can take off from ski lifts. The length of runway used during the test has not been released. But if it is to take off from TCG Anadolu, it has to be well under 200metres. (TCG Anadolu’s total length is 232metres. But has a recess at the back and a lift. These shorten usable runway). However it is the landing that is most critical as it has to stop under 150m whilst clearing the lift at the back.
Although I see the use of TB3 from TCG Anadolu as a very difficult job to achieve, it is going to make a big impact in it’s self defence and attacking posture, so much so that it will be a game changer addition to this currently under defended assault ship.
1719479949860.jpeg

 

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Well the good thing is TB3 can fly for a long while so if just a couple can take off, they won't have to land for a long while, simplifying the operation. Less frequent take off and landing, fewer accidents
 

Sanchez

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Well the good thing is TB3 can fly for a long while so if just a couple can take off, they won't have to land for a long while, simplifying the operation. Less frequent take off and landing, fewer accidents
Simply sending out two TB3s to circle around is one thing. Actual sortie generation is another thing, if we’re talking about naval platforms.
 

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