TR UAV/UCAV Programs | Anka - series | Kızılelma | TB - series

[Oublious]

All above posts are positive sides. If I become the devil’s advocate;

Are kamikaze drones really that effective?

Shaheeds in Ukraine have a hit rate of around 10-15%. Majority being shot by cheap gun systems. Only in swarm mode could they be more effective. Russians claim up to 45% success rate on swarm mode, which is a little suspect. In fact unconfirmed reports suggest les than 30% rate.
Nevertheless, it is a fact that in swarm mode these weapons are more survivable and have more success as they can overcome defence systems in great numbers.

In Epic fury US reports 90-95% success rate in downing the Shaheeds.

Shaheeds cost around 20000 to 30000 dollars. It would be interesting to see the price of K2.

It would also be useful if Baykar were designing a K2 derivative with stealth characteristics. Expendable or not, we want these to hit their targets in one way or another without getting shot down.

It does not have to destroy, only make them busy and use ther airdefence stock. Look to Americans they are using now ther stockpiles from Pacifics.

 

[Ripley]

It does not have to destroy, only make them busy and use ther airdefence stock. Look to Americans they are using now ther stockpiles from Pacifics.

Against kamikaze drones or BMs?

 

[Sanchez]

All above posts are positive sides. If I become the devil’s advocate;

Are kamikaze drones really that effective?

Shaheeds in Ukraine have a hit rate of around 10-15%. Majority being shot by cheap gun systems. Only in swarm mode could they be more effective. Russians claim up to 45% success rate on swarm mode, which is a little suspect. In fact unconfirmed reports suggest les than 30% rate.
Nevertheless, it is a fact that in swarm mode these weapons are more survivable and have more success as they can overcome defence systems in great numbers.

In Epic fury US reports 90-95% success rate in downing the Shaheeds.

Shaheeds cost around 20000 to 30000 dollars. It would be interesting to see the price of K2.

It would also be useful if Baykar were designing a K2 derivative with stealth characteristics. Expendable or not, we want these to hit their targets in one way or another without getting shot down.

We shouldn't count things in a vacuum. Same Shaheds also force Ukraine to employ tens of thousands of TDF guys manning otherwise useless posts to wait for and defend against drones coming to cities, sometimes 1000kms away from the frontline.

TAF is a NATO army. If TAF decides to employ these kamikaze drones, attritable drones or one way effectors in meaningful numbers, it will employ them as part of a larger doctrine. TAF doesn't have a total war doctrine in place except for defensive warfare. We won't use them like Russia as terror assets or Iran because we have nothing else to use.

 

[Khagan1923]

Do we have anyone actually working on a Shahed clone for TSK? K2 is nice and all but imo we need our own cheap and expandable Shahed clone.

 

[Huelague]

It won’t be as dirt cheap as Shahed but definitely cheaper than TB2.

T2 seems like a new Turkish attempt at UCAV doctrine catalog.
Not exactly flat out kamikaze while also neither an expensive long range smart weapon such as a cruise missile. A swarm as loitering kamikazes or like @Kaan Azman pointed, with payloads to deploy over targets.

I, personally, don’t really care if we can export or create strategic partnerships or project geopolitical power through arms deals with other nations. For me first and foremost comes the security of Turkey. First we should satisfy safety needs.
Every other concern to me are secondary but will be just great if we can get ‘em

I mean cheap to produce en masse for us. In all military confrontation we can see that quantity has same value as quality. To produce in big numbers, we need money. Money we generate by exports.
Israel vs Iran is the comparison quantity vs quality.

 

[Sanchez]

Do we have anyone actually working on a Shahed clone for TSK? K2 is nice and all but imo we need our own cheap and expandable Shahed clone.

We have multiple drones with similar capabilities; and many of them were used in conflicts, but not by us. TAF is not really interested in them i think so far.

 

[Huelague]

Haluk Bayraktar says price of K2 is "1/50" of conventional military guided munitions with equivalent range. If we assume even at most 4-5 million dolars lets say per tomahawk missile, that means 100-150.000 USD per K2. I would consider under 200.000 USD per unit is cheap, 100.000 usd is dirt cheap

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/2032762475075023141

It seems that K2 has a lower RCS than Shahed-136 with a smaller fuselage, which is more difficult to hit. This could make this more successful than Shahed-136. And who knows, maybe Baykar put some nice features into it, to make it more worth.

 

[Oublious]

Against kamikaze drones or BMs?

Kamikaze drones, look to Sudan. We used several Akinci against Chinese Shorad system. You can use it make your enemy busy and go attack with your Fighter jets after. IT has to be cheap.

 

[Ripley]

Kamikaze drones, look to Sudan. We used several Akinci against Chinese Shorad system. You can use it make your enemy busy and go attack with your Fighter jets after. IT has to be cheap.

I’m confused. US transferring its 6 Patriot batteries from the Pacific to deploy Iran front to shoot down Shahed drones?

 

[Yasar_TR]

It does not have to destroy, only make them busy and use ther airdefence stock. Look to Americans they are using now ther stockpiles from Pacifics.

That is false economy. It s not feasible to shoot thousands of 30thousand dollar Shaheeds with 3 to 4 million dollar AD missile each time. You would soon end up spending billions.

Ukranians use 50 caliber guns fitted on to pickups to bring them down. We have a similar gun based system to overcome these drones. They can be brought down with EW as well.

In Turkish Armed Forces we had an unfilled position for a good loitering and long range munition/UCAV. From what we can see with K2, this hole is going to be filled. But as we are always aspiring to better any other weapon system, attrition rate of K2 has to be minimised. Best way to do that is to get stealth factor in to the equation. Even Iranians are trying to find ways to make their Shaheeds less noisy and smaller. The less they are shot down means the more of them are going through to cause serious damage.