Live Conflict Ukraine-Russia War

[UkroTurk]

Yes... Junk weapons in modern combat. Mobile coffins. I don't want to see Ukrainian soldiers in big, lightly armoured targets like Chieftains.

The DG-160 midget submarine is not considered old technology or technically junk. It is a modern submarine with its own set of capabilities. Here are some details about its sensor and technical capabilities:

- The DG-160 midget submarine is part of the DRASS DG160 series, which continues the legacy of Italian-made midget submarines.
- It has a main pressure hull divided into four parts with separate battery containers, which are bolted together.
- The DG-160 can be armed with up to four 533 mm wire-guided heavy torpedoes, which are already loaded in the launch tubes.
- In terms of sensors, the DG-160 features periscopes with a television camera, HF/HF communication, and GPS antenna. It also has an underwater television camera and obstacle avoidance sonar.
- The submarine has a weight of 160 tons and requires a crew of 9 members. It has a maximum diving depth of 150 meters.

Overall, the DG-160 midget submarine offers modern sensor capabilities and technical features that make it a viable option for various naval operations.


While larger submarines offer certain advantages, there are several reasons why Ukraine might consider purchasing modern DG-160 midget submarines instead of larger 2000-ton submarines:

1. Cost-efficiency: Midget submarines like the DG-160 are generally more affordable to acquire, operate, and maintain compared to larger submarines. This can make them a more cost-effective option for a country like Ukraine with budget constraints.

2. Coastal defense and flexibility: Midget submarines are specifically designed for operations in littoral or coastal regions, where they can navigate shallow waters and engage in close-range operations. This makes them well-suited for defending Ukraine's coastal areas and territorial waters.

3. Agility and stealth: Midget submarines typically have smaller dimensions and lower acoustic signatures, making them more maneuverable and harder to detect. Their smaller size allows them to operate in confined spaces, increasing their survivability in coastal environments.

4. Versatility: Despite their smaller size, modern midget submarines like the DG-160 can still carry a significant payload, including torpedoes, mines, and special operations equipment. This versatility allows them to perform a range of missions, including anti-ship and anti-submarine warfare, intelligence gathering, and special operations deployments.

5. Deterrence and asymmetric warfare: Midget submarines can serve as a deterrent against enemy ships approaching Ukraine's coastal targets. Their presence can create uncertainty and complicate an adversary's operational planning. Additionally, midget submarines can contribute to asymmetric warfare capabilities by conducting covert operations and disrupting enemy activities.

6. Rapid deployment and response: The smaller size of midget submarines allows for easier transportation and deployment. They can be quickly deployed to different regions and respond rapidly to emerging threats or changing operational requirements.



Ukraine could potentially benefit from purchasing these submarines. The advantages that the DG-160 midget submarines could bring to Ukraine include:

Anti-ship and anti-submarine attacks: The DG-160 submarines can carry up to four wire-guided heavy-weight torpedoes with a range of 50 km, enabling Ukraine to effectively engage enemy ships and submarines.
- Mine deployment: The submarines have the capability to deploy mines in shallow waters or harbor mouths, which could help protect Ukraine's naval bases, ports, and strategic locations. Mines can act as a deterrent and impede enemy vessels' movement, increasing Ukraine's defensive capabilities.

 

[Ecderha]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1681620301027606529

-No surprise with ICC arrest warrant awaiting putin
-Also putin do not obey anymore grain deal. This will lead to many African state to feel in short time the hunger.

That is why putin can NOT go there. He will be killed or arrested and send to Hague International Court of Justice.
More and more governments around of world are becoming fed up with evil thug putin.
He keep disobeying international laws and he think that they are not applicable on him.
Time is ticking and end is near for putin

 

[Gary]

-Also putin do not obey anymore grain deal. This will lead to many African state to feel in short time the hunger.

I don't think that's the case, Ukraine's grain eventually ended up not in African countries in need but rich European countries.and China.

Forty-five countries received grain shipments from Ukraine under the initiative. Asia saw 46% of the imports, while 40% went to Western Europe, 12% went to Africa and 1% went to Eastern Europe.​

​

https://www.npr.org/2023/07/16/1188004490/ukraine-russia-grain-deal-export-expire-turkey#:~:text=Forty%2Dfive%20countries%20received%20grain,1%25%20went%20to%20Eastern%20Europe.

Guess more show time for Lavrov then...

Lavrov in Jakarta,Indonesia, 13 July 2023

He kinda reminds me of Tariq Aziz lool

 

[Ecderha]

I don't think that's the case, Ukraine's grain eventually ended up not in African countries in need but rich European countries.and China.

Forty-five countries received grain shipments from Ukraine under the initiative. Asia saw 46% of the imports, while 40% went to Western Europe, 12% went to Africa and 1% went to Eastern Europe.​

​

https://www.npr.org/2023/07/16/1188004490/ukraine-russia-grain-deal-export-expire-turkey#:~:text=Forty%2Dfive%20countries%20received%20grain,1%25%20went%20to%20Eastern%20Europe.

Guess more show time for Lavrov then...

Lavrov in Jakarta,Indonesia, 13 July 2023

He kinda reminds me of Tariq Aziz lool

I think you missing the main thing here.

All this grain is transported by ships to around of the world.
We talking about thousand and thousand tonnes. Many, many ships many, many months of NON stop transportation.
We talking about ship flotilla which were used and still used because this is The Only Way to keep up.

So when I say evil tug putin is out of grain deal. It means that those ships can Not enter or Exit Ukraine port with grains.
It means that putin went mad and does not obey all above countries.
Also Africa and some Asia countries do NOT have other option. If grain flow is disrupted it immediately hit them.

There are only BAD option for putin
I will try to give you a FACT. Last year when Lavrov went to Jakarta to blackmail and Try to apply force a new deal with all affected counties. Effect which happened immediately on Lavrov visit is that he was put on state " Persona non grata".
It means say to putin that if he disrupt grain flow there will be no russia relations with all asia. They will make sure that russia is punished

 

[Relic]

Source ?

They always are, but I've yet to see them sell assets like tank when they themselves are in need. On the contrary, Pakistan has a habit of buying used weapons even though they have to borrow.

There needs to be a differentiation between selling disposable one use only weapons like Grads munitions and high end combat equipment like tanks. Which Pakistan is outnumbered by its arch enemy India.

The idea, of course, is for the West to buy the Ukrainian T-80Us back at a premium. Cash strapped Pakistan would then have additional funds to buy more VT-4s (or something similar) from the Chinese. They're desperately trying to upgrade their military, but they don't have the cash to do it with.

Again, I'd bet my life that if you called them up and offered them a sweet deal, they'd take it. That's basically what Britain did for their ammunition earlier in the War.

By the way, you asked for a link. Here is three. You're never going to get an official statement from the Pakastani Government ahead of time. That's not how these things work. Everything is back channeled and leaked. They're only confirm it after the deal was made and the transfer completed (which to my knowledge has not happened).

Pakistan risks Russian ire, offers to transfer T-80UD tanks to Ukraine

Pakistan is said to have offered to deliver 44 T-80UD main battle tanks (MBTs) to Ukraine in exchange for Western help.

www.google.com

Pakistan offers to transfer 44 T-80UD tanks to Ukraine in exchange of

According to information published on the Russian social network VK on March 10, 2023, citing Pakistani media reports, Pakistan plans to transfer 44 T-80UD

www.google.com

Pakistan offers to transfer T-80UD tanks to Ukraine

Pakistan has reportedly offered to transfer 44 T-80UD main battle tanks (MBTs) to Ukraine in exchange for aid from Western countries. This move is seen as a way of strengthening its defence ties with…

www.defencetoday.com

 

[Ecderha]

putin soldiers do not care other putin soldiers.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1681470007815860224

 

[Bogeyman]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1681683779054714881

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1681684226574278656

 

[Relic]

The DG-160 midget submarine is not considered old technology or technically junk. It is a modern submarine with its own set of capabilities. Here are some details about its sensor and technical capabilities:

- The DG-160 midget submarine is part of the DRASS DG160 series, which continues the legacy of Italian-made midget submarines.
- It has a main pressure hull divided into four parts with separate battery containers, which are bolted together.
- The DG-160 can be armed with up to four 533 mm wire-guided heavy torpedoes, which are already loaded in the launch tubes.
- In terms of sensors, the DG-160 features periscopes with a television camera, HF/HF communication, and GPS antenna. It also has an underwater television camera and obstacle avoidance sonar.
- The submarine has a weight of 160 tons and requires a crew of 9 members. It has a maximum diving depth of 150 meters.

Overall, the DG-160 midget submarine offers modern sensor capabilities and technical features that make it a viable option for various naval operations.


While larger submarines offer certain advantages, there are several reasons why Ukraine might consider purchasing modern DG-160 midget submarines instead of larger 2000-ton submarines:

1. Cost-efficiency: Midget submarines like the DG-160 are generally more affordable to acquire, operate, and maintain compared to larger submarines. This can make them a more cost-effective option for a country like Ukraine with budget constraints.

2. Coastal defense and flexibility: Midget submarines are specifically designed for operations in littoral or coastal regions, where they can navigate shallow waters and engage in close-range operations. This makes them well-suited for defending Ukraine's coastal areas and territorial waters.

3. Agility and stealth: Midget submarines typically have smaller dimensions and lower acoustic signatures, making them more maneuverable and harder to detect. Their smaller size allows them to operate in confined spaces, increasing their survivability in coastal environments.

4. Versatility: Despite their smaller size, modern midget submarines like the DG-160 can still carry a significant payload, including torpedoes, mines, and special operations equipment. This versatility allows them to perform a range of missions, including anti-ship and anti-submarine warfare, intelligence gathering, and special operations deployments.

5. Deterrence and asymmetric warfare: Midget submarines can serve as a deterrent against enemy ships approaching Ukraine's coastal targets. Their presence can create uncertainty and complicate an adversary's operational planning. Additionally, midget submarines can contribute to asymmetric warfare capabilities by conducting covert operations and disrupting enemy activities.

6. Rapid deployment and response: The smaller size of midget submarines allows for easier transportation and deployment. They can be quickly deployed to different regions and respond rapidly to emerging threats or changing operational requirements.



Ukraine could potentially benefit from purchasing these submarines. The advantages that the DG-160 midget submarines could bring to Ukraine include:

Anti-ship and anti-submarine attacks: The DG-160 submarines can carry up to four wire-guided heavy-weight torpedoes with a range of 50 km, enabling Ukraine to effectively engage enemy ships and submarines.
- Mine deployment: The submarines have the capability to deploy mines in shallow waters or harbor mouths, which could help protect Ukraine's naval bases, ports, and strategic locations. Mines can act as a deterrent and impede enemy vessels' movement, increasing Ukraine's defensive capabilities.

My comment was reference the 60 year old Chieftain MBTs, not the mini subs. Apologies for the confusion.

 

[Relic]

All this is true yes. But this will be a long war and with the current attrition, Chieftains/Khalids may just see action for a final time as well.


That would actually be a nice little list if you have the time.

No inconvenience at all!

1. The United States has more than 5500 M1A1 and M1A2 MBTs. They just retired more than 400 of them from the Marine Corps and plan to put them into storage, likely never to be used again. Thus far the United States has committed 31 M1A1s to Ukraine. Ukrainians are being trained on them in Germany as we speak, with a September delivery schedule expected. Upon completion of that training, the USA could easily double or even triple the number of M1A1s they send to Ukraine in 2023, without sending a single tank that they ever plan to field again in an operational unit.

2. The United States could expedite the shipment of recently stored Marine Corps M1A1 Abrams MBTs to Poland (who has purchased 250 Abrams), in exchange for the Poles sending the rest of their T-72s, PT-91 Twardys and a chunk of their Leopard 2A4s. Send Poland 100 M1A1s (to be upgraded later) and let them send 100 mixed variant MBTs to Ukraine. The USA could do this easily, using tanks that it never plans to take back out of storage.

3. Switzerland is going to sell Germany 25 Leopard 2A4s from its storage. Germany can then backfill their own inventory, while sending 25 additional Leopard 2s to Ukraine. All of Spain, Canada, Poland, Greece, Sweden and Finland can afford to send a few more each as well. Let's call that 50 more Leopard 2s that could be sent almost immediately.

3. A Western country can buy Israel's Merkava 2 and 3 MBTs for Cyprus, in exchange for it's T-80Us being sent to Ukraine. Cyprus has roughly 80 T-80Us in service, as well as 40'ish BMP 3s. There is an easy deal to get done there and Cyprus is known to be interested in the Merkava MBTs.

3. A Western country can buy additional Merkava 2 and 3 MBTs for Morroco, in exchange for them sending their T-72s for upgrade in the Czech Republic, before being sent to Ukraine. Morroco has about 150 T-72s that they bought from Belarus. They'd love to upgrade to the Merkava 3 and get rid of their Soviet made T-72s.

4. Pakistan is in deep financial trouble. They also happened to buy 320 T-80UD MBTs from Ukraine. They'd be willing to sell some of them back at the right price. Ukraine (with help from its backers) could probably buy (per reports) 40-50 back pretty easily, at a premium.

5. Although Ukraine is already set to receive approximately 180 Leopard 1 MBTs, there are several hundred more in storage in Europe. Yes, arms dealers and private companies want more than they're worth given the situation, but they are available. OIP Land Systems has 50-75 Leopard 1 MBTs in storage in Belgium. An Italian company has a further 96 in storage in Italy and negotiations are underway to purchase them. Let's call that another 150 MBTs, bringing the total from 180 to 330 Leopard 1s.

6. Ukraine has somewhere between 200-400 stored T-64 MBTs in storage, all of which are in need of repairs. Ukraine has recently signed an agreement with Germany to ship T-64s to Rheinmetall facilities, where Ukrainian engineers will oversee Germans as they repair / modernize the T-64s for combat use. This program could be easily expedited by signing similar deals with Poland and / or The Czech Republic, who are already revitalizing T-72s and sending them to Ukraine.

That is 700-900 available main battle tanks. Some would require logistics and negotiations to get into Ukrainian hands, but they are there to be had if the political will exists to buy them. 400+ could be sent to Ukraine prior to the end of 2023, with the remainder arriving as they become available throughout 2024.

 

[UkroTurk]

NASAMS and Phoenix Ghost: US announces new $1.3 billion aid package

Biden Administration Announces Additional Security Assistance for Ukraine

The Defense Department announced a new security assistance package to support Ukraine's battlefield needs and underscore unwavering U.S. support.

www.defense.gov

 

[GoatsMilk]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1681683779054714881

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1681684226574278656

in terms of global prices for wheat, how much does it effect the price when Ukraine cannot export it?

 

[UkroTurk]

Air shield needs strengthening​

Today, July 19, was perhaps the biggest Russian attempt to hurt Odessa in all the time of a full-scale war.




In an evening video message to the people of Ukraine on Wednesday, July 19, President Volodymyr Zelensky paid special attention to the shelling of the Odessa region and the elimination of its consequences.



“During the whole day, maximum attention was paid to the elimination of the consequences of the strike of Russian terrorists on Odessa, on the communities in the region, on Chernomorsk ... on our ports ... It was perhaps the biggest attempt by Russia to hurt Odessa in the entire full-scale war Thanks to air defense, to all our defenders of the sky, the consequences of this strike are still less than they could be ... With each such strike, we turn to partners again and again - Ukraine's air shield needs to be strengthened," Zelensky stressed.



The President drew attention to the fact that not only Odessa and the Odessa region suffered from the enemy strike, but also the countries of Africa and Asia, to which grain was supposed to be sent, which is now destroyed by Russian terrorists.



"This terrorist strike proves that their target is not only Ukraine, not only the lives of our people... About a million tons of food was stored in the ports that were attacked today... Exactly the volume that should have been delivered to consumer countries in Africa, in Asia... In the port terminal that suffered the most from Russian terror that night, 60,000 tons of agricultural products were stored, destined for shipment to China... That is, it affects everyone - Russian terror. Everyone in the world should be interested in holding Russia accountable for terror," the President of Ukraine stressed.

 

[Bogeyman]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1681708861311287322

in terms of global prices for wheat, how much does it effect the price when Ukraine cannot export it?

 

[GoatsMilk]

Because i got to imagine the big problem is not so much where Ukrainian wheat goes but rather when its taken off the world market it will inflate the global prices for wheat. When prices increase the poorest regions on earth end up suffering the hardest.

 

[MaciekRS]

"Poland can transfer 20 more MiG-29 fighters to the Armed Forces of Ukraine, - Ukrainian Ambassador to Poland "So far, 10 MiG-29s have been handed over, but it is possible that Poland will hand over the rest - about 20 aircraft of this type, which are still in service," Ukrainian Ambassador to Poland Vasyl Zvarych told Ukrinform in an interview."

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1681706802713329666

The problem is... we dont have 20 more MIGs 29 . There are only about 12 left in Poland

 

[Relic]

Juicy new defense package from USA for Ukraine, in the amount of $1.3 Billion USD. Note that this package comes from USAI, which procures direct from industry, rather than from drawdown authority, which takes items out of exisiting U.S. military stockpiles. As a result, USAI packages take longer to arrive in Ukraine, as many if the items are built / manufactured to order.

The package includes the following...

- 4x Additional NASAMS air defense systems (bringing the total to 14).
- Additional 152mm artillery shells
- Additional TOW missiles
- Phoenix Ghost Kamikaze drones
- Switchblade Kamikaze drones
- Surveillance UAVs
- Precision aerial munitions
- 150x fuel trucks
- 115x tactical towing / hauling vehicles
- 50x tactical equipment recovery vehicles
- Mine clearing equipment
- Port and Harbour security equioment
- Tactical secure communications
- Spare parts, maintenance and support for training

 

[Dmitry]

60,000 tonnes of agricultural products destroyed by Russia's missile strikes on Odesa Oblast on the night of 18-19 July were to be delivered to China.​

60,000 tonnes of agricultural products destroyed by Russian missiles were to be sent to China – Zelenskyy

60,000 tonnes of agricultural products destroyed by Russia’s missile strikes on Odesa Oblast on the night of 18-19 July were to be delivered to China.

www.pravda.com.ua

 

[Relic]

"Poland can transfer 20 more MiG-29 fighters to the Armed Forces of Ukraine, - Ukrainian Ambassador to Poland "So far, 10 MiG-29s have been handed over, but it is possible that Poland will hand over the rest - about 20 aircraft of this type, which are still in service," Ukrainian Ambassador to Poland Vasyl Zvarych told Ukrinform in an interview."

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1681706802713329666

The problem is... we dont have 20 more MIGs 29 . There are only about 12 left in Poland

My thoughts exactly. No way does Poland have 20 functional Mig-29s left. 12 seems about correct, with spare parts in aggregate that might get you close to a couple more.

That said, Poland shouldn't be expected to send their last 12'ish Mig-29s without being backfilled by superior aircraft. There are hundreds of F-16 C/D model aircraft across USA and Europe. 12+ of those aircraft should be sent to Poland (bringing their fleet to around 60), in exchange for them sending their remaining Mig-29s to Ukraine. That will help Poland bulk up its air fleet until its F-35s arrive.

 

[UkroTurk]

The Ambassador of Ukraine assessed whether the Turkish fleet could clash with the Russian ​

Vasily Bodnar noted that Moscow is striving to replace Ukraine in the world markets.

Ukrainian Ambassador to Turkey Vasily Bodnar doubts that Ankara will go into open conflict with the Russian fleet in the Black Sea. The fact is that Ankara is a member of NATO.

The diplomat noted that there is no problem for the Russians to attack on a foreign ship. According to him, since the beginning of the full-scale invasion of the Russian Federation into Ukraine, eight foreign ships have already been attacked upon, but they did not talk about this so as not to conflict with Moscow.

"As for the clash between the Russian and Turkish fleets, this is still wishful thinking. I doubt that Turkey can go into an open armed confrontation with Russia, since this means drawing NATO in. But if the Russian side began such actions, it would simply open a second front for himself," Bodnar said on the air of the telethon.

At the same time, he pointed out that Ankara is trying to extend the "grain deal" and, most likely, can use diplomatic or economic leverage. According to the diplomat, Russia intends to replace Ukraine in the world markets, as well as relieve itself of responsibility, demanding the lifting of certain sanctions.

US reacts to Russian threats to attack ships bound for Ukrainian ports​

The United States responded to the Kremlin's threats against ships heading to the ports of Ukraine

The states are not ready to announce any measures to support these vessels.

The United States is not ready to announce any measures to support ships heading to Ukrainian ports after the Russian Defense Ministry announced that it would consider these ships as carrying military cargo. This happened against the background of the failure of the grain deal by Russia.

This statement was made by White House Press Secretary Karine Jean-Pierre during a briefing. So, in response to a question from journalists about whether the States are considering the possibility of assisting in the movement of ships to Ukrainian ports, she replied that she "has nothing to say about the maritime part."

At the same time, she stressed that the United States will continue to assist Ukraine in the supply of grain to world markets. The White House press secretary also mentioned the allocation of funds to support Ukrainian farmers.

 

[Gary]

60,000 tonnes of agricultural products destroyed by Russia's missile strikes on Odesa Oblast on the night of 18-19 July were to be delivered to China.​

60,000 tonnes of agricultural products destroyed by Russian missiles were to be sent to China – Zelenskyy

60,000 tonnes of agricultural products destroyed by Russia’s missile strikes on Odesa Oblast on the night of 18-19 July were to be delivered to China.

www.pravda.com.ua

China, that poor African country