TR U.S. says potential F-16 sale to Turkey would serve U.S. interests, NATO - letter

[Oublious]

Canada is the next country.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1512062448131473413

 

[what]

Please focus on the topic and not on what some lobbiests are saying.

 

[B.t.N]

In their pathetic small minds, they are managing/balancing the things. We will destroy their balance and Machiavellian schemes.

Hey bro, do not take it personal, and I am definitely not being sarcastic. You certainly have the background, but I am not convinced that we have too many options, nor maneuvers at this point. Not when we depend on US as the source of initial engines for both Hurjet and TFX.

 

[Cabatli_TR]

QUESTION: Turkish Foreign Minister Mevlüt Çavuşoğlu is traveling to the United States on May 18. What will be the main issues in the discussions? Can Turkey be part of the F-35 program again?

MR PRICE: Well, Turkey, of course, is an important NATO Ally. We have had many occasions in recent weeks to consult with our Turkish Allies, including with Foreign Minister Çavuşoğlu. Secretary Blinken regular – regularly discusses a range of issues with him, including, of course, Turkey’s important role in holding Russia to account for its war against the people, the government, the state of Ukraine. I imagine this upcoming opportunity would be an important element as part of that. But together as NATO Allies and important bilateral partners, there are a range of shared interests that we have with our Turkish partners. So this is still a ways away, but I imagine there will be a very full agenda.

When it comes to the F-35 program, we’ve made our concerns with Turkey’s possession of the S-400 system very clear. We do not believe the S-400 system is consistent with the F-35 program.

Department Press Briefing – April 18, 2022 - United States Department of State

2:05 p.m. EDT MR PRICE: Good afternoon. A hearty welcome back to our colleague, Shaun. Missed you. Have a few things at the top, and then we’ll turn to your questions. First, as the White House announced, President Biden will host the leaders of the Association of Southeast Asian Nations, or...

www.state.gov

 

[Heartbang]

QUESTION: Turkish Foreign Minister Mevlüt Çavuşoğlu is traveling to the United States on May 18. What will be the main issues in the discussions? Can Turkey be part of the F-35 program again?

MR PRICE: Well, Turkey, of course, is an important NATO Ally. We have had many occasions in recent weeks to consult with our Turkish Allies, including with Foreign Minister Çavuşoğlu. Secretary Blinken regular – regularly discusses a range of issues with him, including, of course, Turkey’s important role in holding Russia to account for its war against the people, the government, the state of Ukraine. I imagine this upcoming opportunity would be an important element as part of that. But together as NATO Allies and important bilateral partners, there are a range of shared interests that we have with our Turkish partners. So this is still a ways away, but I imagine there will be a very full agenda.

When it comes to the F-35 program, we’ve made our concerns with Turkey’s possession of the S-400 system very clear. We do not believe the S-400 system is consistent with the F-35 program.

Department Press Briefing – April 18, 2022 - United States Department of State

2:05 p.m. EDT MR PRICE: Good afternoon. A hearty welcome back to our colleague, Shaun. Missed you. Have a few things at the top, and then we’ll turn to your questions. First, as the White House announced, President Biden will host the leaders of the Association of Southeast Asian Nations, or...

www.state.gov

i think we should yeet the s400s to azerbaijan and get back into the program just to keep the greeks from getting those f35s. after all, siper is, like, 2 years away tops?

 

[the]

i think we should yeet the s400s to azerbaijan and get back into the program just to keep the greeks from getting those f35s. after all, siper is, like, 2 years away tops?

This would be the best solution to this chronic problem.
However:
1) selling S-400s would require Russia's permission - which is unlikely to be given as S400s in Turkey currently serve their role in dividing NATO.
2) I would imagine that some Senators *cough* Bob Menedez and Co *cough* would object to such a plan not only because, well, providing 5th gen fighters to Turkey would be against the interests of countries he actively lobbies for (Greece & Armenia....). And they would likely mention the possible "data collection" of F-35s via S400 radars, whether this is factual or not idk.
3) If Turkey was somehow allowed back in, it would most definitely not be on the same terms before i.e. not Level 3 partner but merely a nation which the F-35 is exported to like Belgium, Poland, Japan etc.

So unfortunately, it seems highly unlikely to happen - unless some miracle takes place or their are a number of, arguably unfair, compromises on the Turkish side.

 

[Crush716]

I think we should all stop dreaming about rejoining the F-35 program. It is not realistic. That ship has sailed. I also highly doubt we will get the F-16s either

 

[Quasar]

in fact according to GİSBİR i.e General Turkish Shipbuilders’ Association which SEDEF is a member of, there is (still) a plan for odering F 35 B for ANADOLU. a dream? may be yes

ok I know General Turkish Shipbuilders’ Association is not an offical source but they are not an ordinary association either, may be there can be something???

 

[HTurk]

in fact according to GİSBİR i.e General Turkish Shipbuilders’ Association which SEDEF is a member of, there is (still) a plan for odering F 35 B for ANADOLU. a dream? may be yes

ok I know General Turkish Shipbuilders’ Association is not an offical source but they are not an ordinary association either, may be there can be something???

I don't get it. Why can't we just buy the F35B variant which will be stationed most of the time on the ship anyway? The jets wouldn't be in proximity to our S400 system, Turkey would leave the program for good 'voluntarily', the US would have one less issue to worry about, the US-Turkish relationship could be restored, both parties will save face this way. We would focus on MMU and the Greeks could get their F35s without Turkish rejection and threats...

Am I too naive or what's the problem here?

 

[Ecderha]

I think we should all stop dreaming about rejoining the F-35 program. It is not realistic. That ship has sailed. I also highly doubt we will get the F-16s either

Lot of active people back here discussed almost all options which were relevant ......when this issue was at initial stages of campaign of usa hostile plan what they want to do.....We just guessed and hope, but when we keep seeing FACTs which usa DID step by step and they BECOME so many active and OFFICIAL usa FACTS.
Then it become clear and little bit late at that time even Turk officials say openly that they can not do much about usa signal sided hostile deeds.

I understand that we have here 1. people which like to hope and dream to be wannabe usa slaves/puppet ........2 people which are trolls they keep activating this POST and try to start hate conversation between 2 side parties of Turks to laugh on them

The Main REALITY and FACT is Turkiye keep building OWN (ECO system and it become available and prove it self ). There are no other path I mean Turkiye is in FACT one of PIVOTS in global stage. Few months ago Europe countries realized and that Turkiye prove them self that is FACTOR and they start change the behavior which Europe was obeying since 2014 when usa told the to support usa ....


In Present only usa is THE country which DID NOT CHANGED.............They ARE the SOURCE of this HOSTILE PLAN against Turkiye..............and they STILL FOLLOWED.....
ONLY THING which is changed is that usa DO NOT PAY as before on their own media to KEEP news media stream with discussion about how to show Turkiye bad

About F16 - Turkiye showed to usa that they are ready to remove and INSTALL OWN COMPLETE PACKAGE on F-16 .... Legally it is done on F16 block 30

Block 40, 50 ................... is present day issue.......and This is Turkiye main talking with usa............Turkiye now is giving usa option.
1. usa gave green light that they accept and start behave as ally
2. usa do not give green light and keep hostility behave toward Turkiye . Then Turkiye WILL use this as Legally as only option and Turkiye will integrate OWN PACKAGE on their all F-16 fleet


The real TIME moment now is this year 2022 if usa do NOT response this year................Then from 2023 NO MATTER WHAT Turkiye WILL go OWN WAY

 

[Ecderha]

I don't get it. Why can't we just buy the F35B variant which will be stationed most of the time on the ship anyway? The jets wouldn't be in proximity to our S400 system, Turkey would leave the program for good 'voluntarily', the US would have one less issue to worry about, the US-Turkish relationship could be restored, both parties will save face this way. We would focus on MMU and the Greeks could get their F35s without Turkish rejection and threats...

Am I too naive or what's the problem here?

Problem is that usa Politic has Changed .
usa declare with LAW passed by Senate Parliament that Turkiye is HOSTILE country for THEM.

IT is not about S400, it is not about What Turkiye will DO...........usa Planned and start APPLYING this plan from 2014 to push Turkiye back to stay Puppet
Country.................. Turkiye refuse and push back against this nonsense plan at all levels....................usa lost this Battle they FAILED. There are no NEW PLAN for usa there are NO CHANGE also..
usa is stuck now ..............they are arguing what to do.....................
According to this hostile plan usa is on the same mode: I mean usa DO NOT WANT TO GIVE, SHARE, SUPPORT Anything with Turkiye.
Why you do not see this FACT.............IT is on ALL levels Political, Military etc.

usa ONLY talks at moment. There are no any official gathering between Turkiye and usa ....................usa DID this connection is BROKEN.......
"Ball is on usa side they have to make MOVE"
1.Accept that they fail and start back off and accept new reality and try to give something to Turkiye to initiate NEW build up of relations
2.OR they stay stuck and wait and wait and wait until usa own politicians find the way what to do next. But this mean Turkiye is already going ON and the relation is going to be more and more broken even DEEPER

Only Private Companies are SOME sort of Neutral.

 

[Cabatli_TR]

Ben Hodges, former commander of US forces: "I know these words may surprise the Turks but we must admit our mistake.
It was a big mistake to support the YPG with weapons.
It damaged our relationship with Turkey.
Right now, there is a Congress delegation trying to fix our relationship with Turkey."

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1517977800468316161

 

[HTurk]

Former US commander admits mistake in supporting Syria's Kurds

A former US military commander has admitted his country's mistake in supporting the Kurds in Syria against Turkey. Former commander of the US forces Ben Hodges announced in statements to...

www.middleeastmonitor.com

Another source.

 

[Ecderha]

Former US commander admits mistake in supporting Syria's Kurds

A former US military commander has admitted his country's mistake in supporting the Kurds in Syria against Turkey. Former commander of the US forces Ben Hodges announced in statements to...

www.middleeastmonitor.com

Another source.

Please do not make you self stupid...........There were so many...........many...........many..........diplomatic shuttles (coming usa officals in Turkiye and Turk officals went to usa back then to discus all Issues and What strategy to be used).................

FACTS
- usa had own plan to screw Turkiye so bad that will make Turkiye to fall for 10-20-30 years
- usa supply PKK/YPG with Intel, Weapons I mean Lot of them,support them, direct them how, when,where. Training, Build infrastructure to centralize war against Turkiye
-usa send big number of CIA team, Military teams for training, supply, to command and control
-usa started one sided BIG Campaign of PAID media to create and fabricate bad news Non stop ( almost 6 years )to show Turkiye bad
- usa supported, applied dozen of various and different terrorist activities .......example priest, journalist, CIA again actively for instigate civilians for civil war.Many of them were caught and showed in news
-usa create and support a COUP
-usa try to build a Material Defense Boarder to protect PKK and de-facto start initial second phase plan to create PKK state
-usa sided with russia ..........All usa controlled bases were given to russians
-usa applied ebmargos
-usa cut Turkiye from political,military,economy gatherings
-usa cut Turkiye from partially when it depend of usa decisions and from other Ally related Intel information Network
-usa SEND OFFICIAL ULTIMATUM DECLARATION DOCUMENT that IF Turkiye do NOT OBEY usa may initiate partial WAR against Turkiye. This never was DONE.
it was big surprise for ALL NATO allies even. This showed that usa is 100% hostile intentions and this was FINAL STEP for Turkiye to stop any Diplomacy with usa that this can be some how resolve

I can continue with FACTS.............But you should understand it.........

Important Thing is that initial Crucial time Years when Turkiye was IN REAL RISK to LOSS PASSED......................Turkiye is in SO CALLED MID TIME FRAME of above Already happened hostile usa plan ..........In Present usa know that THEY LOST Turkiye.................What ever they say DO NOT CHANGE ANYTHING for Turkiye

There are usa Offical documents SIGNED by president and parlament . They represent REAL LAW and international STATE against Turkiye .... those document are Still ACTIVE.
There are international ISSUE related to usa ROBBERY against Turkiye. There are NATO related Military clauses which usa Break one sided Brutally against Turkiye
This Issues CAN NOT be Ignored by Turkiye............

in usa there are discussion how to fix this........usa screw themself and I do not see how they gonna REPAY to Turkiye. There are so many losses which Turkiye took because of usa Hostile plan............

 

[Ecderha]

Ben Hodges, former commander of US forces: "I know these words may surprise the Turks but we must admit our mistake.
It was a big mistake to support the YPG with weapons.
It damaged our relationship with Turkey.
Right now, there is a Congress delegation trying to fix our relationship with Turkey."

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1517977800468316161

"fix our relationship with Turkey"..............I do not see how this continued 10+ hostile actions CAN be FIX it

I will quote General Hulusi Akar "Cin şişeden çıktı" = Gin came out of the bottle

usa MUST understand and ACCEPT new reality about What Turkiye is NOW.
usa MUST remove all officially taken/signed active Hostile LAWS against Turkiye
usa MUST start REPAYMENT steps and discuss with Turkiye how Turkiye want this to be done
Than usa can start new beginning build up of relation with Turkiye
Let me also add Important thing here no MATTER WHAT usa Destroyed EPIC ally relationship with Turkiye..........I will SAY that IT is GONE........... usa WILL NOT ABLE TO bring back this so good relationship which it have with Turkiye for next 2 generations...............usa screw them self

 

[Cabatli_TR]

Congress signals openness to Turkey F-16 sale amid Ukraine cooperation

WASHINGTON — Turkey’s 2017 purchase of Russia’s S-400 missile defense system notoriously turned it into a pariah on Capitol Hill, prompting Congress to lead the way in kicking Ankara of the F-35 stealth fighter jet program.

But Turkey’s support for Ukraine, most notably via the export of armed drones and diplomacy with Russia, has presented Ankara with an opportunity to bolster its tarnished image in Congress. If it plays its cards right, the NATO ally could convince Congress to allow a roughly $6 billion purchase of 40 Block 70 F-16 fighter jets and approximately 80 modernization kits from Lockheed Martin to upgrade its existing fleet.

Several key lawmakers who proved instrumental in expelling Turkey from the F-35 program have cautiously signaled to Defense News that they may be inclined to allow Ankara to purchase the F-16s after the Biden administration suggested that such a sale could serve NATO and U.S. security interests.

Still, Congress wields considerable power in blocking potential arms sales and lawmakers made clear that an F-16 transfer would be contingent on Turkey continuing to support Ukraine even as it tries to strike a tricky balance in its relationship with both the United States and Russia amid a myriad of other regional disputes.

“We need to talk and work with Turkey and others that are working with us against Russia,” House Foreign Affairs Committee Chairman Gregory Meeks, D-N.Y., told Defense News. “They’ve shown some movements in the right direction. There’s other things that we still need to work with Turkey, certain things that still irritate us at times.”

Meeks did not assume chairmanship of the Foreign Affairs Committee – a position that allows him to block arms sales – until 2021, well after Congress first codified Turkey’s expulsion from the F-35 program in the 2019 government funding bill.

Other Democrats and Republicans who fought tooth and nail to legislate Turkey out of the program have also signaled that they would not use their power to block a potential F-16 sale.

“I’ve talked to several of the parties involved in this,” Sen. James Risch, R-Idaho, the ranking member of the Foreign Relations Committee, told Defense News. “The Turks have made a credible argument for why they should get the F-16s.”

“I’m positively disposed in that direction, but I’m not completely there yet,” he added.

Turkey has steadily maintained a fleet of the older F-16s since the 1980s as Ankara seeks an upgrade.

Risch also emphasized that the F-16s are “a different case” than allowing Turkey to receive the F-35s.

Washington blocked the transfer of the advanced F-35 fighter jets to its NATO ally out of fear that the S-400′s powerful radar system would allow Russia to spy on the state-of-the-art aircraft, thereby compromising the technology.

The S-400 purchase also prompted the United States to sanction Turkey’s military procurement agency in 2020, as required under a Russia sanctions law. But President Recep Tayyip Erdogan has sought a détente with its NATO allies in recent years.

The office of Rep. Mike McCaul, R-Texas, the ranking member of the House Foreign Affairs Committee, told Defense News: “We expect Turkey to continue standing with its NATO allies who are in lockstep in supporting Ukraine as it defends its homeland.”

“The war in Ukraine is not over,” McCaul’s office said. “We expect that should the administration seek congressional authorization for this sale, Turkey will still be playing a constructive role in the conflict, but also addressing concerns over Turkey’s role in other global conflicts.”

At home, Erdogan has framed his push for the F-16 sale as potential compensation for Turkey’s sunk investments following its expulsion from the F-35 co-production program. And he pushed Biden on the sale during a meeting last October.

Congress signals openness to Turkey F-16 sale amid Ukraine cooperation

Several key lawmakers who proved instrumental in expelling Turkey from the F-35 program have cautiously signaled to Defense News that they may be inclined to allow Ankara to purchase F-16s.

www.defensenews.com

 

[Cabatli_TR]

If this sale is approved, the likely fleet structure will be as follows.

Current fleet:
- ~165 CCIP
- 29 Block50+ (13C, 16D variants)
- 35 F16 Block30

New fleet:
- 80 F16 Block-70 Upgrade kits for -I think- 67 CCIP C variant and 13 Block-50+ C variant
- 40 F16 Block-70 new production
- 16 Block-50+ D variant (Özgür (?))
- 98 CCIP (Özgür (?))
- 35 Block 30 (Özgür upgrade process)
‐--------------

- 120 Block 70 with APG-83 AESA + AMRAAM
- 35 + 98(?) + 16(?) Block Özgür with Aselsan AESA + Gökhan + Akbaba (If allowed by manufacturer and US)

 

[TheInsider]

I'm against this F-16 deal. Look at what happened to the T-70 deal. 10 years and still nothing. We could have developed our own BlackHawk with the effort we spent on that project. F-16 project will see delays the US will threaten us at every corner, the US can just stop the project at any moment because it is an FMS deal. The US can't be trusted, we shouldn't let our future be dependent on them.

Here is my plan.

Continue operating F-4s as a bomb truck and assign heavy ground bombing roles to them.
40 F-16s for SEAD/DEAD, all other F-16s should be assigned to air superiority and interception missions.
UAVs for the light bombing, CAS, Patrol, precision strike, SEAD&DEAD, and recon missions.
Continue the Özgür project and eventually upgrade all F-16s under the Özgür program. Fully qualify the first F-16 block 30 Özgür with national AESA radar before 2024, block 40 Özgür with national AESA radar before 2025 and block 50 before 2026. Upgrade 4 F-16s per month. Finish the upgrade program in 2028.
Accept the first MIUS into the inventory in 2025.
Increase the ordered amount of Hisar-O+/Siper systems.
Double down on both land and airborne (manned+unmanned) EW systems and EW pods.
Introduce the unmanned AWACS concept.
Increase the number of long-range missiles (cruise, ballistic, ramjet) and bombs. Continue adding new capabilities like hitting a warship with a winged guidance kit that has INS/GPS+laser guidance while TB2 or DIHA paints the target.
Order a huge amount of state-of-the-art kamikaze UAVs that have image processing, target recognition, AI, and swarm capabilities.
Order huge amounts of national A-A missiles.

 

[TheInsider]

@Stimpy75 why do you laugh at every post? I see nothing to laugh about. Stop the trolling.

 

[Stimpy75]

because of your weeb signature....i can't take u for real with such a cringe signature,every time i see it i see a guy in a maiden costume, holding two fingers at his eye and givin a smile......
thx a lot for deleting it