TR Air Defence Programs

[Huelague]

If 15 Tuzla class YTKBs had 4 AESA Plates from BURÇ or GÜRZ , they would be real gap closer over shores against Cruise missiles and UAVs. For sure the TUZLA CLASS should also need LEVENT or SUNGURs.

View attachment 59796
AESA radars of BURÇ seem more compact, practical and cheaper than GÜRZ.
İ-Class frigate has huge, powerful rotating D-Band radar so Burç's compact AESA radar could enable to switch off CENK-S while securing point defense. I am opposite of rotating two MAR-Ds in I-Class

View attachment 59797

I would put AESA radars of GÜRZ onto Ada class since Corvettes have PESA rotating radar.

Is the Gatling a good choice?

 

[UkroTurk]

Is the Gatling a good choice?

For what exactly?
BTW Our Army knows Very well their job.

 

[Huelague]

For what exactly?
BTW Our Army knows Very well their job.

On Burc System. It’s not our Army who developed this system. Don’t you think a single barrel canon would be better?

 

[UkroTurk]

On Burc System. It’s not our Army who developed this system. Don’t you think a single barrel canon would be better?

This triple barrel Gatling gun must be from ATAK helis. One cannon for multiple platforms however single barrel auto cannon would be more effective against cheap UAVs?

 

[uçuyorum]

This triple barrel Gatling gun must be from ATAK helis. One cannon for multiple platforms however single barrel auto cannon would be more effective against cheap UAVs?

That 3 barrel gatling is 20mm, a single barrel 20mm would have very low firerate like 300-400 rpm. M197 is 750-1500 rpm. 6 barrel M61 is 6000 rpm.

 

[Radko]

@Anmdt I know that I've asked this billion times before but after all of this İDEF and information fuzz, can you re-enlighten us on the issue of MİDLAS and quadpacking, will we ever be able to see a long range (80+km) air defence missile quadpacked into the system?

 

[Sanchez]

That 3 barrel gatling is 20mm, a single barrel 20mm would have very low firerate like 300-400 rpm. M197 is 750-1500 rpm. 6 barrel M61 is 6000 rpm.

M197 is certainly not rated for anti air role as it was devised. I'd like to see some actual fire tests with multiple high speed drones before I give my thoughts on it. We only saw one test, at night, firing at nothing.

 

[Osman]

It might be interesting to be able to launch cirit (or a new version like cirit er) too from burç launcher. With its gatling gun. A multi role concept

 

[UkroTurk]

It might be interesting to be able to launch cirit (or a new version like cirit er) too from burç launcher. With its gatling gun. A multi role concept

Cirit's? No CIWS is fine!

 

[TheInsider]

If 15 Tuzla class YTKBs had 4 AESA Plates from BURÇ or GÜRZ , they would be real gap closer over shores against Cruise missiles and UAVs. For sure the TUZLA CLASS should also need LEVENT or SUNGURs.

View attachment 59796
AESA radars of BURÇ seem more compact, practical and cheaper than GÜRZ.
İ-Class frigate has huge, powerful rotating D-Band radar so Burç's compact AESA radar could enable to switch off CENK-D while securing point defense. I am opposite of rotating two MAR-Ds in I-Class

View attachment 59797

I would put AESA radars of GÜRZ onto Ada class since Corvettes have just PESA rotating radar.

İ-Class frigate has huge, powerful rotating D-Band radar so Burç's compact AESA radar could enable to switch off CENK-D while securing point defense. I am opposite of rotating two MAR-Ds in I-Class

S-Band, Cenk-S.

 

[Anmdt]

@Anmdt I know that I've asked this billion times before but after all of this İDEF and information fuzz, can you re-enlighten us on the issue of MİDLAS and quadpacking, will we ever be able to see a long range (80+km) air defence missile quadpacked into the system?

Siper Block - 1 was expected. But first comer is Hisar - D and then quad-packed version.

 

[Huelague]

About the different air defense systems


At the 16th International Defense Industry Fair (IDEF 2023) in Istanbul, ASELSAN, a defense company affiliated with the Turkish Armed Forces Foundation (TSKGV), held a launch ceremony for four new air defense products. The ceremony was attended by Turkish Defense Industry President Prof. Dr. Haluk Görgün, ASELSAN General Manager Ahmet Akyol, TÜBİTAK SAGE President Gürcan Okumuş, and ASELSAN board members.

The first of the products unveiled by the company was the GÜRZ Hybrid Air Defense System. The company’s first product was the GÜRZ Hybrid Air Defense System. GÜRZ, according to Aselsan, is an innovative air and missile defense system with multiple interceptors against very low and low altitude air threats. This new Air and Missile Defense System will protect both fixed facilities and in-transit convoys from threats such as UAVs, helicopters, and airborne munitions. Mounted on an 8×8 armored wheeled platform, GÜRZ consists of components such as a 35-millimeter air defense gun, 8 low altitude air defense missiles, 4 active electronically scanned array (AESA) search radars, a fire control radar, electro-optical sensors, and data link.

Another product unveiled for the first time was the air defense system GÖKSUR, produced for naval platforms. Developed as the equivalent of the US-made RIM-116 RAM System in Turkish Navy Ada class corvettes, GÖKSUR is a short-range, close-range air defense system. Three different configurations will be offered to adapt to changing threat conditions due to the modular design of this new system, which will be able to detect and neutralize various threats such as anti-ship missiles, unmanned aerial vehicles, cruise missiles, aircraft, and helicopters. The system will employ 12 IIR guided BOZDOĞAN-DH missiles developed by the Defense Industry Research and Development Institute of the Scientific and Technological Research Council of Turkey (TÜBİTAK-SAGE) as interceptor missiles. The GÖKSUR Close Air Defense Missile System, according to the company, has a number of features, including 360-degree threat destruction capability, the ability to intercept multiple targets, standalone and/or platform integrated operation, intermediate guidance with data link, and high single launch interception possibility.

The GÖKSUR Close-Range Air Defense Missile System developed by Aselsan / From Aselsan
The GÖKBERK Mobile Laser Weapon System is another of ASELSAN’s new solutions that will contribute to Turkey’s air defense. The GÖKBERK Mobile Laser Weapon System stands out as a weapon system that can search, detect, and track UAVs with radar and electro-optical sensors, as well as physically neutralize threats with a laser weapon with a power of at least 5kW and functionally neutralize them by jamming with the Kangal jammer subsystem. The GÖKBERK weapon system is compatible with all 6×6 wheeled vehicle platforms. Ground and naval platforms, power plants, airports, border posts, headquarters structures, and routes for convoy crossing are planned as the GÖKBERK system’s priority use zones. In the near future, the company also plans to increase the power of current platforms and develop Modular Laser Weapons Towers that will be integrated into air defense systems with distributed architecture.

The GÖKBERK Mobile Laser Weapon System / From Aselsan
The GÖKDEMİR medium altitude air defense system was the last item the company launched in the field of air defense. The GÖKDEMİR Launch System mounted on the SEYİT carrier vehicle will be used to launch the GÖKDOĞAN missile, which was developed by TÜBİTAK-SAGE and updated in accordance with air defense requirements, during air and missile defense missions against threats from aircraft, unmanned aerial vehicles, helicopters, cruise and air-to-ground missiles. By integrating with the ASELSAN Fire Control Device, the GÖKDEMİR Launch System successfully completed its first test-fire in June 2022. According to the company, GÖKDEMİR, which can be prepared and deployed in a very short amount of time, has features such as 360-degree threat neutralization capability with its rotating turret structure, multiple engagement and sequential firing, intermediate stage guidance with data link, missile loading platform and crane system, multi-use canister, and wired/wireless communication.

The GÖKDEMİR Medium Altitude Air Defense System / From Aselsan
In a statement on the subject, Turkish Defense Industry President Görgün congratulated all ASELSAN employees who contributed to the development of air defense systems, saying, “Air defense systems are one of the priority issues in the whole world. We have made significant progress in air defense in recent years… We have developed products in every layer of layered air defense systems. As you are aware, our SİPER test-fires continue to go well. Hopefully, they will be accepted this year. Each project today has been developed to meet the need for different platforms of the layered air defense system. While enjoying the advantage of having these systems as a country, our support to friendly and allied countries will continue.”

Aselsan Unveils Four New Air Defense Systems For The First Time At IDEF 2023

ASELSAN held a launch ceremony for four new air defense products at the 16th International Defense Industry Fair (IDEF 2023) in Istanbul.

www.overtdefense.com

 

[DBdev]

About the different air defense systems


At the 16th International Defense Industry Fair (IDEF 2023) in Istanbul, ASELSAN, a defense company affiliated with the Turkish Armed Forces Foundation (TSKGV), held a launch ceremony for four new air defense products. The ceremony was attended by Turkish Defense Industry President Prof. Dr. Haluk Görgün, ASELSAN General Manager Ahmet Akyol, TÜBİTAK SAGE President Gürcan Okumuş, and ASELSAN board members.

The first of the products unveiled by the company was the GÜRZ Hybrid Air Defense System. The company’s first product was the GÜRZ Hybrid Air Defense System. GÜRZ, according to Aselsan, is an innovative air and missile defense system with multiple interceptors against very low and low altitude air threats. This new Air and Missile Defense System will protect both fixed facilities and in-transit convoys from threats such as UAVs, helicopters, and airborne munitions. Mounted on an 8×8 armored wheeled platform, GÜRZ consists of components such as a 35-millimeter air defense gun, 8 low altitude air defense missiles, 4 active electronically scanned array (AESA) search radars, a fire control radar, electro-optical sensors, and data link.

Another product unveiled for the first time was the air defense system GÖKSUR, produced for naval platforms. Developed as the equivalent of the US-made RIM-116 RAM System in Turkish Navy Ada class corvettes, GÖKSUR is a short-range, close-range air defense system. Three different configurations will be offered to adapt to changing threat conditions due to the modular design of this new system, which will be able to detect and neutralize various threats such as anti-ship missiles, unmanned aerial vehicles, cruise missiles, aircraft, and helicopters. The system will employ 12 IIR guided BOZDOĞAN-DH missiles developed by the Defense Industry Research and Development Institute of the Scientific and Technological Research Council of Turkey (TÜBİTAK-SAGE) as interceptor missiles. The GÖKSUR Close Air Defense Missile System, according to the company, has a number of features, including 360-degree threat destruction capability, the ability to intercept multiple targets, standalone and/or platform integrated operation, intermediate guidance with data link, and high single launch interception possibility.

The GÖKSUR Close-Range Air Defense Missile System developed by Aselsan / From Aselsan
The GÖKBERK Mobile Laser Weapon System is another of ASELSAN’s new solutions that will contribute to Turkey’s air defense. The GÖKBERK Mobile Laser Weapon System stands out as a weapon system that can search, detect, and track UAVs with radar and electro-optical sensors, as well as physically neutralize threats with a laser weapon with a power of at least 5kW and functionally neutralize them by jamming with the Kangal jammer subsystem. The GÖKBERK weapon system is compatible with all 6×6 wheeled vehicle platforms. Ground and naval platforms, power plants, airports, border posts, headquarters structures, and routes for convoy crossing are planned as the GÖKBERK system’s priority use zones. In the near future, the company also plans to increase the power of current platforms and develop Modular Laser Weapons Towers that will be integrated into air defense systems with distributed architecture.

The GÖKBERK Mobile Laser Weapon System / From Aselsan
The GÖKDEMİR medium altitude air defense system was the last item the company launched in the field of air defense. The GÖKDEMİR Launch System mounted on the SEYİT carrier vehicle will be used to launch the GÖKDOĞAN missile, which was developed by TÜBİTAK-SAGE and updated in accordance with air defense requirements, during air and missile defense missions against threats from aircraft, unmanned aerial vehicles, helicopters, cruise and air-to-ground missiles. By integrating with the ASELSAN Fire Control Device, the GÖKDEMİR Launch System successfully completed its first test-fire in June 2022. According to the company, GÖKDEMİR, which can be prepared and deployed in a very short amount of time, has features such as 360-degree threat neutralization capability with its rotating turret structure, multiple engagement and sequential firing, intermediate stage guidance with data link, missile loading platform and crane system, multi-use canister, and wired/wireless communication.

The GÖKDEMİR Medium Altitude Air Defense System / From Aselsan
In a statement on the subject, Turkish Defense Industry President Görgün congratulated all ASELSAN employees who contributed to the development of air defense systems, saying, “Air defense systems are one of the priority issues in the whole world. We have made significant progress in air defense in recent years… We have developed products in every layer of layered air defense systems. As you are aware, our SİPER test-fires continue to go well. Hopefully, they will be accepted this year. Each project today has been developed to meet the need for different platforms of the layered air defense system. While enjoying the advantage of having these systems as a country, our support to friendly and allied countries will continue.”

Aselsan Unveils Four New Air Defense Systems For The First Time At IDEF 2023

ASELSAN held a launch ceremony for four new air defense products at the 16th International Defense Industry Fair (IDEF 2023) in Istanbul.

www.overtdefense.com

Does anybody know if Turkish air defense missiles can be launched all at once or not like most Israeli ones against a saturation attack arriving from different directions at the exact same time? I am afraid launch sequence may be too slow like the Turkish MLRS waiting almost 1 second between each rocket.

 

[UkroTurk]

IDEF 2023: Turkish companies unveil RAM-like point defence missile systems - Naval News

At IDEF 2023, Turkish Aselsan and Roketsan unveiled new point defense missile systems called Aselsan Göksur and Roketsan Levent.

www.navalnews.com

 

[Anmdt]

IDEF 2023: Turkish companies unveil RAM-like point defence missile systems - Naval News

At IDEF 2023, Turkish Aselsan and Roketsan unveiled new point defense missile systems called Aselsan Göksur and Roketsan Levent.

www.navalnews.com

This part clarifies the three configurations;

According to company officials, GÖKSUR has three configurations.

• Full variant: The system showcased in the fair. This system will have the capability to work stand-alone and seek and destroy air threats autonomously.
• Medium-sized variant: This variant will not have sensors on it, only missiles, just like the RAM system. In this variant, the number of missiles is expected to be increased, just like the difference between RAM and SeaRAM systems.
• Fixed-location variant: This variant is projected to be fitted to small combatants with weak air defense capabilities, such as fast attacking crafts. In this variant, there will not be a rotating launcher. The missiles will be fired from fixed-angled launchers.

Fixed launchers are sure interesting, might be under consideration for highly maneuverable platforms and 2x at least.
I have heard that Mixed 35mm + Sungur-D/Sungur/Cirit/Others (with a pod) configuration was also considered for small boats with limited space and one-mount point or auxillaries, that rather can be a variant of Goker-D, not Göksur's.

 

[boredaf]

Fixed launchers are sure interesting

Would they limit the engagement of the missiles? I wonder if that mixed system would be something like Aselsan's Atılgan, but with 35mm gun instead 12.7? It could be really great for our smaller boats and maybe even bigger USVs.

 

[Kaan Azman]

My personal views on new AD systems

GÜRZ: I gotta say it perfects the concept of Pantsir. Especially by having a constant 360 degree search-track field and having missiles those don't rely on illumination constantly. Another plus would be ATOM capable 35 mm gun which is more effective against small UAVs.

BURÇ: It aint as sophisticated as others as it is probably meant to be. They most probably intend it to push away modernized Shilkas in 3rd world and ex soviet markets by promoting the full radar coverage.

GÖKDEMİR: More like a NASAMS counterpart with 2 extra missiles and mobility. Gürcan Okumuş stated that they are intending on adding cold vertical launch features akin to CAMM during an interview with Kaner Kurt. I believe it can be a nice support or gap filler to HİSAR A and O with a bit better capacity. Oh well, the provision to use BOZDOĞANs might come in handy against some highly manueverable low altititude threats I guess.

(Rest gonna come later because reasons)

 

[Afif]

GÖKDEMİR: More like a NASAMS counterpart with 2 extra missiles and mobility.

Which extra missiles?

 

[Anmdt]

Would they limit the engagement of the missiles? I wonder if that mixed system would be something like Aselsan's Atılgan, but with 35mm gun instead 12.7? It could be really great for our smaller boats and maybe even bigger USVs.

That needs to be studied. I don't think they necessarily mean angled. The missiles have thrust vectoring, thus it might be a scenario to be applied with cold launch maybe? SAGE works good on the cold launch.

 

[Heartbang]

The way I understood those systems are:

BURÇ: It aint as sophisticated as others as it is probably meant to be. They most probably intend it to push away modernized Shilkas in 3rd world and ex soviet markets by promoting the full radar coverage.

This one's for defending armed vehicle convoys and providing on the move air defense cover for moving mechanized battalions against cheapo drones, MAM-L type munitions etc.

GÜRZ: I gotta say it perfects the concept of Pantsir. Especially by having a constant 360 degree search-track field and having missiles those don't rely on illumination constantly. Another plus would be ATOM capable 35 mm gun which is more effective against small UAVs.

This one's for stationary base/landmark defending, covering the SAM sites against missile swarms, defending command sites etc.