TR Missile & Smart Munition Programs

[Lool]

If some1 can enlighten me
Since when did Turkey have their own national GPS system? I thought only USA and China possessed such capabilities?

Translation:
The most important technology in the missile is that it can find the target with our own navigation system without GPS. National navigation and guidance ability, you cannot get this technology from any country. We no longer talk about range for our missiles. -ROKETSAN General Manager Murat İKİNCİ

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1820358321594880125

 

[Strong AI]

If some1 can enlighten me
Since when did Turkey have their own national GPS system? I thought only USA and China possessed such capabilities?

Translation:
The most important technology in the missile is that it can find the target with our own navigation system without GPS. National navigation and guidance ability, you cannot get this technology from any country. We no longer talk about range for our missiles. -ROKETSAN General Manager Murat İKİNCİ

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1820358321594880125

A Glimpse into Alternative Positioning and Navigation

Alternative Positioning and Navigation (APN) refers to methods and systems used to determine position and guide movement without relying on traditional Global Positioning System (GPS) signals. This becomes essential in environments where GPS signals are weak, jammed, or non-existent. Here are some common APN systems:

• Magnetometers: Measure Earth’s magnetic field to determine orientation.
• Acoustic Systems: Underwater navigation systems such as sonar that use sound waves.
• Dead Reckoning: Estimates position based on known starting position, time, speed, and course.
• inertial Navigation Systems (INS): Uses accelerometers and gyroscopes to estimate position, velocity, and orientation based on motion sensors.

The key is to combine multiple sensors and data sources (sensor fusion) to provide reliable and accurate positioning and navigation, especially in challenging environments where GPS might be unreliable or unavailable.

GPS Denied Navigation: Navigating a World Without GPS

Dead reckoning solutions. GPS Denied Navigation refers to navigating without reliance on GPS signals, often using alternative sensors and...

www.pnisensor.com

And now you can look here:

Roketsan - Navigation Systems

www.roketsan.com.tr

 

[uçuyorum]

A Glimpse into Alternative Positioning and Navigation

Alternative Positioning and Navigation (APN) refers to methods and systems used to determine position and guide movement without relying on traditional Global Positioning System (GPS) signals. This becomes essential in environments where GPS signals are weak, jammed, or non-existent. Here are some common APN systems:

• Magnetometers: Measure Earth’s magnetic field to determine orientation.
• Acoustic Systems: Underwater navigation systems such as sonar that use sound waves.
• Dead Reckoning: Estimates position based on known starting position, time, speed, and course.
• inertial Navigation Systems (INS): Uses accelerometers and gyroscopes to estimate position, velocity, and orientation based on motion sensors.

The key is to combine multiple sensors and data sources (sensor fusion) to provide reliable and accurate positioning and navigation, especially in challenging environments where GPS might be unreliable or unavailable.

GPS Denied Navigation: Navigating a World Without GPS

Dead reckoning solutions. GPS Denied Navigation refers to navigating without reliance on GPS signals, often using alternative sensors and...

www.pnisensor.com

And now you can look here:

Roketsan - Navigation Systems

www.roketsan.com.tr

Problem with a lot of methods like ins and dead reckoning etc. Is errors accumulate, meaning, unless you use another thing to periodically determine your global position, you will keep going off the mark slowly and steadily, which gives you a maximum range before you get lost. Terrain mapping and kalman filters etc can counteract that

 

[Yasar_TR]

If some1 can enlighten me
Since when did Turkey have their own national GPS system? I thought only USA and China possessed such capabilities?

Translation:
The most important technology in the missile is that it can find the target with our own navigation system without GPS. National navigation and guidance ability, you cannot get this technology from any country. We no longer talk about range for our missiles. -ROKETSAN General Manager Murat İKİNCİ

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1820358321594880125

ATMACA Anti-Ship Missile Preps for Serial Production!

ATMACA Anti-Ship Missile has successfully hit its target in an electronic warfare environment scenario comprising Electronic Jamming and GPS Jamming. In accordance with the firing scenario that took p

www.defenceturkey.com

If you read the above news piece, you will see that Atmaca anti ship missile, in 2020, has managed to hit a surface target from considerably high range with perfect accuracy without using GPS. This shows the high level of target acquisition capability Roketsan has achieved with INS.

The star tracker navigation system that Roketsan has , is capable of targeting with high precision during the night, and above 40K altitude during daylight.
They were perfecting the system by adding new algorithms to eliminate inaccuracies caused by vibrations and image distortions due to high dynamic medium in which this system is to be utilised.
Star tracker would be the ideal companion to INS guidance in missiles like Tayfun and Cenk.
He is very bullish with the statement he is making that we no longer need GPS to guide our missiles with high precision.

 

[Oublious]

 

[Huelague]

If some1 can enlighten me
Since when did Turkey have their own national GPS system? I thought only USA and China possessed such capabilities?

Russia and EU also.

 

[zio]

We should have our own GPS systems otherwise these ammunutions could not hit bulls eye

 

[boredaf]

We should have our own GPS systems otherwise these ammunutions could not hit bulls eye

Tolun was previously tested against heavy GPS jamming and still hit its target, video must be around here somewhere.

 

[Kitra]

If some1 can enlighten me
Since when did Turkey have their own national GPS system? I thought only USA and China possessed such capabilities?

Turkey is planning to develop and deploy a smaller version of GPS covering our longitude.

However, no development has started to my knowledge as it requires several other systems before. So it migth take dacades.

 

[Yasar_TR]

TOLUN Small-Diameter Bomb Hits Target on Sea | TURDEF

ASELSAN and TÜBİTAK SAGE's TOLUN small-diameter bomb, dropped from AKINCI UCAV, successfully hit a target on the sea.

turdef.com

Tolun Small diameter bomb with various seeker heads and quad rack Sadak 4T release system, gives the Akinci to precision bomb 4 targets simultaneously and F16s, 8 targets simultaneously.

https://wwwcdn.aselsan.com/api/file/TOLUN_EN.pdf

As it has swing out wings to let it glide to target, it has a range of around 110km, which makes it a stand off weapon. It can also be used against moving targets at sea. It is a comparatively cost effective weapon that can be used against multiple kinds of targets with precision.

 

[boredaf]

TOLUN Small-Diameter Bomb Hits Target on Sea | TURDEF

ASELSAN and TÜBİTAK SAGE's TOLUN small-diameter bomb, dropped from AKINCI UCAV, successfully hit a target on the sea.

turdef.com

Tolun Small diameter bomb with various seeker heads and quad rack Sadak 4T release system, gives the Akinci to precision bomb 4 targets simultaneously and F16s, 8 targets simultaneously.
View attachment 70046

https://wwwcdn.aselsan.com/api/file/TOLUN_EN.pdf

View attachment 70047

As it has swing out wings to let it glide to target, it has a range of around 110km, which makes it a stand off weapon. It can also be used against moving targets at sea. It is a more cost effective weapon that can be used against multiple kinds of targets with precision.

Aselsan also has a double rack for Tolun right? I wonder if Akıncı can also carry that under its wings in addition to quadruple rack under this fuselage.

Edit: I just checked and yes, they do. According to Aselsan, Sadak 2T 388 kg loaded, while 4t weighs 731kg. In theory, Akıncı might be able to carry 8 Tolun, though I don't know if its hard points can carry 400 kg under its wings, or if it can take off with that.

 

[Yasar_TR]

Aselsan also has a double rack for Tolun right? I wonder if Akıncı can also carry that under its wings in addition to quadruple rack under this fuselage.

https://wwwcdn.aselsan.com/api/file/SADAK-2T_ENG.pdf

Sadak 2T (110kg , 388kg fully loaded)
Sadak 4T (175kg , 731kg fully loaded)

Sadak 4T is carried under the belly of Akinci, as it can’t carry that load on wings.
Akinci has around 950kg payload capacity to carry externally. I doubt if it can manage 2 x Sadak 2T on wings as well.

As with different engines, Akinci has different payload capacities. But even with the 2 x PT6 engines giving 2 x 850HP power, it has a maximum of 1500kg payload capacity, 400kg of it being for internal. It has also be remembered that the wing structure can manage lower weight handling than it’s belly.

 

[I_Love_F16]

https://wwwcdn.aselsan.com/api/file/SADAK-2T_ENG.pdf

Sadak 2T (110kg , 388kg fully loaded)
Sadak 4T (175kg , 731kg fully loaded)

Sadak 4T is carried under the belly of Akinci, as it can’t carry that load on wings.
Akinci has around 950kg payload capacity to carry externally. I doubt if it can manage 2 x Sadak 2T on wings as well.

As with different engines, Akinci has different payload capacities. But even with the 2 x PT6 engines giving 2 x 850HP power, it has a maximum of 1500kg payload capacity, 400kg of it being for internal. It has also be remembered that the wing structure can manage lower weight handling than it’s belly.

So a single Tolun weights approximately 113kg, correct ?

 

[Sanchez]

So a single Tolun weights approximately 113kg, correct ?

139kg per the brochure.

https://wwwcdn.aselsan.com/api/file/TOLUN_EN.pdf

 

[boredaf]

https://wwwcdn.aselsan.com/api/file/SADAK-2T_ENG.pdf

Sadak 2T (110kg , 388kg fully loaded)
Sadak 4T (175kg , 731kg fully loaded)

Sadak 4T is carried under the belly of Akinci, as it can’t carry that load on wings.
Akinci has around 950kg payload capacity to carry externally. I doubt if it can manage 2 x Sadak 2T on wings as well.

As with different engines, Akinci has different payload capacities. But even with the 2 x PT6 engines giving 2 x 850HP power, it has a maximum of 1500kg payload capacity, 400kg of it being for internal. It has also be remembered that the wing structure can manage lower weight handling than it’s belly.

I checked the brochure right after I wrote the comment and you're right it would be really hard, if not outright impossible as I didn't think 1500 kg would also include internal load.

 

[Yasar_TR]

139kg per the brochure.

https://wwwcdn.aselsan.com/api/file/TOLUN_EN.pdf

They give all these different weights to confuse us.
In another document it says Tolun’s weight is 135kg.
But in IIR form it says it weighs 120kg.
So since this is a missile under development and progress, one can expect a weight variation of +/- few kg. (Fuel, explosives, seeker type and use of composites all contribute to final weight)

 

[Heartbang]

It can also be used against moving targets at sea.

How so?

 

[Anmdt]

How so?

I think this one would be valid for IIR or, if available IR seeker version.

 

[Sanchez]

I think this one would be valid for IIR or, if available IR seeker version.

Which reminds me, Tolun IIR was first shown and its range was announced in april 2023 and we were told firing tests would start in 2024. We are yet to see any videos for it, which should happen in the following months.

 

[Tornadoss]

Kemankes-2 System Identification Test

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1822924069408236022