TR Air-Force EF Typhoon

[TR_123456]

You missed my point. The essence of the proverb means, “Jack of all trades - an Allrounder Master of none - No expert -followed years later. But overtimes better than master of one - sometimes better than an expert, last additional followed many years later.

What I want to say, sometimes you need an allrounder and sometimes it is better to have an expert.
@TR_123456

Why not both which is what the top airforces have?

 

[Huelague]

Why not both which is what the top airforces have?

exactly.

 

[Saithan]

F16 is an allrounder. But we chose to go with EF because we don't want to be dependent on French whims. The past says it all.

Also given how the battlefield is changing I believe TAF has made their decision, and I'd like to believe it was the case ever since Qatar stationed some of their EF in Konya for training purpose.

So would it be wrong to say or assume that we've gotten at least 10 years training experience with EF thanks to Qatar ?

 

[Yasar_TR]

F16 is an allrounder. But we chose to go with EF because we don't want to be dependent on French whims. The past says it all.

Also given how the battlefield is changing I believe TAF has made their decision, and I'd like to believe it was the case ever since Qatar stationed some of their EF in Konya for training purpose.

So would it be wrong to say or assume that we've gotten at least 10 years training experience with EF thanks to Qatar ?

Bro, I wouldn’t go as far as saying “training”. But definitely, during the Qatari and UK visits over the years to various joint training exercises, a lot of critical information has been passed down to us first hand.
More importantly with the agreement of keeping squadrons of Qatari fighters with up to 36 fighters in Turkiye, and the stationing of 12 Rafale contingent in our bases, have given us insider view and information on what those fighters can do. It also gave us the possibility to weigh the two similar fighters against each other.
Culmination of all of this has resulted in the purchase of 44 Typhoons with another 20 as an option.

 

[Sanchez]

have given us insider view and information on what those fighters can do. It also gave us the possibility to weigh the two similar fighters against each other.

Per public information, our guys' thoughts basically were "we're done for against these with our F-16s, give us new jets or we're dead". New radars are simply that good.

 

[boredaf]

A trilateral summit in Qatar. The Eurofighter fighter jet deal is nearing completion.
A trilateral meeting was held in Qatar regarding the purchase of Eurofighter fighter jets. While the first Eurofighter is expected to arrive in Turkey by the end of February, it has been reported that Turkish pilots have begun training.

The Eurofighter fighter jet procurement process is approaching its final stage.
An important meeting was held in Qatar as part of Turkey’s Eurofighter fighter jet procurement process. The announcement was made by the Ministry of National Defense.
In a written statement, the Ministry said that Air Force Commander General Ziya Cemal Kadıoğlu traveled to Doha, the capital of Qatar.
The statement emphasized that during his visit to Doha, Kadıoğlu participated in a trilateral meeting with the participation of the Qatari and British Air Force Commands.

TRAINING FOR TURKISH PILOTS HAS STARTED
It had previously been announced that Turkey would purchase 12 Eurofighter aircraft from Qatar’s inventory as part of the procurement process. According to the information obtained, after the completion of negotiations, the first Eurofighter is expected to be delivered to Turkey by the end of February. It was also learned that training processes for Turkish pilots on the fighter jets have begun.
Turkey, which had previously signed a contract with the United Kingdom for the purchase of 20 Eurofighter fighter jets, will also purchase 12 Eurofighter aircraft from the inventory of the Royal Air Force of Oman.

Katar'da üçlü zirve. Eurofighter savaş uçağında sona doğru | NTV Haber

Eurofighter savaş uçağı alımına ilişkin Katar'da üçlü bir toplantı yapıldı. İlk Eurofighter'ın Şubat ayı sonuna kadar Türkiye'ye gelmesi beklenirken Türk pilotların eğitime başladığı belirtiliyor.

www.ntv.com.tr

I am still hoping we are going to clear both Qatar and Oman of every Eurofighter they have, before this is over.

 

[Saithan]

Türkiye expects 1st Eurofighter jets by end of February - Türkiye News

Türkiye expects the first Eurofighter Typhoon fighter jets it acquired from Qatar to arrive by the end of February, the Turkish Defense Ministry has announced.

www.hurriyetdailynews.com

 

[Yasar_TR]

Oman fades out, Qatar fades in with 12 more Eurofighters | TURDEF

Türkiye’s Eurofighter Typhoon sourcing plan may shift from Oman to Qatar, as Ankara weighs 12 additional Tranche 3A aircraft to avoid radar modernisation.

turdef.com

It looks like, since Oman has been trying to renegotiate the deal and their planes are of an older and slightly less capable version, Türkiye may be going for all 24 Qatari Typhoons.

Omani Typhoons are Tranche-3A. But need more avionic and technical upgrades to bring them to the same standard of Qatari ones. This will make them more expensive.

 

[Saithan]

Let's see what happens. I imagine that if the price is right we'll still want them. But no one is going to overpay for 2nd hand EF unless we have no option. Maybe we'll do it in return for Hefty arms purchase to even it out. But it'll be after we secure Qatar deal.

 

[Khagan1923]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/2014255200421220616

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/2014259982074511407

UK MoD has awarded BAE Systems a contract for the full production of the ECRS Mk2 AESA for 40 EF.

I think with this we can be sure that the 20+20 that are to be freshly baked will be equipped with the same radar.

 

[uçuyorum]

Let's buy 12 omani as well on the side that would be nice from 44 to 56 EF. They can serve for training and spares

 

[Sanchez]

I think with this we can be sure that the 20+20 that are to be freshly baked will be equipped with the same radar.

How? As I understand these are for the 40 T3s that are currently in service; as RAF still doesn't have new aircraft on order. There's no info on the delivery timetable for them. We hope that it will be 2030, but that's not certain.

Oman fades out, Qatar fades in with 12 more Eurofighters | TURDEF

Türkiye’s Eurofighter Typhoon sourcing plan may shift from Oman to Qatar, as Ankara weighs 12 additional Tranche 3A aircraft to avoid radar modernisation.

turdef.com

It looks like, since Oman has been trying to renegotiate the deal and their planes are of an older and slightly less capable version, Türkiye may be going for all 24 Qatari Typhoons.

Omani Typhoons are Tranche-3A. But need more avionic and technical upgrades to bring them to the same standard of Qatari ones. This will make them more expensive.

Timeline looks interesting on this. Omani T3As with PESA radars wouldn't be anyone's first bet. It was understood that they needed modernization and also Omanis were willing to part with them due to maintenance issues they had.

Now they are playing hardball regarding the details and we are more close to rest of the Qatari ones. But those Qatari ones were always there, and it was always interesting to say the least that after agreeing to release first 12, they entertained keeping only 12 aircraft for themselves? That doesn't make much sense, that's barely a squadron.

Either MoD is basically planning this on the fly, or there's more that we don't know.

 

[Khagan1923]

How? As I understand these are for the 40 T3s that are currently in service; as RAF still doesn't have new aircraft on order. There's no info on the delivery timetable for them. We hope that it will be 2030, but that's not certain.

Why would TAF choose an inferior radar (mk1) if Mk2 is ready towards the end of this decade?

 

[Sanchez]

[/QUOTE]

Why would TAF choose an inferior radar (mk1) if Mk2 is ready towards the end of this decade?

We don't know if it's going to be ready for delivery; we also don't know the procurement details; nothing is guaranteed. Last week we were getting 12 Omani jets, today we don't know if we do.

 

[AlperTunga]

We should

Let's buy 12 omani as well on the side that would be nice from 44 to 56 EF. They can serve for training and spares

We should get them and modernize. There was news on Hürriyet that Israel made a strategic offer to Greece to provide advanced technology in F35 capabilities, EW and missile technology both air defence and ballistic including production help etc. So it is very comprehensive. We need to react and maybe a new thread should be opened on this.

 

[Khagan1923]

We don't know if it's going to be ready for delivery; we also don't know the procurement details; nothing is guaranteed. Last week we were getting 12 Omani jets, today we don't know if we do.

we do though as BAE has been awarded a contract by UK MoD for the the full production of 40 radars. Which will probably be integrated onto the 40 Typhoons of the RAF between 2028-2030. We also know our 20+20 EF will be delivered 2030 onward meaning Mk2 will be most likely the radar they will be delivered with.

Im sorry but I don’t get what you are trying to argue against here. Sometimes it feels like some of you guys just argue against things just to be contrarian.

Also comparing the possible purchase of Omani EF to a signed contract is weird. One was never a done thing and MoD mentioned weeks ago that there are still talks to be held with all parties meanwhile we have a signed contract for 20 EF.

and if there is the possibility of Qatar being okay with handing over all 24 EF in inventory of course it makes sense to go with them as they are the superior and younger planes. Though I would still take the Omani ones if they are willing to part with them for cheap.

 

[Sanchez]

we do though as BAE has been awarded a contract by UK MoD for the the full production of 40 radars. Which will probably be integrated onto the 40 Typhoons of the RAF between 2028-2030. We also know our 20+20 EF will be delivered 2030 onward meaning Mk2 will be most likely the radar they will be delivered with.

Im sorry but I don’t get what you are trying to argue against here. Sometimes it feels like some of you guys just argue against things just to be contrarian.

Also comparing the possible purchase of Omani EF to a signed contract is weird. One was never a done thing and MoD mentioned weeks ago that there are still talks to be held with all parties meanwhile we have a signed contract for 20 EF.

and if there is the possibility of Qatar being okay with handing over all 24 EF in inventory of course it makes sense to go with them as they are the superior and younger planes. Though I would still take the Omani ones if they are willing to part with them for cheap.

We don't know the delivery timeline of Mk2s for RAF T3s. Mk2 is touted as being IOC ready by 2030, not 2028. UK still looks at all this as firstly a jobs program; lengthening the timelines work in their favor. MK2 is in testing, LTE is being studied, Phase 4 is still just a thing that exists but not "real".
"He added that work continues with NETMA and Eurofighter partner nations to ensure that “the international programme scope includes all essential UK features, and that these are prioritised to deliver in time for the RAF to test and field the ECRS Mk2 radar by 2030.”

UK says ECRS Mk2 radar timing depends on Eurofighter work

A series of written parliamentary answers has shed light on the remaining obstacles facing delivery of the Typhoon’s new European Common Radar System Mk2, while also clarifying the pace of procurement and the wider Eurofighter enhancement programme.

ukdefencejournal.org.uk

Turkish EF contract with BAE is also not a done thing. Details are still being worked out; we don't know the specifics, delivery timelines and or specific equipment that will be installed. We don't even know what tranche the Turkish EFs will be built under. There was lots of back and forth with Germany in the last year, it might very well be that Mk1 will be installed on them instead, there's nothing announced, we don't know.

 

[Yasar_TR]

UK deploys Typhoon jets to Qatar in Middle East

The deployment involves 12 Squadron, the joint UK–Qatar Typhoon unit, and is being carried out at the invitation of the Qatari government.

ukdefencejournal.org.uk

UK has stationed a squadron of Typhoon jets in Qatar to help protect Qatari airspace at the invitation of Qatari government. The squadron will take on the responsibility of regularly operating in the region for training, deterrence and assurance activity.
It is interesting that this move has come straight after the meeting between Turkish, Qatari and UK defence officials, where the discussions on remaining 12 Qatari Typhoons to join the first 12 going to Türkiye were held.

This news falls in line with the news of Turdef.

 

[Sanchez]

UK deploys Typhoon jets to Qatar in Middle East

The deployment involves 12 Squadron, the joint UK–Qatar Typhoon unit, and is being carried out at the invitation of the Qatari government.

ukdefencejournal.org.uk

UK has stationed a squadron of Typhoon jets in Qatar to help protect Qatari airspace at the invitation of Qatari government. The squadron will take on the responsibility of regularly operating in the region for training, deterrence and assurance activity.
It is interesting that this move has come straight after the meeting between Turkish, Qatari and UK defence officials, where the discussions on remaining 12 Qatari Typhoons to join the first 12 going to Türkiye were held.

This news falls in line with the news of Turdef.

Knowing RAF, it's probably at most 4 planes from 12th Sq. It can be read vis a vis many things; Iran, more defence coop between two; or even the TurAF/RAF joint training. Turdef piece also mentioned keeping aircraft in Qatar for a while until things are ready in Eskişehir probably so that training can be continued concurrently.

 

[Musti82]

We must buy as many Eurofighters as we can.And as we all aware our 23 billion F16V order is kaput! we must focus our 120 next generation fighter to Eurofighters until TF-X Kaans are available. EF-Airbus users are planning to retire current EF-2K Tranche1 variant, maybe we can buy all available ones and establish 3 fleet (72 pieces) and upgrade them with our local OZGUR package. Since we have agreed to have 24+12 Qatar&Oman's EF2Ks-TR3/3A, buy another 12 TR3A from consortium to complement 2 fleet(48 jets) and order 20+28=48 EF2K Tr-4 for TuAF as well.

We are all aware that US will never deliver any F110 engine so it is obvious we will wait for TF-35000 from TEI. And our upgrade for early 204 F16 Block 30/40/50s are o the way.

The remaining 29 F-16 Block50Ms(CFT=Conformal Fuel Tank, variant) can be reduced to 24 to make one fleet or buy 19 F-16V and upgrade them to F16-V as well (which I am totaly againts)

What we need is 480 strong manned fighter jet fleet to complement our ANKA and Red Apple drones,nothing less before 2030.

The only logical way to do it is increasing EF2000 orders. I am also favor for RF-2K Tr5 to be manufactured at TAI.