Greece Analysis Greece goes arms shopping as Turkey tension rises

[Huelague]

The problem is that both France and Germany consider Greece a "gate keeper" of sorts, a first line of defense against an increasingly resurgent Turkey. They bailed them out before, throughout history, and the rest assured they will do it again.

Therefore, Turkey has to build up its military, economic and geo-strategic capabilities around countering powers like France and Germany... not weak pawns like Greece. Here are some ideas that will make Makron and Merkel apply the breaks on their Greek-backing:

• Recruit from the 3.5 million Turks in Germany to organize riots protesting Germany's anti-Turkey policies
• Provide support to the breakaway Basque, Catalonia, Corsica and other separatists in France
  (like they do to PKK/YPG against Turkey)
• Facilitate more migrant travel into Western Europe (from Libya, Algeria, etc)

The general idea is to make "being anti-Turkish" extremely costly to politicans like Macron, Merkel and Kurz.

More than 4.5 mio Turks live in germany!
What are we waiting for? Organize over social media, culture clubs, mosques..

 

[Glass🚬]

The problem is that both France and Germany consider Greece a "gate keeper" of sorts, a first line of defense against an increasingly resurgent Turkey. They bailed them out before, throughout history, and the rest assured they will do it again.

I dont think so, their financial position is worsening combined with the aging population troughout the giver-countries and the increasing amount of pensioners they will not be in a position again to bail out greece, in fact I believe that Greece in 10 years will face another bigger crisis and this time I dont know how they will manage that because of the reason I listed. Furthermore traditional areas where european economies have dominated like automotive,machinery and pharmaceutical industry are facing competition and this competition will intensify.

The one move Turkey can do is to reposition itself by putting an end to NATO and support Russian ambitions in the east and north of Europe.

 

[Yoyo]

The one move Turkey can do is to reposition itself my putting an end to NATO and support Russian ambitions in the east and north of Europe.

The moment Turkey leaves NATO they would make South Cyprus a member and then it is "game over" for Turkey in the East Med.

 

[Yoyo]

The best way to fight against NATO-members is to be a NATO-member.

 

[Glass🚬]

The moment Turkey leaves NATO they would make South Cyprus a member and then it is "game over" for Turkey in the East Med.

Why? Will they start a war now for south-cyprus?

 

[Glass🚬]

The best way to fight against NATO-members is to be a NATO-member.

By doing so u still give them the luxury of having an intact transatlantic-alliance the main motivation is to create different dynamics and that is by putting an end to NATO and supporting Russian ambitions in Europe, the US made it already clear that their primary foe is China meaning they have little interesting in engaging the Russians (Libya good example) and the Russians made it clear that they are emboldened, Syria,Libya,Ukraine,Georgia soon to be belarus. Now its important to try to shift their motivation to the Baltics and Scandinavia.

The French are also overstretched militarily and are fighting a loosing war and what is left are Italy,Spain and the UK. 3 countries which I dont think would engage in a war with Turkey over cyprus. The rest of NATO and EU are small,irrelevant weak nations with neither soft or hard power.

 

[Vergennes]

According to French sources the second hand Rafales Greece will get are from the F-3O4T variant,that was delivered between 2012 and 2018.

The F-3O4T notably includes among other upgrades the RBE2 AESA radar,improved front sector optronics,improved passive missile approach warning system,new IFF....

 

[Yoyo]

Why? Will they start a war now for south-cyprus?

Not for South Cyprus, but for Israel and the oil/gas resources of the East Med.
What I'm saying is that leaving NATO gains Turkey nothing. But by staying a member, we can control NATO's expansion and policies in our region.
That said, being a NATO member doesn't keep us from improving relations with Russia and the SCO.
I mean, we bought S-400 and NATO couldn't do shit about it, right?
So it is best for Turkey to remain a NATO member, improve Russia relations and try to become independent by continuing to invest in domestic industries.
Balance between East/West serves Turkish interests the most.

 

[Saithan]

By doing so u still give them the luxury of having an intact transatlantic-alliance the main motivation is to create different dynamics and that is by putting an end to NATO and supporting Russian ambitions in Europe, the US made it already clear that their primary foe is China meaning they have little interesting in engaging the Russians (Libya good example) and the Russians made it clear that they are emboldened, Syria,Libya,Georgia soon to be belarus. Now its important to try to shift their motivation to the Baltics and Scandinavia.

The French are also overstretched militarily and are fighting a loosing war and what is left are Italy,Spain and the UK. 3 countries which I dont think would engage in a war with Turkey over cyprus. The rest of NATO and EU are small,irrelevant weak nations with neither soft or hard power.

just as how Turks unite in the face of a common enemy, so will Europe.

I don’t think you live in Europe, otherwise you’d know this. Just as how they’ve united against all muslims , 9/11 just sped up that process with lik 10-20 years.

 

[Yoyo]

According to French sources the second hand Rafales Greece will get are from the F-3O4T variant,that was delivered between 2012 and 2018.

The F-3O4T notably includes among other upgrades the RBE2 AESA radar,improved front sector optronics,improved passive missile approach warning system,new IFF....

I'm sorry if this is a stupid question but is that considered "Rafale M"?

 

[Glass🚬]

Not for South Cyprus, but for Israel and the oil/gas resources of the East Med.
What I'm saying is that leaving NATO gains Turkey nothing. But by staying a member, we can control NATO's expansion and policies in our region.
That said, being a NATO member doesn't keep us from improving relations with Russia and the SCO.
I mean, we bought S-400 and NATO couldn't do shit about it, right?
So it is best for Turkey to remain a NATO member, improve Russia relations and try to become independent by continuing to invest in domestic industries.
Balance between East/West serves Turkish interests the most.

Israel doesnt want a conflict with Turkey, as far as I understand the latest moves from them is to try to paint us as an common enemy for the arabs and jews but such a policy will fail simply because the arab nations will run out of money in a decade- which is already clear and we can simply ignore them when they face certain domestic problems. Being in NATO provides first and foremost security for the weak eastern euros and northern euros if u want weaken that architecture- or even destroy it u will do it by making the alliance irrelevant. These nations have taken this alliance for granted and it is time to put an end to this.

Turkey in the longterm shall be strong and neutral and not bound to another large alliance whether SCO or NATO and Turkey by investing in domestic industries its going towards that direction.

 

[Glass🚬]

just as how Turks unite in the face of a common enemy, so will Europe.

I don’t think you live in Europe, otherwise you’d know this. Just as how they’ve united against all muslims , 9/11 just sped up that process with lik 10-20 years.

The problem is that u live in Denmark where even the left are semi-skinheads and I think I made it clear to u sometime ago that I consider denmark a small,irrelevant and weak state, they have the balls to follow the US into a war but I dont think they will have the balls to fight against Russia or Turkey

We clearly saw how the eu united against a common enemy btw some months ago.

 

[Yoyo]

@Glass I'm not against improving relations with Russia bro. Hell, I even want Turkey to join the SCO. But I want Turkey to remain in NATO because staying a member allows us to control many aspects of that corrupt organization. Leaving it would be a strategic mistake AT THIS POINT IN TIME.

If you think NATO would collapse without Turkey, you're gravely mistaken.
NATO would make S.Cyprus a member and we'd be occupying the land of both an EU and NATO member. They would all bang up on us and best case scenario we'd become Kremlin's slaves.

No, thank you! The smartest play for us is to remain in NATO and that way control its threat level against us. At the same time, we can further improve relations with Russia and China and other potential players, including Egypt, the Assad regime and even Israel. We don't have to become "best friends" or anything. Just open up diplomatic relations and trade and try to bring them to a line more favorable to our national interests.

Like the saying goes. Never try to wage war for something that you can win by deception.

 

[Yoyo]

We clearly saw how the eu united against a common enemy btw some months ago.

How they reacted to COVID-19 isn't how they would react to Muslim Turks militarily threatening their economic interests. Either case, we have to assume the worst and prepare for it.

 

[Ryder]

Let’s not do that.

we need to exert pressure on HAF and need to find ways to stop the Greek Navy / coast guard pushing back refugees.

in a way help refugees get into EU. That will work wonders in itself.

Trust me if the refugees were white and european they would gladly be accepting them already.

 

[Vergennes]

I'm sorry if this is a stupid question but is that considered "Rafale M"?

No question is stupid we are all here to learn.

The Rafale M (M for Marine) is the name given to the carrier based variant of the Rafale.

The Rafale M are actually being upgraded to the F3R standard.


The new Rafale F3-R standard brings new capabilities in the areas of intelligence, communication, engagement and command. If the integration of the Meteor long-range missile and the new generation Talios laser designation pod are the major innovations, other developments (mainly software) translate into a further evolution of the aircraft. The F3-R standard also includes the installation of an Automatic Ground Collision Avoidance System (AGCAS) and various improvements to the RBE2 radar, the Spectra electronic warfare system, the Reco NG pod and the inertial navigation system.


With the F3-R standard, the Rafale Marine will also be equipped with a next-generation air refueling pod, making the aircraft capable of using the laser-guided version of the AASM (Modular Air-Ground Armament).

French Navy Receives 1st Rafale M Fighter Upgraded to F3-R Standard - Naval News

The French Navy (Marine Nationale) took delivery of its first Dassault Rafale M fighter upgraded to the F-3R standard in December 2018. The two major capabilities introduced with the F3-R standard are the arrival of the Meteor BVRAAM missile (coupled with the Rafale's RBE2 AESA radar) and the...

www.navalnews.com

 

[Yoyo]

Ah, that makes sense. Thanks for all the info @Vergennes

 

[Yoyo]

View attachment 1252

Rafale sure makes a beautiful target for various Turkish missiles.

Hisar, SIPER, Gokdogan, S-400...

 

[Nilgiri]

I laughed myself when I posted, it had a Superboy/Austin Powers vibe to it

1) *Gyrates hips in your direction*

2) *spams 100 threads on same thing over and over* *russia/assad stronk!!*

3) *tags same people over and over*

4) *is just a chinese expat student in canada...honestly!..why u so mean?!?!?*

5) *gets rekt/banned*

6) *respawns to the literal second when ban over*

7) *proceed to step 1 and repeat*

@KAL-EL

 

[Ryder]

1) *Gyrates hips in your direction*

2) *spams 100 threads on same thing over and over* *russia/assad stronk!!*

3) *tags same people over and over*

4) *is just a chinese expat student in canada...honestly!..why u so mean?!?!?*

5) *gets rekt/banned*

6) *respawns to the literal second when ban over*

7) *proceed to step 1 and repeat*

@KAL-EL

I hope he does not find this forum.